The changing face of Jesus. Good idea or bad?

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Post by Syl on Wed Feb 20, 2019 12:41 pm

First topic message reminder :

Comics giant DC has been criticised for intending to show Jesus as a bumbling sidekick to superhero Sunman.
The comic was to claim God was disappointed with Jesus so sends him back down to earth to learn some tricks of one of the popular superhero's.


https://www.dailystar.co.uk/news/latest-news/760807/jesus-christ-superhero-comic-book-dc



The changing face of Jesus. Good idea or bad? - Page 2 Latest-news-760807

Or...

The changing face of Jesus. Good idea or bad? - Page 2 Second-Coming-Cover-1-Copy


Last edited by Syl on Wed Feb 20, 2019 5:55 pm; edited 1 time in total

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Post by phildidge on Sat Feb 23, 2019 5:27 pm

So its not mocking them, they just take offense over him being mocked

Hence they are the issue not me, as no offense has been given from me to them

Next you will be telling me we cannot mock any historical character

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Post by Raggamuffin on Sat Feb 23, 2019 5:41 pm

Haha! You deleted your details. Frightened of being shot? Laughing

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Post by phildidge on Sat Feb 23, 2019 5:42 pm

Raggamuffin wrote:Haha! You deleted your details. Frightened of being shot? Laughing


Nope can post them again if you like?

Laughing

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Post by Raggamuffin on Sat Feb 23, 2019 5:43 pm

Thor wrote:
Raggamuffin wrote:Haha! You deleted your details. Frightened of being shot? Laughing


Nope can post them again if you like?

Laughing

Why did you delete them? Razz

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Post by phildidge on Sat Feb 23, 2019 5:44 pm

Raggamuffin wrote:
Thor wrote:


Nope can post them again if you like?

Laughing

Why did you delete them? Razz


Simple for reason for that, in that I dont want some people here sending me crap

You asked me to post up and did and can do so again

You thought I would not do it, but I did

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Post by Raggamuffin on Sat Feb 23, 2019 5:56 pm

Thor wrote:
Raggamuffin wrote:

Why did you delete them? Razz


Simple for reason for that, in that I dont want some people here sending me crap

You asked me to post up and did and can do so again

You thought I would not do it, but I did

Basically, you hoped that no Muslim extremists were looking in at that time. Razz You're still too chicken to mock them openly.

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Post by phildidge on Sat Feb 23, 2019 5:58 pm

Raggamuffin wrote:
Thor wrote:


Simple for reason for that, in that I dont want some people here sending me crap

You asked me to post up and did and can do so again

You thought I would not do it, but I did

Basically, you hoped that no Muslim extremists were looking in at that time. Razz  You're still too chicken to mock them openly.


I was mocking Muhummad, not anyone else, so why would I be afraid?

I did what you asked

Laughing

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Post by Raggamuffin on Sat Feb 23, 2019 6:05 pm

This is so hilarious. The changing face of Jesus. Good idea or bad? - Page 2 3489511464

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Post by eddie on Sat Feb 23, 2019 6:26 pm

Raggamuffin wrote:
eddie wrote:
Raggamuffin wrote:

You're free to mock religious people as long as you don't mind being mocked for being an airheaded moron. Yeah.

Yea if that’s what you think. But you don’t actually think that about me, do you?
But!
If you do think that, you really shouldn’t bother debating with me seeing as nothing I’ll say will be of any value anyway. Right?

No, I don't think that of you. I mean if one wants to mock, one should be prepared to be mocked - not you personally. Surprised

I quite agree. I don’t mind what people say to me or about me. It’s their prerogative and their opinion.

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Post by Fred Moletrousers on Sat Feb 23, 2019 9:04 pm

veya_victaous wrote:
Fred Moletrousers wrote:

So if I chooseto convert to Islam I should consider myself to be a fair target for online threats and abuse? How odd.

Perhaps I should start a campaign of internet stalking, abuse and threats against you for being a Heretic. After all, you chose to be what you are.

And I think you will find that it was a very, very long time ago since Christians of whatever persuasion burned anyone at the stake in the name of the Almighty.

If you want to promote Islam then you're also fair game. And they definitely also get just as much or more than Christians

You could, Christians do that to people regularly, although they do tend to pick on people who didn't make a choice and until the recent turn of public opinion couldn't defend themselves.

So why do you support a group that burns people at the stake? It doesn't matter how long ago it was, it is part of Christianity, You support it? want to bring it back? 
If not then you should be quite happy to see an Evil Institution be purged from humanity so the real Truth can reign.
Or are you some hypocrite, quite Happy so get the benefits of the Science that Christians Burned men for? While Still Praising the Frauds, the murderers and rapists that tried to deny Humanity the Bounty of Science  Rolling Eyes Rolling Eyes Rolling Eyes

Being C of E it's quite a while since I cheered on any heretic burning...and anyway, the Roman Catholics were so much better at it, particularly those Spanish Dons in the Inquisition with all their strappados and iron maidens and stuff as preliminary entertainment.

Our lot were quite content with sacking the odd monastery and nicking the altar silverware.

And, Veya, if you really think that I support the burning of heretics and would like to see it re-introduced as a Saturday afternoon sport, then be my guest. In this age of tolerance and inclusivity we must not deny even the simple of mind their flights of fancy, no matter how bizarre.
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Post by The Devil, You Know on Sat Feb 23, 2019 9:38 pm

Fred Moletrousers wrote:
veya_victaous wrote:

If you want to promote Islam then you're also fair game. And they definitely also get just as much or more than Christians

You could, Christians do that to people regularly, although they do tend to pick on people who didn't make a choice and until the recent turn of public opinion couldn't defend themselves.

So why do you support a group that burns people at the stake? It doesn't matter how long ago it was, it is part of Christianity, You support it? want to bring it back? 
If not then you should be quite happy to see an Evil Institution be purged from humanity so the real Truth can reign.
Or are you some hypocrite, quite Happy so get the benefits of the Science that Christians Burned men for? While Still Praising the Frauds, the murderers and rapists that tried to deny Humanity the Bounty of Science  Rolling Eyes Rolling Eyes Rolling Eyes

Being C of E it's quite a while since I cheered on any heretic burning...and anyway, the Roman Catholics were so much better at it, particularly those Spanish Dons in the Inquisition with all their strappados and iron maidens and stuff as preliminary entertainment.

Our lot were quite content with sacking the odd monastery and nicking the altar silverware.

And, Veya, if you really think that I support the burning of heretics and would like to see it re-introduced as a Saturday afternoon sport, then be my guest. In this age of tolerance and inclusivity we must not deny even the simple of mind their flights of fancy, no matter how bizarre.
no body expects the spanish inquisition, except it turns out they use to give you 2 weeks notice.

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Post by veya_victaous on Sun Feb 24, 2019 12:07 am

Fred Moletrousers wrote:
veya_victaous wrote:
Fred Moletrousers wrote:

So if I chooseto convert to Islam I should consider myself to be a fair target for online threats and abuse? How odd.

Perhaps I should start a campaign of internet stalking, abuse and threats against you for being a Heretic. After all, you chose to be what you are.

And I think you will find that it was a very, very long time ago since Christians of whatever persuasion burned anyone at the stake in the name of the Almighty.

If you want to promote Islam then you're also fair game. And they definitely also get just as much or more than Christians

You could, Christians do that to people regularly, although they do tend to pick on people who didn't make a choice and until the recent turn of public opinion couldn't defend themselves.

So why do you support a group that burns people at the stake? It doesn't matter how long ago it was, it is part of Christianity, You support it? want to bring it back? 
If not then you should be quite happy to see an Evil Institution be purged from humanity so the real Truth can reign.
Or are you some hypocrite, quite Happy so get the benefits of the Science that Christians Burned men for? While Still Praising the Frauds, the murderers and rapists that tried to deny Humanity the Bounty of Science  Rolling Eyes Rolling Eyes Rolling Eyes

Being C of E it's quite a while since I cheered on any heretic burning...and anyway, the Roman Catholics were so much better at it, particularly those Spanish Dons in the Inquisition with all their strappados and iron maidens and stuff as preliminary entertainment.

Our lot were quite content with sacking the odd monastery and nicking the altar silverware.

And, Veya, if you really think that I support the burning of heretics and would like to see it re-introduced as a Saturday afternoon sport, then be my guest. In this age of tolerance and inclusivity we must not deny even the simple of mind their flights of fancy, no matter how bizarre.


So you seemed to miss a major part of all Christian Scripture.
It's the word of god, and it's simply not true.

why continue to promote a lie, why be some nationalistic spin-off of what is still a proven lie confused
Even if you don't support the burning of heretics you support keeping alive the lies that allowed it.
why?

Why not put the effort into promoting something that at least might be true?

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Post by veya_victaous on Sun Feb 24, 2019 12:09 am

The changing face of Jesus. Good idea or bad? - Page 2 AiukBJQ

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Post by Fred Moletrousers on Sun Feb 24, 2019 7:01 pm

veya_victaous wrote:
Fred Moletrousers wrote:

Being C of E it's quite a while since I cheered on any heretic burning...and anyway, the Roman Catholics were so much better at it, particularly those Spanish Dons in the Inquisition with all their strappados and iron maidens and stuff as preliminary entertainment.

Our lot were quite content with sacking the odd monastery and nicking the altar silverware.

And, Veya, if you really think that I support the burning of heretics and would like to see it re-introduced as a Saturday afternoon sport, then be my guest. In this age of tolerance and inclusivity we must not deny even the simple of mind their flights of fancy, no matter how bizarre.


So you seemed to miss a major part of all Christian Scripture.
It's the word of god, and it's simply not true.

why continue to promote a lie, why be some nationalistic spin-off of what is still a proven lie confused
Even if you don't support the burning of heretics you support keeping alive the lies that allowed it.
why?

Why not put the effort into promoting something that at least might be true?

Just what "lie" are you talking about?

If it is that there is a God - a diety, a supreme being or whatever - you can no more disprove that than I can prove it. The difference between us is that unlike you, I am not so arrogant that I consider myself justified in insulting and holding up to ridicule and contempt anyone who chooses not to adopt and conform to my own belief.

I am simply taking advantage of my freedom and right of choice whether to believe or not; you clearly wish to deprive me of that freedom a right.

And you infer that I am being a hypocrite?

If the "lie" is that Jesus Christ taught (and Christians, by definition should at least try their best to live their lives in accordance with the standards laid down in His teaching) that heretics should be burned at the stake, he didn't. Nowhere, in all the New Testament accounts written or dictated by those who had known and followed him does it say any such thing.

In fact one of Christ's last commandments was that mankind (alright then, personkind) should love one another.

The fact that the Bishops and clerics who were the principal law makers and enforcers in Medieval times chose to use their own warped interpretation of the scriptures and a literal translation of the tribal myths, folklore and traditions that make up the Old Testament for their own purposes...largely ridding the state of troublemakers and opponents...is something that only a fool would try to blame on present day believers.

Even the Decalogue - the ten Commandments - says nothing whatsoever about burning heretics. Admittedly they command obedience to and respect of God, but they also require people to honour their parents, not to kill, steal or perjure and not to commit adultery or be jealous of someone else's possessions.

Now I don't know just what standards you abide by, but personally I can't see anything wrong with any of that.
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Post by nicko on Sun Feb 24, 2019 7:06 pm

I admit to burning a Guy or two on Bonfire night , Should I say a couple of "Hail Mary's" ?
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Post by veya_victaous on Mon Feb 25, 2019 4:31 am

Fred Moletrousers wrote:
veya_victaous wrote:
Fred Moletrousers wrote:

Being C of E it's quite a while since I cheered on any heretic burning...and anyway, the Roman Catholics were so much better at it, particularly those Spanish Dons in the Inquisition with all their strappados and iron maidens and stuff as preliminary entertainment.

Our lot were quite content with sacking the odd monastery and nicking the altar silverware.

And, Veya, if you really think that I support the burning of heretics and would like to see it re-introduced as a Saturday afternoon sport, then be my guest. In this age of tolerance and inclusivity we must not deny even the simple of mind their flights of fancy, no matter how bizarre.


So you seemed to miss a major part of all Christian Scripture.
It's the word of god, and it's simply not true.

why continue to promote a lie, why be some nationalistic spin-off of what is still a proven lie confused
Even if you don't support the burning of heretics you support keeping alive the lies that allowed it.
why?

Why not put the effort into promoting something that at least might be true?

Just what "lie" are you talking about?

If it is that there is a God - a diety, a supreme being or whatever - you can no more disprove that than I can prove it. The difference between us is that unlike you, I am not so arrogant that I consider myself justified in insulting and holding up to ridicule and contempt anyone who chooses not to adopt and conform to my own belief.

I am simply taking advantage of my freedom and right of choice whether to believe or not; you clearly wish to deprive me of that freedom a right.

And you infer that I am being a hypocrite?

If the "lie" is that Jesus Christ taught (and Christians, by definition should at least try their best to live their lives in accordance with the standards laid down in His teaching) that heretics should be burned at the stake, he didn't. Nowhere, in all the New Testament accounts written or dictated by those who had known and followed him does it say any such thing.

In fact one of Christ's last commandments was that mankind (alright then, personkind) should love one another.

The fact that the Bishops and clerics who were the principal law makers and enforcers  in Medieval times chose to use their own warped interpretation of the scriptures and a literal translation of the tribal myths, folklore and traditions that make up the Old Testament for their own purposes...largely ridding the state of troublemakers and opponents...is something that only a fool would try to blame on present day believers.

Even the Decalogue - the ten Commandments  - says nothing whatsoever about burning heretics. Admittedly they command obedience to and respect of God, but they also require people to honour their parents, not to kill, steal or perjure and not to commit adultery or be jealous of someone else's possessions.

Now I don't know just what standards you abide by, but personally I can't see anything wrong with any of that.

What is a LIE is the Fact the Bible is a book of truth.
it states it is 100% true then proceeds to be almost completely wrong about almost all the measurable fact in the universe. From the shape of earth, origins of life, Natural Phenomenon and Functions, the solar system the planet everything.

If it is Wrong about everything that is measurable and it Stated what it presented was 100% true, it is therefore FRAUDULENT. not just wrong it is an Active lie. Considering it is Proven Fraudulent everything else is States is Highly Suspect and the fact the only things not proven fraudulent are things un-provable one way or the other.

I can't prove there is not God in General, but if you can't prove the God as defined in the Bible is Completely False than You should not be allowed to Graduate High school, You obviously didn't even learn the Basics like the Earth Revolves around the Sun. I literally would use that as a mental exercise for teenagers, No Adult should be so uneducated as to Not be able Prove the God of the Bible to be False. 



Christ words are nothing fucking special 100,000's of others have said the same shit, it's only when Hypocrites and dumb asses follow an Institution that plays with their words AND PRETEND that they are not being arrogant when they Deny PROVEN fact for their Bullshit Fairytale.

Even the first books of the bible weren't written for decades after his death so there is NO RECORDED WORDS OF CHRIST, if you weren't a hypocrite of course you'd know that...
And Don't Blame me for your Hypocrisy, you've just admitted you want people to Acknowledge a Proven Lie for no reason other than Fairytales you can't grow out of.

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Post by phildidge on Mon Feb 25, 2019 4:41 am

veya_victaous wrote:
Fred Moletrousers wrote:

Just what "lie" are you talking about?

If it is that there is a God - a diety, a supreme being or whatever - you can no more disprove that than I can prove it. The difference between us is that unlike you, I am not so arrogant that I consider myself justified in insulting and holding up to ridicule and contempt anyone who chooses not to adopt and conform to my own belief.

I am simply taking advantage of my freedom and right of choice whether to believe or not; you clearly wish to deprive me of that freedom a right.

And you infer that I am being a hypocrite?

If the "lie" is that Jesus Christ taught (and Christians, by definition should at least try their best to live their lives in accordance with the standards laid down in His teaching) that heretics should be burned at the stake, he didn't. Nowhere, in all the New Testament accounts written or dictated by those who had known and followed him does it say any such thing.

In fact one of Christ's last commandments was that mankind (alright then, personkind) should love one another.

The fact that the Bishops and clerics who were the principal law makers and enforcers  in Medieval times chose to use their own warped interpretation of the scriptures and a literal translation of the tribal myths, folklore and traditions that make up the Old Testament for their own purposes...largely ridding the state of troublemakers and opponents...is something that only a fool would try to blame on present day believers.

Even the Decalogue - the ten Commandments  - says nothing whatsoever about burning heretics. Admittedly they command obedience to and respect of God, but they also require people to honour their parents, not to kill, steal or perjure and not to commit adultery or be jealous of someone else's possessions.

Now I don't know just what standards you abide by, but personally I can't see anything wrong with any of that.

What is a LIE is the Fact the Bible is a book of truth.
it states it is 100% true then proceeds to be almost completely wrong about almost all the measurable fact in the universe. From the shape of earth, origins of life, Natural Phenomenon and Functions, the solar system the planet everything.

If it is Wrong about everything that is measurable and it Stated what it presented was 100% true, it is therefore FRAUDULENT. not just wrong it is an Active lie. Considering it is Proven Fraudulent everything else is States is Highly Suspect and the fact the only things not proven fraudulent are things un-provable one way or the other.

I can't prove there is not God in General, but if you can't prove the God as defined in the Bible is Completely False than You should not be allowed to Graduate High school, You obviously didn't even learn the Basics like the Earth Revolves around the Sun. I literally would use that as a mental exercise for teenagers, No Adult should be so uneducated as to Not be able Prove the God of the Bible to be False. 



Christ words are nothing fucking special 100,000's of others have said the same shit, it's only when Hypocrites and dumb asses follow an Institution that plays with their words AND PRETEND that they are not being arrogant when they Deny PROVEN fact for their Bullshit Fairytale.

Even the first books of the bible weren't written for decades after his death so there is NO RECORDED WORDS OF CHRIST, if you weren't a hypocrite of course you'd know that...
And Don't Blame me for your Hypocrisy, you've just admitted you want people to Acknowledge a Proven Lie for no reason other than Fairytales you can't grow out of.


+1 for the first part

As to Jesus, he has to go down as the first real socialist mate, though that advocated against families
So he was a cool teacher, but no different from Mithra or Osiris, which both were used to deify him. Early Christians used these myths to help make Romans adapt to Christianity

Paul screwed up Christianity and its what fred now follows. It really should be called Paulianity and not Christinaity

I will leave you with this

Night mate


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Post by veya_victaous on Mon Feb 25, 2019 5:03 am

Jesus??? first socialist??  Suspect Suspect Suspect  
you forget Buddha half a Millennia before Jesus was born..


And Also almost all Native Tribal religions. Socialism is the default State of the tribe and therefore mankind.. (our ancestors evolved to be complex social animals before Homo Sapiens appear) 
it is the idea of classes, kings and chosen ones that comes later. the Concept of Ownership is Not default, proven by the fact the oldest cultures(aboriginals) didn't have it.

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Post by Original Quill on Mon Feb 25, 2019 5:39 am

veya_victaous wrote:Jesus??? first socialist??  Suspect Suspect Suspect  
you forget Buddha half a Millennia before Jesus was born..


And Also almost all Native Tribal religions. Socialism is the default State of the tribe and therefore mankind.. (our ancestors evolved to be complex social animals before Homo Sapiens appear) 
it is the idea of classes, kings and chosen ones that comes later. the Concept of Ownership is Not default, proven by the fact the oldest cultures(aboriginals) didn't have it.

Nor the concept of Property.

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Post by Fred Moletrousers on Mon Feb 25, 2019 11:32 am

veya_victaous wrote:
Fred Moletrousers wrote:

Just what "lie" are you talking about?

If it is that there is a God - a diety, a supreme being or whatever - you can no more disprove that than I can prove it. The difference between us is that unlike you, I am not so arrogant that I consider myself justified in insulting and holding up to ridicule and contempt anyone who chooses not to adopt and conform to my own belief.

I am simply taking advantage of my freedom and right of choice whether to believe or not; you clearly wish to deprive me of that freedom a right.

And you infer that I am being a hypocrite?

If the "lie" is that Jesus Christ taught (and Christians, by definition should at least try their best to live their lives in accordance with the standards laid down in His teaching) that heretics should be burned at the stake, he didn't. Nowhere, in all the New Testament accounts written or dictated by those who had known and followed him does it say any such thing.

In fact one of Christ's last commandments was that mankind (alright then, personkind) should love one another.

The fact that the Bishops and clerics who were the principal law makers and enforcers  in Medieval times chose to use their own warped interpretation of the scriptures and a literal translation of the tribal myths, folklore and traditions that make up the Old Testament for their own purposes...largely ridding the state of troublemakers and opponents...is something that only a fool would try to blame on present day believers.

Even the Decalogue - the ten Commandments  - says nothing whatsoever about burning heretics. Admittedly they command obedience to and respect of God, but they also require people to honour their parents, not to kill, steal or perjure and not to commit adultery or be jealous of someone else's possessions.

Now I don't know just what standards you abide by, but personally I can't see anything wrong with any of that.

What is a LIE is the Fact the Bible is a book of truth.
it states it is 100% true then proceeds to be almost completely wrong about almost all the measurable fact in the universe. From the shape of earth, origins of life, Natural Phenomenon and Functions, the solar system the planet everything.

If it is Wrong about everything that is measurable and it Stated what it presented was 100% true, it is therefore FRAUDULENT. not just wrong it is an Active lie. Considering it is Proven Fraudulent everything else is States is Highly Suspect and the fact the only things not proven fraudulent are things un-provable one way or the other.

I can't prove there is not God in General, but if you can't prove the God as defined in the Bible is Completely False than You should not be allowed to Graduate High school, You obviously didn't even learn the Basics like the Earth Revolves around the Sun. I literally would use that as a mental exercise for teenagers, No Adult should be so uneducated as to Not be able Prove the God of the Bible to be False. 



Christ words are nothing fucking special 100,000's of others have said the same shit, it's only when Hypocrites and dumb asses follow an Institution that plays with their words AND PRETEND that they are not being arrogant when they Deny PROVEN fact for their Bullshit Fairytale.

Even the first books of the bible weren't written for decades after his death so there is NO RECORDED WORDS OF CHRIST, if you weren't a hypocrite of course you'd know that...
And Don't Blame me for your Hypocrisy, you've just admitted you want people to Acknowledge a Proven Lie for no reason other than Fairytales you can't grow out of.



Apart from never having said, or even believed, that the Bible is a book of truth (your words, not mine...I've already described the Old Testament as myth, fable and tribal folklore)) all I have claimed is that the teachings of Christ set out the standards to which I aspire and, sadly, cannot claim fully to have achieved, and that I personally believe in God.

You apparently think that my belief is that God is an old guy with long whiskers sitting on a cloud and showering blessings and benevolence on believers and hurling thunderbolts down on non-believers. It isn't.

I do, however, believe in a Creator - and that could be a chemical reaction or a demonstration of the powers of physics, for all I know. I am neither a theologian nor a scientist.

You seem to rubbish and condemn my belief in and attempts to follow the teachings of Christ. That's your right; perhaps dishonoring your parents, killing, lying, stealing, and perjuring yourself are your own favoured lifestyle standards. I neither know nor, indeed, do I care.

I also happen to think that faith, hope and charity are pretty good principles to try to live up to. To you they are obviously just...what was your eloquent description of my beliefs?..bullshit

I have made what is purely a personal choice and one that I have no wish to impose on you or anyone else. Frankly, I find it difficult to see how that is hypocritical.

I don't know whether you have ever seen the Rubens triptych, Adoration of the Magi, in King's College Chapel, Cambridge. Or Michelangelo's painted ceiling in the Sistine Chapel. Or Ely, Canterbury, St Paul's or Hereford Cathedrals. They were all inspired by Christianity and built and created by believers in Christ's teaching...the same believers who, throughout history have included some of the greatest names in literature, art, science, technology and medicine.

It must be so satisfying for you to consider yourself the moral and intellectual superior of people like that...

Oh, and you do realise, don't you, that the earliest epistles were written, or more likely dictated, within the living memory of some of those who actually knew Christ and were followers? The Romans, Greeks, Hebrews, Egyptians, etc were not entirely illiterate.




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Post by Jules on Mon Feb 25, 2019 11:46 am

Thor wrote:The changing face of Jesus. Good idea or bad? - Page 2 New-old-481391

https://www.dailystar.co.uk/news/latest-news/481391/Jesus-Christ-real-face

He's from the Levant, he'd have looked like the locals did ATT.
IE about half way between those two extremes.

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Post by HoratioTarr on Mon Feb 25, 2019 12:39 pm

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Post by nicko on Mon Feb 25, 2019 4:18 pm

Smile
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Post by Syl on Mon Feb 25, 2019 5:42 pm

I remember when we were kids we would get into trouble if we …"Took the Lords name in vain".
How times have changed. Shocked

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Post by Vintage on Mon Feb 25, 2019 6:54 pm

There's basic truth in all religions and they are more or less the same message, much of the orders/commandments are a kind of health and safety manual for the times. Its true that so called teachers have made rules and regulations that have nothing to do with having a faith, regulations on what you wear, who you are allowed to enact with, its been largely to control the population especially women, just about all organised religions are guilty of this even Buddhism.

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Post by Original Quill on Mon Feb 25, 2019 8:46 pm

Jesus was the founder of humanist philosophy...forget the Pauline bullshite about a bearded old man who lives in the sky.

I don't know about his link to David, but he should stand next to great philosophers.

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Post by Fred Moletrousers on Tue Feb 26, 2019 9:57 am

Original Quill wrote:Jesus was the founder of humanist philosophy...forget the Pauline bullshite about a bearded old man who lives in the sky.

I don't know about his link to David, but he should stand next to great philosophers.

Exactly...and that's the point that I have been trying to make...that my personal decision about faith is based on Christ's teaching; obviously tweaked in the telling over the past couple of thousand years, but still very relevant I would suggest.

And no amount of theophobic ranting and abuse in this forum is going to make me change my mind one iota.

As an aside, the Christian Aid movement last year spent well over £100 million on its worldwide work in alleviating poverty and deprivation and carrying out health, education and disaster relief projects while in this country the Church of England Children's Society spent in the region of £40 million on projects that support kids who are abused, neglected, deprived and impoverished. I'm proud to have supported both.

"Bullshit and fraud"?



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Post by Fred Moletrousers on Tue Feb 26, 2019 9:58 am

Syl wrote:I remember when we were kids we would get into trouble if we …"Took the Lords name in vain".
How times have changed. Shocked

Yeah, and we still burn heretics, you know  Twisted Evil
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Post by Syl on Tue Feb 26, 2019 12:20 pm

Fred Moletrousers wrote:
Syl wrote:I remember when we were kids we would get into trouble if we …"Took the Lords name in vain".
How times have changed. Shocked

Yeah, and we still burn heretics, you know  Twisted Evil

Yep...and witches and stuff, some things never change. Wink

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Post by Fred Moletrousers on Tue Feb 26, 2019 6:39 pm

Syl wrote:
Fred Moletrousers wrote:

Yeah, and we still burn heretics, you know  Twisted Evil

Yep...and witches and stuff, some things never change. Wink

Actually, it's a fallacy that witches were burned in England; the judicial punishment under Henry V111's Witchcraft Act was hanging.

Those burnings that occurred were probably down to lynch mobs handing out their own brand of justice against supposed witches, particularly in the confusion of the English Civil war when Witchfinder General Mathew Hopkins was rampant in the Eastern counties. He and his associates were probably responsible for almost half the judicial hangings that ever took place in England.

Years ago, I wrote a play about the subject and it went on to be broadcast.
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Post by Syl on Tue Feb 26, 2019 6:54 pm

Fred Moletrousers wrote:
Syl wrote:

Yep...and witches and stuff, some things never change. Wink

Actually, it's a fallacy that witches were burned in England; the judicial punishment under Henry V111's Witchcraft Act was hanging.

Those burnings that occurred were probably down to lynch mobs handing out their own brand of justice against supposed witches, particularly in the confusion of the English Civil war when Witchfinder General Mathew Hopkins was rampant in the Eastern counties. He and his associates were probably responsible for almost half the judicial hangings that ever took place in England.
 

Years ago, I wrote a play about the subject and it went on to be broadcast.

Another myth busted then. Rolling Eyes

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Post by veya_victaous on Tue Feb 26, 2019 10:53 pm

Fred Moletrousers wrote:
veya_victaous wrote:
Fred Moletrousers wrote:

Just what "lie" are you talking about?

If it is that there is a God - a diety, a supreme being or whatever - you can no more disprove that than I can prove it. The difference between us is that unlike you, I am not so arrogant that I consider myself justified in insulting and holding up to ridicule and contempt anyone who chooses not to adopt and conform to my own belief.

I am simply taking advantage of my freedom and right of choice whether to believe or not; you clearly wish to deprive me of that freedom a right.

And you infer that I am being a hypocrite?

If the "lie" is that Jesus Christ taught (and Christians, by definition should at least try their best to live their lives in accordance with the standards laid down in His teaching) that heretics should be burned at the stake, he didn't. Nowhere, in all the New Testament accounts written or dictated by those who had known and followed him does it say any such thing.

In fact one of Christ's last commandments was that mankind (alright then, personkind) should love one another.

The fact that the Bishops and clerics who were the principal law makers and enforcers  in Medieval times chose to use their own warped interpretation of the scriptures and a literal translation of the tribal myths, folklore and traditions that make up the Old Testament for their own purposes...largely ridding the state of troublemakers and opponents...is something that only a fool would try to blame on present day believers.

Even the Decalogue - the ten Commandments  - says nothing whatsoever about burning heretics. Admittedly they command obedience to and respect of God, but they also require people to honour their parents, not to kill, steal or perjure and not to commit adultery or be jealous of someone else's possessions.

Now I don't know just what standards you abide by, but personally I can't see anything wrong with any of that.

What is a LIE is the Fact the Bible is a book of truth.
it states it is 100% true then proceeds to be almost completely wrong about almost all the measurable fact in the universe. From the shape of earth, origins of life, Natural Phenomenon and Functions, the solar system the planet everything.

If it is Wrong about everything that is measurable and it Stated what it presented was 100% true, it is therefore FRAUDULENT. not just wrong it is an Active lie. Considering it is Proven Fraudulent everything else is States is Highly Suspect and the fact the only things not proven fraudulent are things un-provable one way or the other.

I can't prove there is not God in General, but if you can't prove the God as defined in the Bible is Completely False than You should not be allowed to Graduate High school, You obviously didn't even learn the Basics like the Earth Revolves around the Sun. I literally would use that as a mental exercise for teenagers, No Adult should be so uneducated as to Not be able Prove the God of the Bible to be False. 



Christ words are nothing fucking special 100,000's of others have said the same shit, it's only when Hypocrites and dumb asses follow an Institution that plays with their words AND PRETEND that they are not being arrogant when they Deny PROVEN fact for their Bullshit Fairytale.

Even the first books of the bible weren't written for decades after his death so there is NO RECORDED WORDS OF CHRIST, if you weren't a hypocrite of course you'd know that...
And Don't Blame me for your Hypocrisy, you've just admitted you want people to Acknowledge a Proven Lie for no reason other than Fairytales you can't grow out of.



Apart from never having said, or even believed, that the Bible is a book of truth (your words, not mine...I've already described the Old Testament as myth, fable and tribal folklore)) all I have claimed is that the teachings of Christ set out the standards to which I aspire and, sadly, cannot claim fully to have achieved, and that I personally believe in God.

You apparently think that my belief is that God is an old guy with long whiskers sitting on a cloud and showering blessings and benevolence on believers and hurling thunderbolts down on non-believers. It isn't.

I do, however, believe in a Creator - and that could be a chemical reaction or a demonstration of the powers of physics, for all I know. I am neither a theologian nor a scientist.

You seem to rubbish and condemn my belief in and attempts to follow the teachings of Christ. That's your right; perhaps dishonoring your parents, killing, lying, stealing, and perjuring yourself are your own favoured lifestyle standards. I neither know nor, indeed, do I care.

I also happen to think that faith, hope and charity are pretty good principles to try to live up to. To you they are obviously just...what was your eloquent description of my beliefs?..bullshit

I have made what is  purely a personal choice and one that I have no wish to impose on you or anyone else. Frankly, I find it difficult to see how that is hypocritical.

I don't know whether you have ever seen the Rubens triptych, Adoration of the Magi, in King's College Chapel, Cambridge. Or Michelangelo's painted ceiling in the Sistine Chapel. Or Ely, Canterbury, St Paul's or Hereford Cathedrals. They were all inspired by Christianity and built and created by believers in Christ's teaching...the same believers who, throughout history have included some of the greatest names in literature, art, science, technology and medicine.

It must be so satisfying for you to consider yourself the moral and intellectual superior of people like that...

Oh, and you do realise, don't you, that the earliest epistles were written, or more likely dictated, within the living memory of some of those who actually knew Christ and were followers? The Romans, Greeks, Hebrews, Egyptians, etc were not entirely illiterate.






They are not the standards of Christ they are the standards of Man.
Raised atheist with both grandfathers being atheists(Believing in Science) and still have those same standards, Buddhist and Hindu standards are the same too.
To Claim they have anything to do with Christ specifically is bullshit, most cultures have some sort of fairy-tale to teach those lessons to Children. to elevate it beyond it's true state (a fairytale) is a disservice to the truth.. and despite it's few good points there is so much bad shit in it that it is better to be removed since those good points are easily found in other sources that don't have the long association with evil deeds and fraudulent teachings

they are the greatest names remembered because the Church Suppressed (or literally killed) the others Rolling Eyes Rolling Eyes Rolling Eyes

So even the earliest epistles recollections of Christ where highly degraded by time before their first recording

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Post by eddie on Tue Feb 26, 2019 11:15 pm

The changing face of Jesus. Good idea or bad? - Page 2 937f0f10

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Post by veya_victaous on Tue Feb 26, 2019 11:30 pm

eddie wrote:The changing face of Jesus. Good idea or bad? - Page 2 937f0f10

the problem is that is not what the bible says, and the main reason the kid even has self doubt about being gay is the Bible and it's effect on society.
Although who knows with 'Jesus' himself, he might not of cared but he was still raised in a very homophobic society.
the Greek gods never had this issue geek

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Post by eddie on Tue Feb 26, 2019 11:43 pm

It was a joke but I take your point Mr Oz dude.

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Post by Fred Moletrousers on Wed Feb 27, 2019 2:34 pm

veya_victaous wrote:
Fred Moletrousers wrote:



Apart from never having said, or even believed, that the Bible is a book of truth (your words, not mine...I've already described the Old Testament as myth, fable and tribal folklore)) all I have claimed is that the teachings of Christ set out the standards to which I aspire and, sadly, cannot claim fully to have achieved, and that I personally believe in God.

You apparently think that my belief is that God is an old guy with long whiskers sitting on a cloud and showering blessings and benevolence on believers and hurling thunderbolts down on non-believers. It isn't.

I do, however, believe in a Creator - and that could be a chemical reaction or a demonstration of the powers of physics, for all I know. I am neither a theologian nor a scientist.

You seem to rubbish and condemn my belief in and attempts to follow the teachings of Christ. That's your right; perhaps dishonoring your parents, killing, lying, stealing, and perjuring yourself are your own favoured lifestyle standards. I neither know nor, indeed, do I care.

I also happen to think that faith, hope and charity are pretty good principles to try to live up to. To you they are obviously just...what was your eloquent description of my beliefs?..bullshit

I have made what is  purely a personal choice and one that I have no wish to impose on you or anyone else. Frankly, I find it difficult to see how that is hypocritical.

I don't know whether you have ever seen the Rubens triptych, Adoration of the Magi, in King's College Chapel, Cambridge. Or Michelangelo's painted ceiling in the Sistine Chapel. Or Ely, Canterbury, St Paul's or Hereford Cathedrals. They were all inspired by Christianity and built and created by believers in Christ's teaching...the same believers who, throughout history have included some of the greatest names in literature, art, science, technology and medicine.

It must be so satisfying for you to consider yourself the moral and intellectual superior of people like that...

Oh, and you do realise, don't you, that the earliest epistles were written, or more likely dictated, within the living memory of some of those who actually knew Christ and were followers? The Romans, Greeks, Hebrews, Egyptians, etc were not entirely illiterate.






They are not the standards of Christ they are the standards of Man.
Raised atheist with both grandfathers being atheists(Believing in Science) and still have those same standards, Buddhist and Hindu standards are the same too.
To Claim they have anything to do with Christ specifically is bullshit, most cultures have some sort of fairy-tale to teach those lessons to Children. to elevate it beyond it's true state (a fairytale) is a disservice to the truth.. and despite it's few good points there is so much bad shit in it that it is better to be removed since those good points are easily found in other sources that don't have the long association with evil deeds and fraudulent teachings

they are the greatest names remembered because the Church Suppressed (or literally killed) the others Rolling Eyes Rolling Eyes Rolling Eyes

So even the earliest epistles recollections of Christ where highly degraded by time before their first recording

So they are "the standards of man"? So what? Christ was a man; Christ taught them (he was, after all, a Rabbi, so he was doing his job) and they established a church and a belief that have existed for two thousand years and now have more than two billion followers worldwide.

The main reason, perhaps, was that he managed to piss off his so-called religious betters and they nagged the local Roman governor into executing him such a way that it inspired the biggest brand logo ever known.

It has also been the inspiration much of the culture of my country, as well as many others, and is the source, through its own and related charities, of so much work to alleviate poverty, deprivation, disease, abuse and lack of educational facilities in scores of countries, including some of the poorest and most divided.

You're an atheist and don't want to see any of these standards and work attributed to Christianity. That's your personal opinion and you're entitled to it.

I'm a Christian and believe in my faith and in all the good that it has done in the past, and still does. That's my personal opinion and I'm entitled to it.

If that offends you, Veya, then to use an unChristian expression, tough shit. I prefer not to use silly rolling eyes emoticons to express my feelings.

Real scholars, historians and theologians - not just keyboard pundits - have been studying and trying to solve the mysteries of the Christian religion and the scriptures for well over a thousand years, and even they can't agree on what's true and what isn't.

Perhaps your own self-proclaimed expert opinion that it's all "bullshit" could be open to challenge by authorities far more competent and qualified than you are.

And quite why you think the earliest of the epistles should have been "greatly degraded" escapes me...best guess is that they were written to the fledgling Christian churches within 40 or 50 years of Christ's death and would have included first hand accounts...most likely by the educated Saul of Tarsus, who we now know better as St Paul. He knew that Jesus chap quite well, I understand.

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Post by eddie on Tue Jun 11, 2019 8:22 pm

The changing face of Jesus. Good idea or bad? - Page 2 7654e110

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Post by gelico on Tue Jun 11, 2019 8:55 pm

eddie wrote:The changing face of Jesus. Good idea or bad? - Page 2 937f0f10




And God did appear to the homosexuals and did say unto them that they were sinful

and they did say ''but you made us, oh Lord exactly as we are''

and God did say unto them ''yeah but if i made homosexuals it was a mistake''

and they did say ''but you have made the same mistake millions of times''

and God did say ''which proves i am an incompetent twat who can't get it right and don't play fair and only fools would rely on me for anything''

and the people did agree




from the book of Gelico

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Post by eddie on Tue Jun 11, 2019 9:08 pm

The book of Gelico is a wise book indeed. Cool

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Post by Ben Reilly on Tue Jun 11, 2019 9:35 pm

gelico wrote:
eddie wrote:The changing face of Jesus. Good idea or bad? - Page 2 937f0f10




And God did appear to the homosexuals and did say unto them that they were sinful

and they did say ''but you made us, oh Lord exactly as we are''

and God did say unto them  ''yeah but if i made homosexuals it was a mistake''

and they did say  ''but you have made the same mistake millions of times''

and God did say  ''which proves i am an incompetent twat who can't get it right and don't play fair and only fools would rely on me for anything''

and the people did agree




from the book of Gelico

The changing face of Jesus. Good idea or bad? - Page 2 Thumb_rc-crobot-roboticcrab-biblical-times-god-oh-shit-angel-what-44678971

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It's so hard to be without you / used to feel so angry, now I only feel humble.

- Ryan Adams
Ben Reilly
Ben Reilly
Cowboy King. Dread Pirate of the Guadalupe. Enemy of the American people.

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Join date : 2013-01-19
Age : 44
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