Outrage as non-Native youth wearing #MAGA hats taunt and disrespect Native elder

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Post by phildidge on Sat Jan 19, 2019 11:33 pm

First topic message reminder :

Nathan Phillips, Omaha, is a Vietnam Veteran who hosts a sacred pipe ceremony at Arlington, was taunted in D.C.

Native Twitter has gone ablaze as a Native American elder singing the AIM Song in Washington DC during the Indigenous Peoples March was ridiculed, taunted and mocked by a group of non-Native youth.

The video, which was posted by YouTube account holder KC NOLAND, was also screen captured and shared on other social media accounts with views shortly gaining tens of thousands of views.

The elder is Nathan Phillips, an Omaha elder who is also a Vietnam Veteran and former director of the Native Youth Alliance. He is also a keeper of a sacred pipe and holds an annual ceremony honoring Native American veterans in the Arlington National Cemetery.




https://newsmaven.io/indiancountrytoday/news/outrage-as-non-native-youth-wearing-maga-hats-taunt-and-disrespect-native-elder-jy7UVwdg8kK2uvT0L-JOig/?fbclid=IwAR2vlCRWAbVwYNBdYTTNSRlh4dNxi29mT4P2eEywmEGiGkrJnjWsho_M0Pw


What a bunch of uneducated ingrate little shits.

If there was ever an example of what is wrong in the US today, it was the disrespectful actions of this vile little scumbags

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Post by phildidge on Mon Jan 21, 2019 4:30 am

https://edition.cnn.com/2019/01/20/us/covington-kentucky-student-statement/index.html

Well there is a stagemanaged reply in order to attemot to save his butt

He clearly is not being honest in all of that and trying to pass blame onto the chaperones

Since when was a mocking version of the Haka, part of school songs or how they acted?

He claimed he smilled once?

lol, yeah right, he knew he was mocking and avoids completely that others mocked the Indians

Talk about damage limitation

So much for Maddogs claim about CNN

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Post by Maddog on Mon Jan 21, 2019 7:28 am

Thor wrote:https://edition.cnn.com/2019/01/20/us/covington-kentucky-student-statement/index.html

Well there is a stagemanaged reply in order to attemot to save his butt

He clearly is not being honest in all of that and trying to pass blame onto the chaperones

Since when was a mocking version of the Haka, part of school songs or how they acted?

He claimed he smilled once?

lol, yeah right, he knew he was mocking and avoids completely that others mocked the Indians

Talk about damage limitation

So much for Maddogs claim about CNN

Based on the video his version is far more believable. The Indians should have stayed in the lanes and not harassed a bunch of kids.

By the way, there is a school not too far from where I live that does a haka.

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Post by Maddog on Mon Jan 21, 2019 7:30 am

Thor wrote:
Maddog wrote:
Hate speech is legal in the US. That's why the Westboro folks were never "done".

These kooks are well known in DC.  The chaperones should have told the kids to stay away from the jackasses.  The Native folks should have stayed away from the kids.  Of all the parties acting up yesterday the kids were the best BEHAVED.

ha ha ha

So where you said they behaved badly, now you are saying that Nathan misbehaved

ha ha

You really see the racial bias coming out of people

If you think that is well behaved, then you need to check your moral compass

Nathan and many of the Indians were as peaceful as can be.

Only one shot back at some of nthe trump supporters, clearly off things they had said

Oh and by the way those native folks are also Americans

Why did Nathan describe those kids the way he did when the video showed the hate group were the ones actually professing hate?

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Post by Maddog on Mon Jan 21, 2019 7:33 am

http://tennesseestar.com/2019/01/21/democratic-rep-wants-to-ban-teens-from-wearing-maga-hats-after-false-reports-of-harrassment/


Now folks want to ban things based on false information.

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Post by WhoseYourWolfie on Mon Jan 21, 2019 9:36 am

Maddog wrote:
Thor wrote:https://edition.cnn.com/2019/01/20/us/covington-kentucky-student-statement/index.html

Well there is a stagemanaged reply in order to attemot to save his butt

He clearly is not being honest in all of that and trying to pass blame onto the chaperones

Since when was a mocking version of the Haka, part of school songs or how they acted?

He claimed he smilled once?

lol, yeah right, he knew he was mocking and avoids completely that others mocked the Indians

Talk about damage limitation

So much for Maddogs claim about CNN

Based on the video his version is far more believable.  The Indians should have stayed in the lanes and not harassed a bunch of kids.  

By the way, there is a school not too far from where I live that does a haka.  

Idea

Point of Order :

Is that a proper haka orchestrated by a bunch of rugby-loving Kiwis...

Or a half-baked pale imitation used to mock the Maoris..

The insulting pseudo-mock-"haka" in the o/p says more about the racist little shits harassing native Americans, more then any of the "fake news" reports that you have been dragging out of your arse in your puerile efforts to defend and excuse that unruly mob of self-entitled whitebread punks.

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Post by Maddog on Mon Jan 21, 2019 3:14 pm

WhoseYourWolfie wrote:
Maddog wrote:

Based on the video his version is far more believable.  The Indians should have stayed in the lanes and not harassed a bunch of kids.  

By the way, there is a school not too far from where I live that does a haka.  

Idea

Point of Order :

Is that a proper haka orchestrated by a bunch of rugby-loving Kiwis...

Or a half-baked pale imitation used to mock the Maoris..

The insulting pseudo-mock-"haka" in the o/p says more about the racist little shits harassing native Americans, more then any of the "fake news" reports that you have been dragging out of your arse in your puerile efforts to defend and excuse that unruly mob of self-entitled whitebread punks.

It's performed by a school with a small Tongan population.

Which fake news did I drag out?

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Post by Maddog on Mon Jan 21, 2019 5:50 pm

You can delete your old tweets, but the internet is forever. At least, that’s what the Screenshot Bot tells us.

Over the past 24 hours, journalists and public figures on Twitter have deleted previous posts slamming a group of MAGA hat-wearing teens for allegedly taunting a Native American vet, after more footage was released disputing the initial story. From CNN’s Jake Tapper to Dilbert cartoonist Scott Adams, many on the internet are sharing a fuller explanation of the initial viral story.

Others, however, are very subtly just using the ‘delete’ button.

New York Times opinion writer Kara Swisher, for instance, deleted one tweet saying she was thinking of “finding every one of these shitty kids and giving them a very large piece of my mind,” and other tweets throwing slurs like “Nazi” and “nationalist.” Sinclair chief political correspondent Scott Thurman deleted a tweet alleging students in MAGA hats were “mocking” and “taunting” a Native American in front of the Lincoln Memorial in D.C., asking in a new tweet if the new video changed minds about the kids.

https://www.mediaite.com/online/journalists-and-celebs-rush-to-delete-tweets-slamming-maga-hat-kids/?fbclid=IwAR0e2wTkyyPflqvk0hDrfDm18nDJp2lrGUTZxWKKCmB3KwIr1TShBBgm1Nc

Delete, edit and modify.

It's no big deal. All of us have had to walk back our initial reaction to a story. Even I wanted to throttle these kids until I actually saw what happened. I have finally learned that the truth on these type stories usually comes out the 2nd or 3rd day, when people attack the media spin.

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Post by Maddog on Mon Jan 21, 2019 6:13 pm

Around the country, thousands of men and women have joined black supremacist groups on the extremist fringe of the Hebrew Israelite movement, a black nationalist theology that dates back to the 19th century. Its doctrine asserts that African Americans are God's true chosen people because they, not the people known to the world today as Jews, are the real descendants of the Hebrews of the Bible. Although most Hebrew Israelites are neither explicitly racist nor anti-Semitic and do not advocate violence, there is a rising extremist sector within the Hebrew Israelite movement whose adherents believe that Jews are devilish impostors and who openly condemn whites as evil personified, deserving only death or slavery.

Black-clad security guards and Hebrew Israelite priests stand outside the Baltimore chapter of the Israelite Church of God in Jesus Christ. The black supremacist group is obsessed with security and the evils of white people.
The notorious white supremacist leader Tom Metzger once remarked of extremist Hebrew Israelites, "They're the black counterparts of us." The belief system of extremist Hebrew Israelites is basically the reversed-color mirror image of the Christian Identity theology embraced by many white supremacists, which holds that mainstream Jews are the descendants of Satan and that white people are the chosen ones, divinely endowed by God with superior status over "mud people," believers' term for non-white individuals.

https://www.splcenter.org/fighting-hate/intelligence-report/2008/racist-black-hebrew-israelites-becoming-more-militant

Thank God someone rushed to the defense of these people. Those boys were about to say mean things to them. Cool

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Post by Guest on Mon Jan 21, 2019 6:38 pm

Maddog wrote:
Delete, edit and modify.


oh yeah now the MSM have got themselves in a right old funk over this one. Finally putting out the true version and trying to blame each other et al for the initial hitjob. but the damage has been done

this one lad has now been doxed and he and his family have received death threats.

he made a statement (paraphrasing)

''i had no idea why this guy suddenly came in amongst our group and got into my face with his drum and singing. i was taken aback but was determined to stay calm so as not to aggravate anyone. i also smiled part way through just to let him know that i meant him no harm''


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Post by phildidge on Mon Jan 21, 2019 7:23 pm

So I see maddog ignored my last 3 posts to him

The reaosn is he knows, as does gelico, they are excusing this because they believe A vietnam Vet was defending racist extremists. A man of peace. Which would mean he would look to defend many people as he did in Vietnam and by now helping former Vets..

Now this is their reason to condemn Nathan. Where he saw about a hundred kids mocking the haka (which is not Tongan but Maori) and heard verbal abuse from the African extremists. He looked at the odds and did not defend either, but stood in betwen playing a traditional song. To later have the kids surround and mock him.

Now I certainly do not defend extremists, but are you saying a man of peace, who had no idea who they belonged to. Saw a small group of Blacks compared to a hundred teenagers, many where pro Trump hats. What sort of other conclusion would also many people come to in that situation?

So to say the mocking of Nathan is justified, because a person of peace should not try to defuse something? You see this is where both Maddog and Gelico are emotionally compremised. They believe the hate, (of which they both spouted against him is justified. Even though one of them supports an extremist in the form of Tommy Robinson and defends him constantly), because Nathan to them should not defend black racist homophobic men. Even though its very doubtfull, that he did not know what group they were. Just as many did not hee, util I said Which you only in hindsight knew were Black hebrew Isaralites, as you were clueless to this. I had to say this to clear up gelico's clanger.

Now whether you rightly think the Black extremists are scum, they were massivgelly out numbered, so how will that look to some people?

Hence the only reason you both thinks its okay to demean and spout hate, thinking the mocking is justified. Is based on an emotional view, that he should not have wanted to defuse a situation involving these men. That is their sole reason to be hateful and justify the kids mocking

By such stupidity, they just made hate justified by the extremist blacks, through your own justification of hate.
See how it works?

The point they miss

What they both fail to recoignise is the schools will see their kids out for a day, acting like idiots and even worse mocking a native Indian. The school will judge them based on showing up the school and there is no excuse for their behaviour. Just as there is no excuse for the hate spouted by the Black supremacists. Just as there is no excuse for the hate Gelico spouted against a man of peace. Who has done far more and fought for his country, to then have some mindless Trump drone, demean him in the worst possible way.

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Post by phildidge on Mon Jan 21, 2019 7:42 pm

Plenty more to read on this that try at least to give balanced accounts

https://theweek.com/speedreads/818936/3-perspectives-standoff-between-covington-catholic-teens-native-american-nathan-phillips

https://apnews.com/90c35b0e3b1f41abbcb28eef7cf4bd9a


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Post by Raggamuffin on Mon Jan 21, 2019 7:43 pm

Nathan Phillips had no need to do anything except mind his own business. If he really wanted to help, he should have told those black guys to shut their mouths. He's making things up and implying that the kids could have attacked him, which is clearly nonsense.

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Post by phildidge on Mon Jan 21, 2019 7:53 pm

Raggamuffin wrote:Nathan Phillips had no need to do anything except mind his own business. If he really wanted to help, he should have told those black guys to shut their mouths. He's making things up and implying that the kids could have attacked him, which is clearly nonsense.

So you think telling them to shut their mouths when already told to by some people including an adult Black american. Was going to stop them? Or that a person of peace should tell people to shut up? He never told the kids to shut up either.

The school will rightly say the the kids, why they did not move away the black supremacists. No school is going to support kids singing, jumping around in basic confrontation back to the Black supremacists, are they? The first to face the flak here, should have been the kids minders, that allowed this to happen. They will also say the school, that the kids should have also moved away from the native Indians. That is how the school will see and blame the kids for their part to play in all of this. As its reflected on the school itself, being their students

Now those kids were waiting for a bus, the lincoln Memorial was part of the native American march

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Post by Raggamuffin on Mon Jan 21, 2019 7:58 pm

I'm very pleased to see that a lot of people are not taken in by this story.

The news channels need to apologise to those boys, and the school needs to apologise to them for automatically blaming them when they did nothing wrong. Nathan Phillips should also apologise to them for making up stories and implying that they would have attacked him, and for playing the victim when he clearly wasn't a victim at all.


Last edited by Raggamuffin on Mon Jan 21, 2019 8:09 pm; edited 1 time in total

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Post by phildidge on Mon Jan 21, 2019 8:05 pm

Raggamuffin wrote:I'm very pleased to see that a lot of people are not taken in by story.

The news channels need to apologise to those boys, and the school needs to apologise to them for automatically blaming them when they did nothing wrong. Nathan Phillips should also apologise to them for making up stories and implying that they would have attacked him, and for playing the victim when he clearly wasn't a victim at all.

Which translates as you not believing mutiple native indians, who claim and now is video evidence they were doing mocking "tomahawk chop."

There is also on the links to more claims of things said. Just because you cannot hear things claimed to be said, in all that noise, does not mean it did not happen. The first thing that the native indians felt was mocking was the haka, and it was mocking. The kids did it all wrong and used it as confrontation themselves.

So again we see a subconcious racial bias by Rags.

Disbelieve the native indians, but believe the white kids

What can i say

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Post by Raggamuffin on Mon Jan 21, 2019 8:47 pm

Thor wrote:
Raggamuffin wrote:I'm very pleased to see that a lot of people are not taken in by story.

The news channels need to apologise to those boys, and the school needs to apologise to them for automatically blaming them when they did nothing wrong. Nathan Phillips should also apologise to them for making up stories and implying that they would have attacked him, and for playing the victim when he clearly wasn't a victim at all.

Which translates as you not believing mutiple native indians, who claim and now is video evidence they were doing mocking "tomahawk chop."

There is also on the links to more claims of things said.  Just because you cannot hear things claimed to be said, in all that noise, does not mean it did not happen. The first thing that the native indians felt was mocking was the haka, and it was mocking. The kids did it all wrong and used it as confrontation themselves.

So again we see a subconcious racial bias by Rags.

Disbelieve the native indians, but believe the white kids

What can i say

Why should I not disbelieve native Americans? Do you think they are better or more honest than anyone else just because they're native Americans. I believe what I see with my own eyes. I see nothing wrong with the haka - loads of people do that, and clearly the boys do it a lot because they knew what to do. They did it before Phillips and his mates arrived anyway.

Why should I disbelieve white boys just because they're white?

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Post by phildidge on Mon Jan 21, 2019 8:51 pm

Raggamuffin wrote:
Thor wrote:

Which translates as you not believing mutiple native indians, who claim and now is video evidence they were doing mocking "tomahawk chop."

There is also on the links to more claims of things said.  Just because you cannot hear things claimed to be said, in all that noise, does not mean it did not happen. The first thing that the native indians felt was mocking was the haka, and it was mocking. The kids did it all wrong and used it as confrontation themselves.

So again we see a subconcious racial bias by Rags.

Disbelieve the native indians, but believe the white kids

What can i say

Why should I not disbelieve native Americans? Do you think they are better or more honest than anyone else just because they're native Americans. I believe what I see with my own eyes. I see nothing wrong with the haka - loads of people do that, and clearly the boys do it a lot because they knew what to do.

Why should I disbelieve white boys just because they're white?

Its up to you what you believe, but it clearly shows a subconcious racial bias to not believe them.

You were not there, so you would never be in a position to know, espcially with all the noise going on

I saw those kids mocking the indian and that is a fact

I also believe most were simple having fun, but some were clearly mocking and their intent was offense

They should be expelled


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Post by Raggamuffin on Mon Jan 21, 2019 8:53 pm

Thor wrote:
Raggamuffin wrote:

Why should I not disbelieve native Americans? Do you think they are better or more honest than anyone else just because they're native Americans. I believe what I see with my own eyes. I see nothing wrong with the haka - loads of people do that, and clearly the boys do it a lot because they knew what to do.

Why should I disbelieve white boys just because they're white?

Its up to you what you believe, but it clearly shows a subconcious racial bias to not believe them.

You were not there, so you would never be in  a position to know, espcially with all the noise going on

I saw those kids mocking the indian  and that is a fact

I also believe most were simple having fun, but some were clearly mocking and their intent was offense

They should be expelled


No it doesn't, it shows that I actually watched what happened, and I'm not in denial like you. You are clearly showing a bias against Catholics because you hate the Catholic Church.

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Post by phildidge on Mon Jan 21, 2019 8:55 pm

I think the smirking kid, should explain why he was smilling at Nathan for so long and if he had integrety. He would even if he felt himself innocent. Apologise to Nathan, based on his view of misreadings. As nathan clearly felt there was. Now that kid would clear himself in seconds, if he apologised in regards to what he claims is confusion.

He never did, though am still open to the view that part of his story are true. What is more telling is the parts he left out.

He should ask to get together with Nathan and have a one to one. It would save him from expulsion and he should reach out to him. I am sure Nathan would also then apologise to him, if they conclude they both misred the situation

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Post by phildidge on Mon Jan 21, 2019 8:56 pm

Raggamuffin wrote:
Thor wrote:

Its up to you what you believe, but it clearly shows a subconcious racial bias to not believe them.

You were not there, so you would never be in  a position to know, espcially with all the noise going on

I saw those kids mocking the indian  and that is a fact

I also believe most were simple having fun, but some were clearly mocking and their intent was offense

They should be expelled


No it doesn't, it shows that I actually watched what happened, and I'm not in denial like you. You are clearly showing a bias against Catholics because you hate the Catholic Church.

Your views, not mine

You are not the judge and jury on this

The school is

Nothing to do with them being Catholic, its about how some were clearly being racist mocking a native indian

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Post by Raggamuffin on Mon Jan 21, 2019 8:58 pm

Thor wrote:
Raggamuffin wrote:

No it doesn't, it shows that I actually watched what happened, and I'm not in denial like you. You are clearly showing a bias against Catholics because you hate the Catholic Church.

Your views, not mine

You are not the judge and jury on this

The school is

Nothing to do with them being Catholic, its about how some were clearly being racist mocking a native indian

Nah, you're against them because they're Catholics. You're the one trying to act like the judge and the jury. Unfortunately, you're completely ignoring all the evidence.

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Post by phildidge on Mon Jan 21, 2019 8:59 pm

Raggamuffin wrote:
Thor wrote:

Your views, not mine

You are not the judge and jury on this

The school is

Nothing to do with them being Catholic, its about how some were clearly being racist mocking a native indian

Nah, you're against them because they're Catholics. You're the one trying to act like the judge and the jury. Unfortunately, you're completely ignoring all the evidence.

Cathy newman alert

I am not the judge and jury

The school will be on this, as those kids represented this school


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Post by Raggamuffin on Mon Jan 21, 2019 9:03 pm

Thor wrote:
Raggamuffin wrote:

Nah, you're against them because they're Catholics. You're the one trying to act like the judge and the jury. Unfortunately, you're completely ignoring all the evidence.

Cathy newman alert

I am not the judge and jury

The school will be on this, as those kids represented this school


So why are you still banging on about it and accusing everyone else of being wrong? Leave it to the school. Frankly, if I was at a school which was so ready to believe some bloke who went up to the boys in that manner, I'd want to leave anyway.

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Post by phildidge on Mon Jan 21, 2019 9:05 pm

Raggamuffin wrote:
Thor wrote:

Cathy newman alert

I am not the judge and jury

The school will be on this, as those kids represented this school


So why are you still banging on about it and accusing everyone else of being wrong? Leave it to the school. Frankly, if I was at a school which was so ready to believe some bloke who went up to the boys in that manner, I'd want to leave anyway.

That is reasoning my opinion

Which I very entittled to do

Like I said, the only people to judge this will be the school
Well we already know you have a subconcious racial bias not to believe a war Vet and man of peace, that fights to save reservations from corporations.

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Post by Maddog on Mon Jan 21, 2019 9:07 pm

Thor wrote:So I see maddog ignored my last 3 posts to him

The reaosn is he knows, as does gelico, they are excusing this because they believe A vietnam Vet was defending racist extremists. A man of peace. Which would mean he would look to defend many people as he did in Vietnam and by now helping former Vets..

Now this is their reason to condemn Nathan. Where he saw about a hundred kids mocking the haka (which is not Tongan but Maori) and heard verbal abuse from the African extremists. He looked at the odds and did not defend either, but stood in betwen playing a traditional song. To later have the kids surround and mock him.

Now I certainly do not defend extremists, but are you saying a man of peace, who had no idea who they belonged to. Saw a small group of Blacks compared to a hundred teenagers, many where pro Trump hats. What sort of other conclusion would also many people come to in that situation?

So to say the mocking of Nathan is justified, because a person of peace should not try to defuse something? You see this is where both Maddog and Gelico are emotionally compremised. They believe the hate, (of which they both spouted against him is justified. Even though one of them supports an extremist in the form of Tommy Robinson and defends him constantly), because Nathan to them should not defend black racist homophobic men. Even though its very doubtfull, that he did not know what group they were. Just as many did not hee, util I said Which you only in hindsight knew were Black hebrew Isaralites, as you were clueless to this. I had to say this to clear up gelico's clanger.

Now whether you rightly think the Black extremists are scum, they were massivgelly out numbered, so how will that look to some people?

Hence the only reason you both thinks its okay to demean and spout hate, thinking the mocking is justified. Is based on an emotional view, that he should not have wanted to defuse a situation involving these men. That is their sole reason to be hateful and justify the kids mocking

By such stupidity, they just made hate justified by the extremist blacks, through your own justification of hate.
See how it works?

The point they miss

What they both fail to recoignise is the schools will see their kids out for a day, acting like idiots and even worse mocking a native Indian. The school will judge them based on showing up the school and there is no excuse for their behaviour. Just as there is no excuse for the hate spouted by the Black supremacists. Just as there is no excuse for the hate Gelico spouted against a man of peace. Who has done far more and fought for his country, to then have some mindless Trump drone, demean him in the worst possible way.

Whatevs! tongue

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Post by phildidge on Mon Jan 21, 2019 9:08 pm

Maddog wrote:
Thor wrote:So I see maddog ignored my last 3 posts to him

The reaosn is he knows, as does gelico, they are excusing this because they believe A vietnam Vet was defending racist extremists. A man of peace. Which would mean he would look to defend many people as he did in Vietnam and by now helping former Vets..

Now this is their reason to condemn Nathan. Where he saw about a hundred kids mocking the haka (which is not Tongan but Maori) and heard verbal abuse from the African extremists. He looked at the odds and did not defend either, but stood in betwen playing a traditional song. To later have the kids surround and mock him.

Now I certainly do not defend extremists, but are you saying a man of peace, who had no idea who they belonged to. Saw a small group of Blacks compared to a hundred teenagers, many where pro Trump hats. What sort of other conclusion would also many people come to in that situation?

So to say the mocking of Nathan is justified, because a person of peace should not try to defuse something? You see this is where both Maddog and Gelico are emotionally compremised. They believe the hate, (of which they both spouted against him is justified. Even though one of them supports an extremist in the form of Tommy Robinson and defends him constantly), because Nathan to them should not defend black racist homophobic men. Even though its very doubtfull, that he did not know what group they were. Just as many did not hee, util I said Which you only in hindsight knew were Black hebrew Isaralites, as you were clueless to this. I had to say this to clear up gelico's clanger.

Now whether you rightly think the Black extremists are scum, they were massivgelly out numbered, so how will that look to some people?

Hence the only reason you both thinks its okay to demean and spout hate, thinking the mocking is justified. Is based on an emotional view, that he should not have wanted to defuse a situation involving these men. That is their sole reason to be hateful and justify the kids mocking

By such stupidity, they just made hate justified by the extremist blacks, through your own justification of hate.
See how it works?

The point they miss

What they both fail to recoignise is the schools will see their kids out for a day, acting like idiots and even worse mocking a native Indian. The school will judge them based on showing up the school and there is no excuse for their behaviour. Just as there is no excuse for the hate spouted by the Black supremacists. Just as there is no excuse for the hate Gelico spouted against a man of peace. Who has done far more and fought for his country, to then have some mindless Trump drone, demean him in the worst possible way.

Whatevs! tongue  

You are welcome mate Laughing

Have a good evening


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Post by Raggamuffin on Mon Jan 21, 2019 9:14 pm

Thor wrote:
Raggamuffin wrote:

So why are you still banging on about it and accusing everyone else of being wrong? Leave it to the school. Frankly, if I was at a school which was so ready to believe some bloke who went up to the boys in that manner, I'd want to leave anyway.

That is reasoning my opinion

Which I very entittled to do

Like I said, the only people to judge this will be the school
Well we already know you have a subconcious racial bias not to believe a war Vet and man of peace, that fights to save reservations from corporations.

Why should I believe him? He has made up stuff about this incident already. Why do you believe him? Just because he says he's a war vet and a man of peace, or just because he's a native American?

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Post by Raggamuffin on Mon Jan 21, 2019 9:23 pm

What did he mean by "Vietnam times veteran" anyway?

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Post by Maddog on Mon Jan 21, 2019 10:15 pm

Raggamuffin wrote:What did he mean by "Vietnam times veteran" anyway?


Who is he?

My father was a Korean era veteran. He didn't deploy to Korea, so he would never call himself a Korean war vet?

Is Phillips calling himself a Vietnam era vet?

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Post by Guest on Mon Jan 21, 2019 10:20 pm


Kambree Kawahine Koa

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I am Native and I chose to stay quiet until I had all of the facts regarding Covington Catholic incident. I disavow Native Nathan Phillips. He did opposite of whats taught.



Kambree Kawahine Koa

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I hope and pray his elders take a look into his behavior and he has all of his leadership roles stripped away from him when it comes to working with youth. This is disturbing and does not reflect the goodness of Native peoples



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The "news" media is trying to save face by treating this as an act of courage, but was it really? Nathan's _not_ pounding his drum inches from the hate-filled "Black Hebrew Israelites" bigot's face because it's likely that doing so would get Nathan's own face pounded.


WolfGhost


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Exactly. Elders are supposed to TEACH and NURTURE young people, not HATE AND INTIMIDATE THEM because they are TRIGGERED BY A DAMNED HAT!


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I am also Native American.

I'm embarrassed about the behavior of #NathanPhillips

He does not represent me.



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#OjibwePride Nathan Phillips instigated the situation he should be arrested for harassment





and it goes on and on and on


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Post by Maddog on Mon Jan 21, 2019 10:38 pm

Raggamuffin wrote:What did he mean by "Vietnam times veteran" anyway?


https://thisainthell.us/blog/?p=84414&cpage=1

No one is really sure.

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Post by Maddog on Mon Jan 21, 2019 10:43 pm

WhoseYourWolfie wrote:Arrow

Seeng the crap that some of our resident racists have written over these last two pages,  it doesn't surprise me in the least that some of our more moderate members haven't been posting on here recently...

It's way past time that that the racist and neo-nazi apologists and trolls the likes of Tommy, gelico, Ragga' and Horatio reined in their white supremacist and self-entitled crappola..

Or it could be that some posters are turned off by the name calling around here. tongue

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Post by WhoseYourWolfie on Tue Jan 22, 2019 12:07 am

Maddog wrote:
WhoseYourWolfie wrote:
Idea

Point of Order :

Is that a proper haka orchestrated by a bunch of rugby-loving Kiwis...

Or a half-baked pale imitation used to mock the Maoris..

The insulting pseudo-mock-"haka" in the o/p says more about the racist little shits harassing native Americans, more then any of the "fake news" reports that you have been dragging out of your arse in your puerile efforts to defend and excuse that unruly mob of self-entitled whitebread punks.

It's performed by a school with a small Tongan population.  

Which fake news did I drag out?

Idea

Rugby Union is strong across the South Pacific --  not just in New Zealand, but also Tonga, Fiji, Samoa, New Guinea, as well as Australia...

While the "haka" originally belongs to the Maoris, it has been adopted by other rugby nations as well --  not just their fellow (Ploynesian) Pacific islanders, but teams like England, Scotland and France have been seen using it..

Having the likes of Maoris, Tongans or Samoans introducing it adds that legitimacy and authenticity to it --  something that is obviously lacking in the mocking and juvenile efforts from those braindead highschool pondscum shown up in the O/P.

**********************************************************

Fake news ?

Those claims being made by the 'Tennessee Star', for one example...

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Post by Maddog on Tue Jan 22, 2019 12:21 am

WhoseYourWolfie wrote:
Maddog wrote:

It's performed by a school with a small Tongan population.  

Which fake news did I drag out?

Idea

Rugby Union is strong across the South Pacific --  not just in New Zealand, but also Tonga, Fiji, Samoa, New Guinea, as well as Australia...

While the "haka" originally belongs to the Maoris, it has been adopted by other rugby nations as well --  not just their fellow (Ploynesian) Pacific islanders, but teams like England, Scotland and France have been seen using it..

Having the likes of Maoris, Tongans or Samoans introducing it adds that legitimacy and authenticity to it --  something that is obviously lacking in the mocking and juvenile efforts from those braindead highschool pondscum shown up in the O/P.

**********************************************************

Fake news ?

Those claims being made by the 'Tennessee Star', for one example...

These kids are not playing rugby either. I don't have a clue if some form of a haka is part of their school cheers and such. I'm not sure it even matters.


https://twitter.com/RepJohnYarmuth?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7Ctwcamp%5Etweetembed%7Ctwterm%5E1087008928909742081&ref_url=https%3A%2F%2Frutgers.forums.rivals.com%2Fthreads%2Ffashion-police-kentucky-congressman-calls-for-a-maga-hat-ban-for-teens.160931%2F


His twitter page. He claims he was kidding. You be the judge.

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Post by phildidge on Tue Jan 22, 2019 1:44 am

Maddog wrote:
Raggamuffin wrote:What did he mean by "Vietnam times veteran" anyway?


https://thisainthell.us/blog/?p=84414&cpage=1

No one is really sure.

Are you now attemtping to further deligitimize someone that was a vietnam vet and helps Vietnam vet?

Unbelieveable and Gelico uses twitter accounts, which nobody can verify if true

Even if true that some native Indians are against him, I bet there are not traditional, and Trump supporters

I mean hat is that to prove anyway?

That we have a campaign, with the likes of people like Gelico, who's objective is to runa campaign of hate against him? That they are vile hateful people?

Welcome to the hateful of world of extremism by Gelico it seems and all because this man stands for peace.

wow

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Post by phildidge on Tue Jan 22, 2019 1:46 am

Maddog wrote:
WhoseYourWolfie wrote:
Idea

Rugby Union is strong across the South Pacific --  not just in New Zealand, but also Tonga, Fiji, Samoa, New Guinea, as well as Australia...

While the "haka" originally belongs to the Maoris, it has been adopted by other rugby nations as well --  not just their fellow (Ploynesian) Pacific islanders, but teams like England, Scotland and France have been seen using it..

Having the likes of Maoris, Tongans or Samoans introducing it adds that legitimacy and authenticity to it --  something that is obviously lacking in the mocking and juvenile efforts from those braindead highschool pondscum shown up in the O/P.

**********************************************************

Fake news ?

Those claims being made by the 'Tennessee Star', for one example...

These kids are not playing rugby either. I don't have a clue if some form of a haka is part of their school cheers and such. I'm not sure it even matters.  


https://twitter.com/RepJohnYarmuth?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7Ctwcamp%5Etweetembed%7Ctwterm%5E1087008928909742081&ref_url=https%3A%2F%2Frutgers.forums.rivals.com%2Fthreads%2Ffashion-police-kentucky-congressman-calls-for-a-maga-hat-ban-for-teens.160931%2F


His twitter page. He claims he was kidding. You be the judge.

Of course it would matte to native people, if they were mocking the dance of another native people

Of course he is going to claim he is joking after, but this again shows the lack of respect of these kids

What makes me laugh is how now twitter is used as evidence

Seriously

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Post by WhoseYourWolfie on Tue Jan 22, 2019 1:47 am

Maddog wrote:
WhoseYourWolfie wrote:
Idea

Rugby Union is strong across the South Pacific --  not just in New Zealand, but also Tonga, Fiji, Samoa, New Guinea, as well as Australia...

While the "haka" originally belongs to the Maoris, it has been adopted by other rugby nations as well --  not just their fellow (Ploynesian) Pacific islanders, but teams like England, Scotland and France have been seen using it..

Having the likes of Maoris, Tongans or Samoans introducing it adds that legitimacy and authenticity to it --  something that is obviously lacking in the mocking and juvenile efforts from those braindead highschool pondscum shown up in the O/P.

**********************************************************

Fake news ?

Those claims being made by the 'Tennessee Star', for one example...

These kids are not playing rugby either. I don't have a clue if some form of a haka is part of their school cheers and such. I'm not sure it even matters.  

........................................
Idea

The sports involved doesn't matter -- their cultural backgrounds do...

You need to learn a bit about the Polynesian & Melanesian cultures, before turning your earlier comment into an irrelevancy, in regard to these Catholic school punks racist behaviours..

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Post by phildidge on Tue Jan 22, 2019 1:52 am

Maybe some of you espcially that extremist gelico actually read some history and books on native American Indians or actually know some like myself, before taking your que from twitter. I mean that is so embarressing to say the least that what he was doing was not traditional. Well that exposes those claiming this for lying, because what he did is traditional, but another elder. So they would be judging this other elder and Gelico claims I am the sheep?

May I suggest you educate yoruself and if Cass saw the crap you weree coming out with Gelico, she would be appalled

THis is what the world is coming to today, those with a clearly hateful agenda

All because some clearly suck up to another hateful idot called Trump

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Post by phildidge on Tue Jan 22, 2019 1:59 am

PICTURED: Kentucky students from the same Catholic high school as the teens who taunted a Native American man were allowed to don BLACKFACE at their sports events - and openly goaded African American players

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-6616793/Kentucky-Catholic-high-school-Lincoln-Memorial-clash-allowed-blackface-pep-rallies.html

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Post by phildidge on Tue Jan 22, 2019 2:14 am

The Power of Nathan Phillips’s Song

I am honored to know the Omaha Nation elder and activist Nathan Phillips. I walked nearly 40 miles in the snow and ice alongside him last February, in a four-day prayer walk he organized in North Dakota to offer a healing for the land and for fellow water protectors who were part of the Standing Rock movement to stop the Dakota Access Pipeline. When I woke early Saturday to see video footage of him at the Lincoln Memorial surrounded by a group of smirking white high school students in MAGA hats, I was livid, disgusted, and ashamed for this country.

Phillips had traveled from his home in Michigan for the first-ever Indigenous Peoples March in Washington; the Covington Catholic High School students had come from their Cincinnati suburb for the March for Life, an antiabortion rally. Phillips told The New York Times that he had interceded in what seemed about to become a fight between the students and some nearby protesters: “I stepped in to pray,” he said. The resulting videos show Phillips peacefully drumming, singing, and encircled by teens wearing MAGA hats and Trump merchandise that paid homage to a president who less than two weeks earlier had ridiculed the 1890 massacre by U.S. cavalry of hundreds of Native Americans at Wounded Knee, South Dakota, one of the worst symbols of settler brutality in modern American history. What has stayed with me, though, is not the callous or racist expressions of the boys, some of whom mocked the singing or made “tomahawk chop” gestures with their arms, but Phillips’s grace, strength, and resilience in the face of it.

Shortly after the video went viral in the news and on social media, the indigenous-led collective Seeding Sovereignty began sharing photos of Phillips on Instagram—pictures that showed the person who was speedily becoming an icon for enduring racism at the hands of white entitlement. The organizers behind Seeding Sovereignty wrote of working through their own complicated and emotional reactions to the video, and attested to the generosity Phillips displayed: “The way we see it, uncle blessed them in spite of their behavior because he knows our ancestral teachings. Many of us love to say we are rising in beauty, but how many of us put that sentiment into action?”

https://www.vogue.com/article/nathan-phillips-activist-song-peaceful-resistance-hope

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Post by Maddog on Tue Jan 22, 2019 2:22 am

I Failed the Covington Catholic Test

Next time there’s a viral story, I’ll wait for more facts to emerge.


https://www.theatlantic.com/ideas/archive/2019/01/julie-irwin-zimmerman-i-failed-covington-catholic-test/580897/?fbclid=IwAR3HRLnz5TpOqbXJd44IJPy207rwAZ4BJ_Yi0vm4NkbH2LIQ-JpAoFWugUo


Thankfully, there are more folks coming forward and this "incident" will soon fade into obscurity.

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Post by Maddog on Tue Jan 22, 2019 2:23 am

Thor wrote:The Power of Nathan Phillips’s Song

I am honored to know the Omaha Nation elder and activist Nathan Phillips. I walked nearly 40 miles in the snow and ice alongside him last February, in a four-day prayer walk he organized in North Dakota to offer a healing for the land and for fellow water protectors who were part of the Standing Rock movement to stop the Dakota Access Pipeline. When I woke early Saturday to see video footage of him at the Lincoln Memorial surrounded by a group of smirking white high school students in MAGA hats, I was livid, disgusted, and ashamed for this country.

Phillips had traveled from his home in Michigan for the first-ever Indigenous Peoples March in Washington; the Covington Catholic High School students had come from their Cincinnati suburb for the March for Life, an antiabortion rally. Phillips told The New York Times that he had interceded in what seemed about to become a fight between the students and some nearby protesters: “I stepped in to pray,” he said. The resulting videos show Phillips peacefully drumming, singing, and encircled by teens wearing MAGA hats and Trump merchandise that paid homage to a president who less than two weeks earlier had ridiculed the 1890 massacre by U.S. cavalry of hundreds of Native Americans at Wounded Knee, South Dakota, one of the worst symbols of settler brutality in modern American history. What has stayed with me, though, is not the callous or racist expressions of the boys, some of whom mocked the singing or made “tomahawk chop” gestures with their arms, but Phillips’s grace, strength, and resilience in the face of it.

Shortly after the video went viral in the news and on social media, the indigenous-led collective Seeding Sovereignty began sharing photos of Phillips on Instagram—pictures that showed the person who was speedily becoming an icon for enduring racism at the hands of white entitlement. The organizers behind Seeding Sovereignty wrote of working through their own complicated and emotional reactions to the video, and attested to the generosity Phillips displayed: “The way we see it, uncle blessed them in spite of their behavior because he knows our ancestral teachings. Many of us love to say we are rising in beauty, but how many of us put that sentiment into action?”

https://www.vogue.com/article/nathan-phillips-activist-song-peaceful-resistance-hope

There was no power in that song. You see young men about to do something wrong, you speak to them. You don't beat a fucking drum in their face and tell them to go back to Europe. tongue

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Post by phildidge on Tue Jan 22, 2019 2:26 am

March For Life teen's confrontation with Native American reveals an ugly divide

I attended the March for Life probably 20 times, first as a child with my family and later as an adult. There exist several pro-life groups that span the political spectrum -- and I identified with those fighting for women's rights and justice. I stopped attending several years ago however, when it became more about propping up right-wing ideology and less about protecting human life at all stages.

This year's March for Life was probably the most ideological -- and disturbing -- yet.
Vice President Mike Pence and his wife, Karen Pence, made a surprise visit to the Friday event, and the crowd cheered. After Pence's own words of encouragement, a prerecorded video message from Failing Cheeto-Faced Ferret-Wearing Shit Gibbon was played. "Today, I have signed a letter to Congress to make clear that if they send any legislation to my desk that weakens the protection of human life, I will issue a veto," the President said.
Since the March for Life and many of its attendees put their support behind this President, who treats people poorly in word and deed, pro-lifers should not be surprised at how their march has been widely perceived -- particularly given an egregious incident that transpired during the event this year.

A group of young men from Covington Catholic High School in Kentucky appeared to taunt a Native American man who had been participating in the nearby Indigenous Peoples March. Nathan Phillips, the Vietnam Veteran and an elder of the Omaha tribe, says he heard the young men chanting, "Build that wall" -- though those chants could not heard in the videos obtained by CNN. Many have noted the ridiculousness that such a cheer would represent when directed at a Native American.

That Phillips says he heard it illustrates what many perceive, not without some justification, to be a truth about Trump and his supporters -- that, among other things, the wall is a symbol of white supremacy, a monument to dividing America into two camps: those who support Trump, and those who have no right to be here.

By now, a myriad of videos have shown the gathering from every conceivable angle. They mostly feature the face of one student, Nick Sandmann -- who appears to be smirking, and has now come forward -- as he stared down the elder, while a crowd of his fellow students all wearing red-and-white "Make America Great Again" hats gathered around, laughing, and seeming to mock-sing along with Phillips' chant.

Some students seemed to be making "tomahawk chop" gestures, and doing cartoonish versions of Native American dances -- both reminiscent of sporting events where Native Americans are used as mascots.

I don't know the whole story of the clash between these young men and the others, as I was not there. I've watched over two hours of footage now, showing every angle, close-ups, wide shots and the exchange with the religious group known as the black Hebrew Israelites.

According to Elder Phillips, in an interview with the Detroit Free Press, a confrontation between the students and the religious group is what prompted him to begin his song to try to defuse the tension. In a statement to CNN, Sandmann said he was smiling, not smirking, "....because I wanted him to know that I was not going to become angry, intimidated or be provoked into a larger confrontation."
Undoubtedly, Sandmann, a high school junior, is overwhelmed and confused by the national spectacle that has arisen from this one hour of his life, and I can appreciate that he himself may not realize the significance of his behavior and the behavior of his fellow students. That their chaperones didn't directly intervene long before Phillips saw fit to do so is puzzling, given the inflammatory and offensive accusations spoken clearly by the black Hebrew Israelite protesters.

Sandmann has said that he didn't hear or witness any student chant "build that wall" or anything hateful, and that the students were doing their school spirit chant.
Whatever happened, the "spirit" and optics here are disturbing.

When I look at all the footage of these young men and see their hats, their scarves, their Trump 2020 and their "Make America Great Again" gear, here is what I see: A microcosm of a movement that has sold itself to a carnival barker making empty promises. They collectively support and admire a man who said Mexicans were "bringing crime. They're rapists." When the President tweets his schoolyard insults about various Democrats, those students are reading and learning by example. When Trump uses the massacre of Native peoples at Wounded Knee as part of a targeted joke against Sen. Elizabeth Warren, whom he calls Pocahontas, young people learn that mocking Indigenous people is acceptable.

And at this moment, our government is shut down while the President demands a wall on our southern border.

For the past seven months, I have volunteered with Immigrant Families Together, an organization helping to reunite families separated under this administration's draconian zero-tolerance policy.
I have witnessed the "anti-life" policies of this President firsthand. I've seen the result of mothers separated from their children and pregnant women kept in detention. And yet the people, many wearing "Make America Great Again" hats and carrying signs thanking the President for protecting life, at the March for Life cheered victoriously for this administration.

As the attendees applauded Trump's recorded message, were they ignoring his complete and utter disregard for the lives of these people? Or worse, do they agree with him?

https://edition.cnn.com/2019/01/21/opinions/march-for-life-maga-hat-teens-native-american-protest-morson/index.html



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Post by phildidge on Tue Jan 22, 2019 2:28 am

Maddog wrote:
Thor wrote:The Power of Nathan Phillips’s Song

I am honored to know the Omaha Nation elder and activist Nathan Phillips. I walked nearly 40 miles in the snow and ice alongside him last February, in a four-day prayer walk he organized in North Dakota to offer a healing for the land and for fellow water protectors who were part of the Standing Rock movement to stop the Dakota Access Pipeline. When I woke early Saturday to see video footage of him at the Lincoln Memorial surrounded by a group of smirking white high school students in MAGA hats, I was livid, disgusted, and ashamed for this country.

Phillips had traveled from his home in Michigan for the first-ever Indigenous Peoples March in Washington; the Covington Catholic High School students had come from their Cincinnati suburb for the March for Life, an antiabortion rally. Phillips told The New York Times that he had interceded in what seemed about to become a fight between the students and some nearby protesters: “I stepped in to pray,” he said. The resulting videos show Phillips peacefully drumming, singing, and encircled by teens wearing MAGA hats and Trump merchandise that paid homage to a president who less than two weeks earlier had ridiculed the 1890 massacre by U.S. cavalry of hundreds of Native Americans at Wounded Knee, South Dakota, one of the worst symbols of settler brutality in modern American history. What has stayed with me, though, is not the callous or racist expressions of the boys, some of whom mocked the singing or made “tomahawk chop” gestures with their arms, but Phillips’s grace, strength, and resilience in the face of it.

Shortly after the video went viral in the news and on social media, the indigenous-led collective Seeding Sovereignty began sharing photos of Phillips on Instagram—pictures that showed the person who was speedily becoming an icon for enduring racism at the hands of white entitlement. The organizers behind Seeding Sovereignty wrote of working through their own complicated and emotional reactions to the video, and attested to the generosity Phillips displayed: “The way we see it, uncle blessed them in spite of their behavior because he knows our ancestral teachings. Many of us love to say we are rising in beauty, but how many of us put that sentiment into action?”

https://www.vogue.com/article/nathan-phillips-activist-song-peaceful-resistance-hope

There was no power in that song. You see young men about to do something wrong, you speak to them. You don't beat a fucking drum in their face and tell them to go back to Europe. tongue

Well considering you see this as jus beating a drum, really shows the lack of education people in the US have of native Indians and their culture

He never told then to go back to Europe

He sang a traditional song

Which he was never in the kids face and the drum was near the kids face to the side of him

That is not in his face and that kid continually smirked at him, whilst others took the piss

This shows the nature of the pure growing racism and hate of America

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Post by Maddog on Tue Jan 22, 2019 2:29 am

Sandmann has said that he didn't hear or witness any student chant "build that wall" or anything hateful, and that the students were doing their school spirit chant.


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Post by Maddog on Tue Jan 22, 2019 2:31 am

Thor wrote:
Maddog wrote:

There was no power in that song. You see young men about to do something wrong, you speak to them. You don't beat a fucking drum in their face and tell them to go back to Europe. tongue

Well considering you see this as jus beating a drum, really shows the lack of education people in the US have of native Indians and their culture

He never told then to go back to Europe

He sang a traditional song

Which he was never in the kids face and the drum was near the kids face to the side of him

That is not in his face and that kid continually smirked at him, whilst others took the piss

This shows the nature of the pure growing racism and hate of America

He was beating a fucking drum. Would you like to translate to me what exactly those drumbeats meant?

Maybe they were the drums of war?

Here is one thing that is certain. You, me and that kid don't have a clue what it meant.

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Post by phildidge on Tue Jan 22, 2019 2:32 am

Maddog wrote:Sandmann has said that he didn't hear or witness any student chant "build that wall" or anything hateful, and that the students were doing their school spirit chant.


Yes he claims that, others claim different

Of course they are going to claim otherwise through damage limitation

People clearly see in the video people mocking the Indian

How is he did not see that or mention that?

Because his letter of defense was staged managed by clearly his parents or others.

I have no doubt some of those Trump supporting kids said some of the things claimed

The kid may not of heard them, which is possible with so many people and so much noise

Tha again does not mean it did not hapen and again we see the same problem

A subconcious racial bias

Believe the white kid but not the native Indian

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Post by Maddog on Tue Jan 22, 2019 2:33 am

I'm not sure if you are aware of this, but American Indians speak English which is the best way to talk to a white teenage boy.



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Post by Maddog on Tue Jan 22, 2019 2:34 am

Thor wrote:
Maddog wrote:Sandmann has said that he didn't hear or witness any student chant "build that wall" or anything hateful, and that the students were doing their school spirit chant.


Yes he claims that, others claim different

Of course they are going to claim  otherwise through damage limitation

People clearly see in the video people mocking the Indian

How is he did not see that or mention  that?

Because his letter of defense was staged managed by clearly his parents or others.

I have no doubt some of those Trump supporting kids said some of the things claimed

The kid may not of heard them, which is possible with so many people and so much noise

Tha again does not mean it did not hapen and again we see the same problem

A subconcious racial bias

Believe the white kid but not the native Indian

Why not believe the white kid? He just stood there and minded his business. Who was the dumb fuck that thought he needed to beat a drum in his face?

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Post by phildidge on Tue Jan 22, 2019 2:35 am

Maddog wrote:
Thor wrote:

Well considering you see this as jus beating a drum, really shows the lack of education people in the US have of native Indians and their culture

He never told then to go back to Europe

He sang a traditional song

Which he was never in the kids face and the drum was near the kids face to the side of him

That is not in his face and that kid continually smirked at him, whilst others took the piss

This shows the nature of the pure growing racism and hate of America

He was beating a fucking drum. Would you like to translate to me what exactly those drumbeats meant?

Maybe they were the drums of war?

Here is one thing that is certain. You, me and that kid don't have a clue what it meant.

He was singing a tradtional song song you ignorant uneducated moron

What next that marchs with drums, should now be banned to you?

More evidence of now a subconcious racism

That the drums was now drums of war?

What an idiot you just made yourself look mate

As to translating what drums beats are, that shows an ignorance of never having studied Music

I have had to interpret the works of Vivaldi, Mozart et con their music, where no words were sung

Did I need words to translate the music?

You really need to go back to school and he was not simple banging a drum

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