How a Rebellious Scientist Uncovered the Surprising Truth About Stereotypes

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Post by phildidge on Sun Jun 23, 2019 6:02 pm

At the back of a small room at Coogee Beach, Sydney, I sat watching as a psychologist I had never heard of paced the room gesticulating. His voice was loud. Over six feet tall, his presence was imposing. It was Lee Jussim. He had come to the Sydney Symposium of Social Psychology to talk about left-wing bias in social psychology.

Left-wing bias, he said, was undermining his field. Graduate students were entering the field in order to change the world rather than discover truths.1 Because of this, he said, the field was riddled with flaky research and questionable theories.

Jussim’s talk began with one of the most egregious examples of bias in recent years. He drew the audience’s attention to the paper: “NASA faked the moon landing – therefore (climate) science is a hoax.” The study was led by Stephan Lewandowsky, and published in Psychological Science in 2013. The paper argued that those who believed that the moon landing was a hoax also believed that climate science was a fraud. The abstract stated:

We…show that endorsement of a cluster of conspiracy theories (e.g., that the CIA killed Martin-Luther King or that NASA faked the moon landing) predicts rejection of climate science as well as the rejection of other scientific findings above and beyond commitment to laissez-faire free markets. This provides confirmation of previous suggestions that conspiracist ideation contributes to the rejection of science.

After describing the study and reading the abstract, Jussim paused. Something big was coming.

“But out of 1145 participants, only ten agreed that the moon landing was a hoax!” he said. “Of the study’s participants, 97.8% who thought that climate science was a hoax, did not think that the moon landing also a hoax.”

His fellow psychologists shifted in their seats. Jussim pointed out that the level of obfuscation the authors went to, in order to disguise their actual data, was intense. Statistical techniques appeared to have been chosen that would hide the study’s true results. And it appeared that no peer reviewers, or journal editors, took the time, or went to the effort of scrutinizing the study in a way that was sufficient to identify the bold misrepresentations.


https://quillette.com/2015/12/04/rebellious-scientist-surprising-truth-about-stereotypes/

More to read on the link

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Post by eddie on Mon Jun 24, 2019 8:10 pm

Just because someone believes in one alternate truth (I don’t call them “conspiracies”) doesn’t mean they’ll believe ALL alternate truths.

We should be teaching people to reach their own conclusions.

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Post by phildidge on Mon Jun 24, 2019 8:18 pm

eddie wrote:Just because someone believes in one alternate truth (I don’t call them “conspiracies”) doesn’t mean they’ll believe ALL alternate truths.

We should be teaching people to reach their own conclusions.

How can something be an alternative truth?

I am happy for people to reach their own conclusions, free from bias. Hence read all the literature and evidence on this. Which of course many conspiracy theoriists, sorry Alternative truthers, never actually do. They only view and agree with, what is consistant with their own beliefs. Just as religious people do. Hence most of its is down to faith

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Post by eddie on Mon Jun 24, 2019 8:27 pm

And if they do their own research and come up with their own truth it is still based on their own opinions.
Just because they differ from yours, doesn’t make them any less of a truth to them.
They are many things that used to be called “whackadoodle” in medicine for example, years ago, that are now seeing the light in science as a possible truth.

Only time will tell in many cases and that’s all I can say.

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Post by phildidge on Mon Jun 24, 2019 8:31 pm

eddie wrote:And if they do their own research and come up with their own truth it is still based on their own opinions.
Just because they differ from yours, doesn’t make them any less of a truth to them.
They are many things that used to be called “whackadoodle” in medicine for example, years ago, that are now seeing the light in science as a possible truth.

Only time will tell in many cases and that’s all I can say.

What truth?
How is something based on faith a truth?
Its not based on evidence and thus nobody can know whether it is true. Hence it cannot be claimed as a truth.
Hence its based on faith. You are conflating faith with truth. Too different things One has evidence, the other does not require evidence and is based on simple beliving. So I am sorry, what you just said was nonsense.

What possible things that were claimed wackadoodle in medicine years ago?

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Post by phildidge on Mon Jun 24, 2019 8:40 pm

https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/suffer-the-children/201701/the-historical-origin-alternative-facts

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Post by eddie on Mon Jun 24, 2019 8:44 pm

This is simply just Lee Jussim’s “truth”, is it not? How a Rebellious Scientist Uncovered the Surprising Truth About Stereotypes 2190311264

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Post by phildidge on Mon Jun 24, 2019 8:47 pm

eddie wrote:This is simply just Lee Jussim’s “truth”, is it not? How a Rebellious Scientist Uncovered the Surprising Truth About Stereotypes 2190311264

Did you actually read the article in full?

Yes or no?

Do you even understand what he is saying?

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Post by Ben Reilly on Mon Jun 24, 2019 8:48 pm

Amazon's algorithms showed that people who bought books claiming 9/11 was a cover-up were more likely to buy books claiming things like, school shootings were hoaxed, etc.

To me, it's only logical that people who are willing to question the official narrative about Issue A would be about as willing to question the official narrative about any other issue.

And he did, after all, only reveal one finding from his survey group -- that climate-change deniers more or less accepted that man has landed on the moon. I'd want to see what they believed about 9/11, school shootings, etc.

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Post by phildidge on Mon Jun 24, 2019 8:51 pm

Ben Reilly wrote:Amazon's algorithms showed that people who bought books claiming 9/11 was a cover-up were more likely to buy books claiming things like, school shootings were hoaxed, etc.

To me, it's only logical that people who are willing to question the official narrative about Issue A would be about as willing to question the official narrative about any other issue.

And he did, after all, only reveal one finding from his survey group -- that climate-change deniers more or less accepted that man has landed on the moon. I'd want to see what they believed about 9/11, school shootings, etc.

Yes but this was an important finding to show, because other studies had skewed this to pressent a finding that matched thier bias on this. It means they held a position from the start and made the data look like it supported their stance, when it never actually did.
Now, i agree there is certainly a correlation of people that hold conspiracies, tend to believe many more. Hence its even more important to go into said studies, from an unbiased position. To find an informed understanding

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Post by eddie on Mon Jun 24, 2019 8:53 pm

Perhaps Jessim is stereotyping? How a Rebellious Scientist Uncovered the Surprising Truth About Stereotypes 2190311264

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Post by phildidge on Mon Jun 24, 2019 8:59 pm

So I take it Eddie, the answer to my question was no.

The reality is, and many are finding out ion many studies. That the far left, which Ben does not believe me on. Have taken over many of the social sciences and are skewing information to promote an ideology. Which is not backed by science and we have the new science deniers. Of course many are coming at this from a position to do good, but they are utterly denying science and the data on this. It has gotten so bad, that things like gender ideology, is becoming like a religion. Where anyone that disagres, is basically treated like someone who has originally sinned and is basically cast down.

Thankfully, some people are actually starting to scrutinise many of the studies that have gotten through, ithout any real scruitiny. We might start to see some real proper studies conducted and any poor ones, which have found their way in. To be rightly rubbished as poor

Night

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Post by Maddog on Mon Jun 24, 2019 9:04 pm

Ben Reilly wrote:Amazon's algorithms showed that people who bought books claiming 9/11 was a cover-up were more likely to buy books claiming things like, school shootings were hoaxed, etc.

To me, it's only logical that people who are willing to question the official narrative about Issue A would be about as willing to question the official narrative about any other issue.

And he did, after all, only reveal one finding from his survey group -- that climate-change deniers more or less accepted that man has landed on the moon. I'd want to see what they believed about 9/11, school shootings, etc.

It's one thing when laymen ignore the scientific method, but quite another when "scientist" do.

When scientists do it, we get junk science, and that appears to be a growing problem as politics enters the realm of science.

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Post by phildidge on Mon Jun 24, 2019 9:09 pm

Maddog wrote:
Ben Reilly wrote:Amazon's algorithms showed that people who bought books claiming 9/11 was a cover-up were more likely to buy books claiming things like, school shootings were hoaxed, etc.

To me, it's only logical that people who are willing to question the official narrative about Issue A would be about as willing to question the official narrative about any other issue.

And he did, after all, only reveal one finding from his survey group -- that climate-change deniers more or less accepted that man has landed on the moon. I'd want to see what they believed about 9/11, school shootings, etc.

It's one thing when laymen ignore the scientific method, but quite another when "scientist" do.

When scientists do it, we get junk science, and that appears to be a growing problem as politics enters the realm of science.  

Have a green, as perfectly stated what is wrong.

Laters

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Post by Ben Reilly on Mon Jun 24, 2019 9:17 pm

phildidge wrote:So I take it Eddie, the answer to my question was no.

The reality is, and many are finding out ion many studies. That the far left, which Ben does not believe me on. Have taken over many of the social sciences and are skewing information to promote an ideology. Which is not backed by science and we have the new science deniers. Of course many are coming at this from a position to do good, but they are utterly denying science and the data on this. It has gotten so bad, that things like gender ideology, is becoming like a religion. Where anyone that disagres, is basically treated like someone who has originally sinned and is basically cast down.

Thankfully, some people are actually starting to scrutinise many of the studies that have gotten through, ithout any real scruitiny. We might start to see some real proper studies conducted and any poor ones, which have found their way in. To be rightly rubbished as poor

Night

If anything, the culprit in this case is the peer-review process, which is supposed to make science self-regulating.

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Post by Ben Reilly on Mon Jun 24, 2019 10:00 pm

And looking at the link, it appears the article writer agrees with me.

Peer-review only works when peers actually review and test your work. (Duh.)

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Post by Victorismyhero on Mon Jun 24, 2019 10:50 pm

[quote="phildidge"]
eddie wrote:And if they do their own research and come up with their own truth it is still based on their own opinions.
Just because they differ from yours, doesn’t make them any less of a truth to them.
They are many things that used to be called “whackadoodle” in medicine for example, years ago, that are now seeing the light in science as a possible truth.

Only time will tell in many cases and that’s all I can say.

What truth?
How is something based on faith a truth?
Its not based on evidence and thus nobody can know whether it is true. Hence it cannot be claimed as a truth.
Hence its based on faith. You are conflating faith with truth. Too different things One has evidence, the other does not require evidence and is based on simple beliving. So I am sorry, what you just said was nonsense.

What possible things that were claimed wackadoodle in medicine years ago?[/quote]

The fact that stomach ulcers were in fact, in many cases, caused by bacterial infection with helicobacter pylori, and whose (Aussie) discoverers were ridiculed and ignored for years.........and for which treatment with long term antibiotics is now common place with great success.

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Post by eddie on Mon Jun 24, 2019 10:52 pm

Among many others Vic. It’s all out there.

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Post by 'Wolfie on Tue Jun 25, 2019 2:48 am

eddie wrote:Just because someone believes in one alternate truth (I don’t call them “conspiracies”) doesn’t mean they’ll believe ALL alternate truths.

We should be teaching people to reach their own conclusions.

Cool

"Alternate" truths...

That phrase really doesn't make sense..

"Alternate" means to move between two different states -- e.g. up and down, back and forth, in and out, hot and cold, positive and negative. The most common day-to-day use being "alternating current".

'Alternate' does not mean the same as "alternative" !

To use the phrase "alternate truths" means that you believe that you are somehow shifting between two different or opposite truths !!!

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Post by phildidge on Tue Jun 25, 2019 3:10 am

Victorismyhero wrote:

The fact that stomach ulcers were in fact, in many cases, caused by bacterial infection with helicobacter pylori, and whose (Aussie) discoverers were ridiculed and ignored for years.........and for which treatment with long term antibiotics is now common place with great success.
[/quote]

Well the above is a fine example of skewing the actual truth, and exaggerating are you not?

Ridiculed for many years, are you sure or do you want to actually say what really happened?

Please dont try to tell porkies to me Victor, as I will easily uncover the truth

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Helicobacter_pylori#History

So basically there was som initial skeptism. Is that the bases for what eddies, was saying?

Get a grip mate, you are clutching at straws

Try again

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Post by phildidge on Tue Jun 25, 2019 3:11 am

Ben Reilly wrote:
phildidge wrote:So I take it Eddie, the answer to my question was no.

The reality is, and many are finding out ion many studies. That the far left, which Ben does not believe me on. Have taken over many of the social sciences and are skewing information to promote an ideology. Which is not backed by science and we have the new science deniers. Of course many are coming at this from a position to do good, but they are utterly denying science and the data on this. It has gotten so bad, that things like gender ideology, is becoming like a religion. Where anyone that disagres, is basically treated like someone who has originally sinned and is basically cast down.

Thankfully, some people are actually starting to scrutinise many of the studies that have gotten through, ithout any real scruitiny. We might start to see some real proper studies conducted and any poor ones, which have found their way in. To be rightly rubbished as poor

Night

If anything, the culprit in this case is the peer-review process, which is supposed to make science self-regulating.

Who is doing the peer reviewing?

Take your time

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Post by phildidge on Tue Jun 25, 2019 3:13 am

Ben Reilly wrote:And looking at the link, it appears the article writer agrees with me.

Peer-review only works when peers actually review and test your work. (Duh.)

OMG, so funny its embarressing.

When the peer reviewers are biased, what do you think happens?

There is a fine example of this bias, you think Lee agrees, with you. That is hilarious and proves his point in regards to you

https://eu.usatoday.com/story/opinion/voices/2018/10/10/grievance-studies-academia-fake-feminist-hypatia-mein-kampf-racism-column/1575219002/

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Post by eddie on Tue Jun 25, 2019 10:19 pm

WhoseYourWolfie wrote:
eddie wrote:Just because someone believes in one alternate truth (I don’t call them “conspiracies”) doesn’t mean they’ll believe ALL alternate truths.

We should be teaching people to reach their own conclusions.

Cool

"Alternate" truths...

That phrase really doesn't make sense..

"Alternate" means to move between two different states --  e.g. up and down, back and forth, in and out,  hot and cold, positive and negative.  The most common day-to-day use being "alternating current".

'Alternate' does not mean the same as "alternative"  !

To use the phrase "alternate truths"  means that you believe that you are somehow shifting between two different or opposite  truths  !!!

Yes you’re right and yet so am I. Let me explain:

Lots of alternative truth-seekers are also alternate...because they are more open-minded, for one. Unless of course you’re the sort of person who thinks that just because a person who believes in one alternative truth is the exact same as every other alternative truth-seeker, like all Muslims are bombing shitheads, for example?
Let that sink in for a fraction of a second.

Thanks for making me feel far more correct in my meaning! cheers

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Post by phildidge on Wed Jun 26, 2019 12:05 am

eddie wrote:
WhoseYourWolfie wrote:
Cool

"Alternate" truths...

That phrase really doesn't make sense..

"Alternate" means to move between two different states --  e.g. up and down, back and forth, in and out,  hot and cold, positive and negative.  The most common day-to-day use being "alternating current".

'Alternate' does not mean the same as "alternative"  !

To use the phrase "alternate truths"  means that you believe that you are somehow shifting between two different or opposite  truths  !!!

Yes you’re right and yet so am I. Let me explain:

Lots of alternative truth-seekers are also alternate...because they are more open-minded, for one. Unless of course you’re the sort of person who thinks that just because a person who believes in one alternative truth is the exact same as every other alternative truth-seeker, like all Muslims are bombing shitheads, for example?
Let that sink in for a fraction of a second.

Thanks for making me feel far more correct in my meaning! cheers

Translation, creationist alternate views are not based on alternate so called facts, but views based on faith. They are presented as facts, when they are faith based. They certainly are not open minded and the least likely to do so.

Sorry, Eddie, that is the biggest load of waffle I have ever heard

Do you think Quill's views are alternate truths on the grooming gang convictions?

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Post by eddie on Wed Jun 26, 2019 7:58 pm

They are his views and he’s entitled to them. It doesn’t follow that because I disagree with his views on that issue that I think he talks shit about all other issues.

I don’t tend to lump people together. Which is my point.

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Post by phildidge on Wed Jun 26, 2019 8:05 pm

eddie wrote:They are his views and he’s entitled to them. It doesn’t follow that because I disagree with his views on that issue that I think he talks shit about all other issues.

I don’t tend to lump people together. Which is my point.

You are missing the point eddie. Based on what you said above. Quills views on the grooming cases would be alternative truths.

So do you stand by that and back that Quills views on the convictions are alternative truths?

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Post by phildidge on Wed Jun 26, 2019 8:23 pm

You see Eddie, what I am trying to point out to you . Is that you are simple just like everybody else. You make up a methodology above, that when I scrutinse this. It does not hold up to scrutiny, even by your standards. There is no way, based off what you said in the debate with Quill. That you believe his views on the grooming case confictions are alternative truths.

Now you claim to be skeptical of everything and yet here like many and rightly so. We know the truth of the grooming case convictions. I admit I was initially skeptical of so many Pakistani's being involved in these cases years before. Because I mistook the actual truth for as many people did. Racism. I was wrong and openly admit I was wrong on this. The only racism, was what happened to the victims. As their cries and pleas for help were ignored, because many were so wrapped up by PC. That we ended up playing the identity political card, ignoring the victims. I look back at myself and ashamed I was once bought by the media bullshit around this which tried to downplay this all. When we were all on inaflap.

Now the reality is the most skepitical people are actually scientists. They will look for evidence to back claims. They even look to challenge theories. Its what they do all the time, but they never claim an alternative truth. They simple look to either confirm or prove something wrong. Hence science is one of the few fields, that are way more skeptical than you, but actually look at all the evidence. Mainly without a bias. Though that is creeping into science today. You cannot claim for one minute you are a skeptive and also open. If you hold a position on something. That means you have a confirmation bias. As you do with many of your beliefs.

Now I am not knocking you, I am simple being very critical of your claim above. As its completely inconsistant

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Post by eddie on Wed Jun 26, 2019 8:28 pm

I don’t think you’re knocking me, it’s a debate, I understand people think differently without getting frustrated or angry about it.

I don’t know if Quill’s truth is true. I’m not a lawyer and I am not privy to things he knows. Also, his is an OPINION in that particular issue and I haven’t read all of his posts in detail nor looked into his facts.


All I’m saying is, I don’t believe the world is flat, for example, but not because of what someone else says or because academics have written papers on it and done experiments...no, it’s because common sense tells me that rocks aren’t flat.
Simple.

I go by this rule: if it doesn’t make sense it probably isn’t true but I don’t really know anything for sure unless I did the experiment myself or I was there and an eyewitness to whatever the situation may be.

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Post by phildidge on Wed Jun 26, 2019 8:40 pm

eddie wrote:I don’t think you’re knocking me, it’s a debate, I understand people think differently without getting frustrated or angry about it.

I don’t know if Quill’s truth is true. I’m not a lawyer and I am not privy to things he knows. Also, his is an OPINION in that particular issue and I haven’t read all of his posts in detail nor looked into his facts.


All I’m saying is, I don’t believe the world is flat, for example, but not because of what someone else says or because academics have written papers on it and done experiments...no, it’s because common sense tells me that rocks aren’t flat.
Simple.

I go by this rule: if it doesn’t make sense it probably isn’t true but I don’t really know anything for sure unless I did the experiment myself or I was there and an eyewitness to whatever the situation may be.  

You are still avoiding the point eddie. By your reasoning, all views that differ, would have to be alternative truths. That would include Quills position. Which he openly admits to not being interested in the facts of the trial. He openly admits to holding a viw, that some form of prejudice is at play, based solely on what has happen to African Americans in the past. Hence his argument is not even evidence based but a poor claim around what has happened in a different country and in decades before.

So your claim on what does not make sense is based on what Eddie?
How do you form a standard from this to understand whether something is true or not?

For example we both know the earth is not flat, but your methodology, would hold that flat earthers would hold alternative truths.
That is the standard position of your methodology.

We know Quills position is not true, as for one. He has admitted to not reading the cases.
He has made his position based on an emotive view not on the cases, but what has happened elsewhere.
Never making a correlation between the two with evidence

So Quill being a lawyer has little bearing when he admits to not be interesting in the facts. He simple perceives foul play and not based off the many cases, but again what has happened in the US.

So I ask again

Do you think Quill holds alternative truths on the grooming case convictions?

Do flat earthers hold alternative truths?

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Post by eddie on Wed Jun 26, 2019 9:07 pm

Yes to the flat-earthers because they believe their “evidence”.

Quills PoV is a little different as it’s an opinion based on what he believes and he’s going off the beaten path a little anyway so it’s not quite the same as “alternative truths” like the earth is flat, 9/11, Princess Diana’s death etc

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Post by phildidge on Wed Jun 26, 2019 9:20 pm

eddie wrote:Yes to the flat-earthers because they believe their “evidence”.

Quills PoV is a little different as it’s an opinion based on what he believes and he’s going off the beaten path a little anyway so it’s not quite the same as “alternative truths” like the earth is flat, 9/11, Princess Diana’s death etc


You have just contradicted your own methodology Eddie, sorry

Flat Earthers is also opinion based and has no evidence

So I am sorry they both fall into the same category

You claimed they are open minded. In each case, do you think they are being open minded to the evidence against their claims?

The reality is Eddie and again i am sorry, but you and many people are not actually open at all, when they hold beliefs to a point they believe them to be true over facts. I can give an example of 911 so called truthers. That when shown evidence that contradicts their claims. They are certainly not being open to them, you being one of them. That no matter how often I have posted evidence to one point that is made. The moment that is shown to lack evidence or is in fact flawed. Then what happens is people move immediatelly onto the next claim. They never admit, they could be wrong based on the evidence and look to find something else that fits their narrative on this. They avoid admitting to being wrong to the oribinal point. Hence we can all be guilty of not admitting when wrong 

Now you could claim i am not being open about 9/11 conspiracies. Which would be true also, but then every single claim made dopes not hold up to scruitiny, through researching this. Does that mean its impossible for me to be wrong? 

No, but the stack of evidence that refutes the claims and how the 911 truthers continually side track any evidence that does conflict with their claism. Shows that such movements are based like a religious cult. Its more based on faith and not actual evidence. They see and percveive something to be true and never actually are ever open to the possibility they are wrong themselves. I hav always been open to the possibility of being wrong. Its how I once was religious and am no more. Its why i can recognose I was a complete dick, for being taken in by the media using racism abd PC as a view to defend child rapists in the form of grooming gangs. I did not allow myself to be open minded for one reason. Because racists did use the plight of the victims and I was unwilling to listen to the truth that did happen. I should have been able to seperate the two. Seen that racist were using the plight of the victims, but also stand up for nthe victims and champion their cause to find justice

So you have to hold the same position Eddie, based on alternative truths, when people claim them and to be honest the people that claim this (bar you) \are the least open minded people


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Post by eddie on Wed Jun 26, 2019 9:22 pm

I stand alone (mostly) in saying I don’t believe in anything 100% unless I saw it, heard it, smelled it or felt it.

So I cannot say anymore than that didge. Im sorry you don’t understand what I’m trying to say.

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Post by phildidge on Wed Jun 26, 2019 9:25 pm

eddie wrote:I stand alone (mostly) in saying I don’t believe in anything 100% unless I saw it, heard it, smelled it or felt it.

So I cannot say anymore than that didge. Im sorry you don’t understand what I’m trying to say.


Wow.

I understand perfectly what you are trying to say and actually reasoning how you are contracting yourself Eddie. So please do not insult my intelligence. This is what you always do. As if I do not understand you. When you gloss over just about every point I make and claim I do not understand you. Do you not see how really insulting and ignorant that is to claim. Like you are some how superior in thinking? 

Seriously Eddie, for you to think I do not understand what you are saying, is a complete copout

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Post by eddie on Wed Jun 26, 2019 9:44 pm

No I am not trying to say anything or copping out or insulting your intelligence. I don’t do that didge.

I’m just not making myself clear I guess. It’s hard to explain the way I think to others and you keep mentioning Quill and I don’t think he or his opinions are alternative truths, for example. I was more talking about the ones I listed in a post above.

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Post by phildidge on Wed Jun 26, 2019 9:57 pm

eddie wrote:No I am not trying to say anything or copping out or insulting your intelligence. I don’t do that didge.

I’m just not making myself clear I guess. It’s hard to explain the way I think to others and you keep mentioning Quill and I don’t think he or his opinions are alternative truths, for example. I was more talking about the ones I listed in a post above.

Hence your position is not consistant Eddie and whn I question your above methodology. You use a position of me not understanding you. When in reality I do. This is what i am talking about. Your position is based on an arbitrary methodology. Which is based on your own concious thinking. The reality is by you saying I do not understand what you are saying, is questioning my ability to understand what you are saying through intelligence. You may not realise this and its frustrating to hell when you do this eddie.

I mean most scientists would never claim, to someone challenging their beliefs, that they do not understand them. As its a defensive emotive stance to hold. Its actually not being open to the other person in what they do understand. Its you actually holding a view, that only you understand, hence dogmatic.

Do you not understand that?

Hence your view when questioned. Creates you to then deflect by claiming the other person fails to undestand you. It allows you to then be able to throb off any view to be critical to your methodology and position. What I am showing is your position is inconsistant. Its based on your own arbitrary beliefs.

So I am sorry Eddie, to claim you are not making yourself clear, would mean your view point does not hold up to scrutiny. As how can you possible convince people of your claims. When you claim to be unable to reason them yourself?

The reality is Eddie, your views here were inconsistant, based on your original claim about alternate truths. That is how science works

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Post by eddie on Wed Jun 26, 2019 10:01 pm

I don’t try to convince people of my “claims” since I don’t really have any didge. I just explained that I was wrong to say you didn’t understand me yet you wrote a whole paragraph telling me off about it.

I am a person who holds my views on certain things until I’m 100% convinced and the only things I’m really 100% convinced about is that humans shouldn’t be treated badly, that sex should only be consensual and that homosexuality is perfectly healthy and fine and two gay people should be free to love and marry.

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Post by Ben Reilly on Wed Jun 26, 2019 10:02 pm

How a Rebellious Scientist Uncovered the Surprising Truth About Stereotypes A-belief-is-not-merely-an-idea-the-mind-possesses?size=300

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Post by phildidge on Wed Jun 26, 2019 10:14 pm

eddie wrote:I don’t try to convince people of my “claims” since I don’t really have any didge. I just explained that I was wrong to say you didn’t understand me yet you wrote a whole paragraph telling me off about it.

I am a person who holds my views on certain things until I’m 100% convinced and the only things I’m really 100% convinced about is that humans shouldn’t be treated badly, that sex should only be consensual and that homosexuality is perfectly healthy and fine and two gay people should be free to love and marry.

That is fine how you see that Eddie, but originally you made a point on what you regard as alternate truths. That is the point I am questioning.

Sorry eddie, you are no differnet as i am not to everyone else. You are just on a spectrum on whether you are more open minded or not but on other things clearly not as seen. Hence I thought it was a view to challenge your position. Not from a view to attack you, but for a debate.

I would disagree that you do not try to change people, everyone does Eddie. Even me. I know I would like the world to be a better place and that people have well being and equality. You believe in things that you wnat to change and challenge cancer treatments. You know at heart you want to change minds with your views. Everyone does, and I do not deny this, so why do you? Your heart is in the right place like mine, butwhen ever you promote a view. You are trying to convince people. Just like I do

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Post by eddie on Wed Jun 26, 2019 10:27 pm

I may state my views but I do tend to not harbour my point didge. Some people either don’t want to listen to me or have their minds so firmly made up that I know it isn’t worth it.

Anyway, thanks for having a civil debate with me. I do take on board your points as I hope you have mine.

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Post by phildidge on Wed Jun 26, 2019 10:31 pm

eddie wrote:I may state my views but I do tend to not harbour my point didge. Some people either don’t want to listen to me or have their minds so firmly made up that I know it isn’t worth it.

Anyway, thanks for having a civil debate with me. I do take on board your points as I hope you have mine.

Eddie, I spent the whole debate taking on board your views and also not agreeing with them, but expressing why.

If only more people listened to each other and compremised

Thank you also and i always tak on your points, just get a tad fruistarted when you claim I dont understand your point. Yes I may not understand you fully as a person, nobody does with each other until they truely know each other. Yet at least here we can have civil debate, so thank you

Take care and stay gold

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Post by eddie on Wed Jun 26, 2019 10:34 pm

phildidge wrote:
eddie wrote:I may state my views but I do tend to not harbour my point didge. Some people either don’t want to listen to me or have their minds so firmly made up that I know it isn’t worth it.

Anyway, thanks for having a civil debate with me. I do take on board your points as I hope you have mine.

Eddie, I spent the whole debate taking on board your views and also not agreeing with them, but expressing why.

If only more people listened to each other and compremised

Thank you also and i always tak on your points, just get a tad fruistarted when you claim I dont understand your point. Yes I may not understand you fully as a person, nobody does with each other until they truely know each other. Yet at least here we can have civil debate, so thank you

Take care and stay gold

And you stay gold too. And silver! (I love silver!)
And remember, I’m the girl who eats raw mushrooms....so who am I to judge others? How a Rebellious Scientist Uncovered the Surprising Truth About Stereotypes 3489511464 ::::

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Post by phildidge on Wed Jun 26, 2019 10:38 pm

eddie wrote:
phildidge wrote:

Eddie, I spent the whole debate taking on board your views and also not agreeing with them, but expressing why.

If only more people listened to each other and compremised

Thank you also and i always tak on your points, just get a tad fruistarted when you claim I dont understand your point. Yes I may not understand you fully as a person, nobody does with each other until they truely know each other. Yet at least here we can have civil debate, so thank you

Take care and stay gold

And you stay gold too. And silver! (I love silver!)
And remember, I’m the girl who eats raw mushrooms....so who am I to judge others? How a Rebellious Scientist Uncovered the Surprising Truth About Stereotypes 3489511464 ::::

lol, well I love eating raw broad beans and raw carrots. They do not get me high as magic mushrooms. Hence why am partial to Mushrooms also. Laughing

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Post by eddie on Wed Jun 26, 2019 10:42 pm

Hahahahaha.

And dude? Raw carrots suck! No

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Post by Ben Reilly on Wed Jun 26, 2019 10:43 pm

Raw carrots and raw mushrooms both suck, actually Wink

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Post by phildidge on Wed Jun 26, 2019 10:44 pm

eddie wrote:Hahahahaha.

And dude? Raw carrots suck! No

I dont wear glasses and have perfect vision at 48. Go figure. Laughing

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Post by phildidge on Wed Jun 26, 2019 10:46 pm

Ben Reilly wrote:Raw carrots and raw mushrooms both suck, actually Wink

How about fried mushrooms on cheese on toast mate?

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Post by eddie on Wed Jun 26, 2019 10:50 pm

phildidge wrote:
Ben Reilly wrote:Raw carrots and raw mushrooms both suck, actually Wink

How about fried mushrooms on cheese on toast mate?

Food porn. Cool

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Post by phildidge on Wed Jun 26, 2019 10:55 pm

eddie wrote:
phildidge wrote:

How about fried mushrooms on cheese on toast mate?

Food porn. Cool

lol!

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