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Post by HoratioTarr on Mon Nov 12, 2018 10:08 am

Do you have one? Would you have one? If no, why not?

according to research conducted by comparethemarket.com, one in five people do not want one.

The Government had originally said that every household would be set up with a smart meter by 2020 - and nearly seven million have been installed so far - but in June the Government subtly downgraded this requirement. Now every home will be "offered" a smart meter by 2020, with no obligation to take one.

The controversy around smart meters is more so because it is the Government's job to set overall energy policy, not the job of suppliers, and the move away from carbon-based energy sources, the national roll-out of smart meters, and the expansion of renewables and nuclear power has cost consequences, with the consumer expected to pick up the tab.

Every household will, ultimately, pay for the new meter roll-out via their bills. As energy companies are quick to say, this is one reason why bills are rising.

But should you get one? These are six key considerations.

Smart meters could make it harder to switch gas and electricity providers
Smart meters don't bring an end to estimated bills (or billing errors)
Smart meters won't work if you have a poor signal in your area
The display units linked to smart meters are crude and difficult to understand
There's little evidence so far that smart meters will save energy - or money
Smart meters 'pose security and other risks'

And all this without the unknown quantity of the electromagnetic radiation which is the same energy used by cell phones. Is the claim that this kind of radiation is perfectly safe just industry spin? They are capable, as with your Smart TV, of spying on you.






https://www.telegraph.co.uk/money/consumer-affairs/six-reasons-say-no-smart-meter/
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Post by HoratioTarr on Mon Nov 12, 2018 10:23 am

The children with autism doubles every five years. Parkinsons, MS, behavourial problems are all exploding since the 1970's. All linked to exposure of increased levels of electromagnetic radiation.
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Post by HoratioTarr on Mon Nov 12, 2018 10:41 am

And has anyone questioned why the bee population is under threat? There's also suspicions that this might not be entirely down to the use of insecticides and pollution and chemtrails.
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Post by Jules on Mon Nov 12, 2018 1:15 pm

HoratioTarr wrote:Do you have one?   Would you have one?   If no, why not?

according to research conducted by comparethemarket.com, one in five people do not want one.

The Government had originally said that every household would be set up with a smart meter by 2020 - and nearly seven million have been installed so far - but in June the Government subtly downgraded this requirement. Now every home will be "offered" a smart meter by 2020, with no obligation to take one.

The controversy around smart meters is more so because it is the Government's job to set overall energy policy, not the job of suppliers, and the move away from carbon-based energy sources, the national roll-out of smart meters, and the expansion of renewables and nuclear power has cost consequences, with the consumer expected to pick up the tab.

Every household will, ultimately, pay for the new meter roll-out via their bills.
As energy companies are quick to say, this is one reason why bills are rising.

But should you get one? These are six key considerations.

Smart meters could make it harder to switch gas and electricity providers
Smart meters don't bring an end to estimated bills (or billing errors)
Smart meters won't work if you have a poor signal in your area
The display units linked to smart meters are crude and difficult to understand
There's little evidence so far that smart meters will save energy - or money
Smart meters 'pose security and other risks'

And all this without the unknown quantity of the electromagnetic radiation which is the same energy used by cell phones.     Is the claim that this kind of radiation is perfectly safe just industry spin?    They are capable, as with your Smart TV, of spying on you.  






https://www.telegraph.co.uk/money/consumer-affairs/six-reasons-say-no-smart-meter/

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Post by nicko on Mon Nov 12, 2018 4:14 pm

I'v got one,never bother looking at it. Only use Gas and Electric when you need it, Heating ,cooking etc. So how can it make you use less ?
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Post by Vintage on Mon Nov 12, 2018 4:22 pm

Exactly my thoughts Nicko as well as all the other stuff mentioned.
You use what you need to use unless money is no object.

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Post by Tommy Monk on Mon Nov 12, 2018 7:16 pm


What is the point of these new "smart meters"...?



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Post by Original Quill on Mon Nov 12, 2018 7:32 pm

Tommy Monk wrote:
What is the point of these new "smart meters"...?

To eliminate the jobs of meter maids.

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Post by HoratioTarr on Mon Nov 12, 2018 11:44 pm

Tommy Monk wrote:
What is the point of these new "smart meters"...?



Control.
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Post by veya_victaous on Mon Nov 12, 2018 11:48 pm

the smart meters themselves are fine, they just have a digital display and wifi connection instead of a Manual gauges and tickers. 

they mean we no longer need someone to physically come a read the meter and if you have it setup you can track your energy usage information (most of the providers offer an App with the smart meter) rather than just saying 'You used some much this month' it can give you an hourly breakdown of power usage.

Combined with Solar panels you can reduce your draw from the grid (Power Bill) by scheduling power usage (pool pumps, washing machines etc) during the day when your generating power (since you sell it to the grid for less than you buy from the grid Using your own power is the most cost efficient)

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Post by HoratioTarr on Mon Nov 12, 2018 11:49 pm

veya_victaous wrote:the smart meters themselves are fine, they just have a digital display and wifi connection instead of a Manual gauges and tickers. 

they mean we no longer need someone to physically come a read the meter and if you have it setup you can track your energy usage information (most of the providers offer an App with the smart meter) rather than just saying 'You used some much this month' it can give you an hourly breakdown of power usage.

Combined with Solar panels you can reduce your draw from the grid (Power Bill) by scheduling power usage (pool pumps, washing machines etc) during the day when your generating power (since you sell it to the grid for less than you buy from the grid Using your own power is the most cost efficient)

mmmm...they do other things too. This is spin we are being given. But I do suspect there's more to it. Aside from the jobs that will be lost too.
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Post by Vintage on Tue Nov 13, 2018 12:14 am

I heard you have to get a new one every time you decide to change suppliers.

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Post by veya_victaous on Tue Nov 13, 2018 12:23 am

It will allow them to cut or 'shape' power supplied (but if you don't like having to 'share' services you can always buy Panels and Battery)

so an example down here is they could set a limit on how many kW you can draw in 'peak summer' so the grid doesn't get overloaded with too many Air-conditioners running.

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Post by veya_victaous on Tue Nov 13, 2018 12:24 am

Vintage wrote:I heard you have to get a new one every time you decide to change suppliers.


there is definitely no technical reason for that 

it is just Shitty Suppliers, if you guys are being told that in the UK  Wink

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Post by Tommy Monk on Tue Nov 13, 2018 1:03 am

veya_victaous wrote:the smart meters themselves are fine, they just have a digital display and wifi connection instead of a Manual gauges and tickers. 

they mean we no longer need someone to physically come a read the meter and if you have it setup you can track your energy usage information (most of the providers offer an App with the smart meter) rather than just saying 'You used some much this month' it can give you an hourly breakdown of power usage.

Combined with Solar panels you can reduce your draw from the grid (Power Bill) by scheduling power usage (pool pumps, washing machines etc) during the day when your generating power (since you sell it to the grid for less than you buy from the grid Using your own power is the most cost efficient)


Well... here in UK we don't need anyone to come read the meters, cos we can read them ourselves and submit these readings to the suppliers ourselves, and the suppliers are happy to accept these readings as actual readings... we can even take pictures and email them in if required...


Also... I don't have solar panels, and am never likely to either at my current address... And if any were ever fitted to the roof of where I live, they wouldn't be owned by me, or any direct benefit to me, as a 3rd party would own any of the electricity produced by them...


(I don't have a pool either... btw...!!!)


I also don't need a detailed timeline breakdown of my energy usage... I'm not an idiot, and I am already well aware that I will use more energy during the times when I am indoors than when I am not indoors... plus I don't want to be paying any of the extra costs involved in the setup/running/maintenance of the systems that will be needed to collect and collate all this unnecessary usage data, or pay towards the costs of the people who would be involved in it either...


So... for me... what's the point of these new "smart meters"...?


All I can see is that it's an unnecessarily change, of no benefit to myself, but that will be costing me money, and inconvenience me by having to make time to be home to have to put up with some strangers coming round and installing the damn things...!


Oh... And I nearly forgot... these meters also give the power to whoever controls them, to be able to turn your supply off, any time they want, remotely, at the push of a button...!!!



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Post by veya_victaous on Tue Nov 13, 2018 2:18 am

Nothing tommy, there is nothing in it for you personally

But for Not obsolete people, the community and the planet there is plenty of advantages/improvements

AND 
Who give a fuck what you want? 
Seriously I mean Based on the effort put into your opinions, Why Would you expect  anyone to give even the slightest thought to what You want?
You want Stupid things and Want to ignore things that need to action
So YES 100% Society Has to Ignore what you want entirely, What you want is of ZERO relevance to anyone that wants a future.


All I can see is an Selfish Obsolete twat putting everyone's future at risk cause he is a lazy piece of shit 
Society would be better of eliminating useless individuals with the attitude of 

it's an unnecessarily change, of no benefit to myself, but that will be costing me money, and inconvenience me by having to make time to be home to have to put up with some strangers coming round and installing the damn things

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Post by Raggamuffin on Tue Nov 13, 2018 8:19 am

veya_victaous wrote:Nothing tommy, there is nothing in it for you personally

But for Not obsolete people, the community and the planet there is plenty of advantages/improvements

AND 
Who give a fuck what you want? 
Seriously I mean Based on the effort put into your opinions, Why Would you expect  anyone to give even the slightest thought to what You want?
You want Stupid things and Want to ignore things that need to action
So YES 100% Society Has to Ignore what you want entirely, What you want is of ZERO relevance to anyone that wants a future.


All I can see is an Selfish Obsolete twat putting everyone's future at risk cause he is a lazy piece of shit 
Society would be better of eliminating useless individuals with the attitude of 

it's an unnecessarily change, of no benefit to myself, but that will be costing me money, and inconvenience me by having to make time to be home to have to put up with some strangers coming round and installing the damn things

That was a bit OTT. He was only saying why he wouldn't want a smart meter.

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Post by veya_victaous on Tue Nov 13, 2018 9:25 am

yeah it was a bit OTT

but it is that 'whats in it for me' attitude that has created the whole problem in the first place

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Post by Raggamuffin on Tue Nov 13, 2018 9:31 am

veya_victaous wrote:yeah it was a bit OTT

but it is that 'whats in it for me' attitude that has created the whole problem in the first place

How is not having a smart meter putting everyone's future at risk?

It's a bit much to say that someone who thinks of themselves should be eliminated, don't you think? Razz

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Post by veya_victaous on Tue Nov 13, 2018 9:41 am

not anymore, I almost added that i really think it is time we stopped giving a shit about what dumb people think and do what is Necessary to, if not fix, at least stop killing the planet (and humans with it)

it puts everyone at risk because the smart meter or any meter is the 'client' technology in a larger system, Improving the efficiency of the larger systems to the extent modern technology allows us REQUIRES all clients in the system to be upgraded to smart meters (or with matching capabilities)

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Post by Raggamuffin on Tue Nov 13, 2018 9:51 am

veya_victaous wrote:not anymore, I almost added that i really think it is time we stopped giving a shit about what dumb people think and do what is Necessary to, if not fix, at least stop killing the planet (and humans with it)

it puts everyone at risk because the smart meter or any meter is the 'client' technology in a larger system, Improving the efficiency of the larger systems to the extent modern technology allows us REQUIRES all clients in the system to be upgraded to smart meters (or with matching capabilities)

How does it improve efficiency? It puts people out of jobs - meter readers. As Tommy said, he doesn't need to know exactly how much he's using - people use what energy they need. In addition to that, Horatio has voiced some concerns about the effect of the meters.

I have a smart meter myself, I just think you're being a bit weird about Tommy's opinion.

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Post by HoratioTarr on Tue Nov 13, 2018 11:12 am

Vintage wrote:I heard you have to get a new one every time you decide to change suppliers.

Yeah, you can't switch suppliers once you have one.
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Post by Tommy Monk on Tue Nov 13, 2018 1:35 pm

Veya you hypocrite... the smart meters don't improve efficiency or use less energy... in fact they use more!!!


Then include the energy cost and resources used in producing/transporting/installing them... then include the prosuction and running costs in both energy and resources as well as money, of the big computer systems that are going to be needed to collect/collate/process The information these meters are sending out across the airwaves ...

There is no gain from the consumer or the environment!!!

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Post by Syl on Tue Nov 13, 2018 6:36 pm

We cant have one anyway, long before smart meters were recommended we built a garage round the electric box on the original wall of the house, so that would interfere with the signal.
We were bombarded with requests to have one a couple of years ago...when we agreed they refused us. Rolling Eyes

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Post by HoratioTarr on Tue Nov 13, 2018 8:40 pm

Syl wrote:We cant have one anyway, long before smart meters were recommended we built a garage round the electric box on the original wall of the house, so that would interfere with the signal.
We were bombarded with requests to have one a couple of years ago...when we agreed they refused us. Rolling Eyes

Ours is in our cellar.
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Post by veya_victaous on Tue Nov 13, 2018 10:00 pm

Raggamuffin wrote:
veya_victaous wrote:not anymore, I almost added that i really think it is time we stopped giving a shit about what dumb people think and do what is Necessary to, if not fix, at least stop killing the planet (and humans with it)

it puts everyone at risk because the smart meter or any meter is the 'client' technology in a larger system, Improving the efficiency of the larger systems to the extent modern technology allows us REQUIRES all clients in the system to be upgraded to smart meters (or with matching capabilities)

How does it improve efficiency? It puts people out of jobs - meter readers. As Tommy said, he doesn't need to know exactly how much he's using - people use what energy they need. In addition to that, Horatio has voiced some concerns about the effect of the meters.

I have a smart meter myself, I just think you're being a bit weird about Tommy's opinion.

because they can be controlled by a central point, they are 'online' they can be managed remotely, vast amounts of electricity is wasted with the current 'always on full' system. the Whole system will gain efficiency by 'targeting' where in the system power is needed and when.

it's not for him to know, again who give a fuck about his dumb ass? the client tech is step one, step two is the controllers 'we' will manage it for him.


And I already said We should just ignore dumb people,  Wink 
the effect of the signal from the meter is less than a smartphone. switching Suppliers is 100% on YOUR government, has nothing to do with the tech it's totally artificial bullshit Brits have 'accepted'. (we can switch down here no issue, because the gov't legislated that they HAVE to let us and can't just say no)


Also if your job is a meter reader than sit down collect the Dole, Because that's not a real job in the age of wireless communications, the idea it should be is just backwards fools giving out busy work to keep someone busy for no good reason

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Post by Raggamuffin on Wed Nov 14, 2018 5:40 am

veya_victaous wrote:
Raggamuffin wrote:

How does it improve efficiency? It puts people out of jobs - meter readers. As Tommy said, he doesn't need to know exactly how much he's using - people use what energy they need. In addition to that, Horatio has voiced some concerns about the effect of the meters.

I have a smart meter myself, I just think you're being a bit weird about Tommy's opinion.

because they can be controlled by a central point, they are 'online' they can be managed remotely, vast amounts of electricity is wasted with the current 'always on full' system. the Whole system will gain efficiency by 'targeting' where in the system power is needed and when.

it's not for him to know, again who give a fuck about his dumb ass? the client tech is step one, step two is the controllers 'we' will manage it for him.


And I already said We should just ignore dumb people,  Wink 
the effect of the signal from the meter is less than a smartphone. switching Suppliers is 100% on YOUR government, has nothing to do with the tech it's totally artificial bullshit Brits have 'accepted'. (we can switch down here no issue, because the gov't legislated that they HAVE to let us and can't just say no)


Also if your job is a meter reader than sit down collect the Dole, Because that's not a real job in the age of wireless communications, the idea it should be is just backwards fools giving out busy work to keep someone busy for no good reason

I admit I don't know much about the technology. I looked at the smart meter at the beginning because it was a novelty, and now I ignore it.

Your last point is a bit harsh - I'm sure the meter readers felt they had a real job. I guess a lot of jobs won't be "real" in the future. Bank staff are finding out about that I'm sure. We'll all have to bank online in future instead of actually going to a bank. Retail staff won't have a "real" job because shopping will be done online, etc.

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Post by Vintage on Wed Nov 14, 2018 12:16 pm

Just read up on smart meters. Its says you can easily check on your consumption, so if you are using a lot of energy what do you do go around turning off the tv when granny's watching her favourite programme? Everything is turned off in our house unless its actually being used, so I can't see how it would help. We already have meter that sends the usage automatically and we did have a unit that told us what we were using, don't use it anymore wasn't of any use.
Come dusk doors are firmly closed but they usually are in winter anyway, curtains are drawn, sweaters are worn hopefully cutting down on the gas heating costs but that's what its there for after all.

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Post by HoratioTarr on Wed Nov 14, 2018 2:04 pm

Vintage wrote:Just read up on smart meters. Its says you can easily check on your consumption, so if you are using a lot of energy what do you do go around turning off the tv when granny's watching her favourite programme? Everything is turned off in our house unless its actually being used, so I can't see how it would help. We already have meter that sends the usage automatically and we did have a unit that told us what we were using, don't use it anymore wasn't of any use.
Come dusk doors are firmly closed but they usually are in winter anyway, curtains are drawn, sweaters are worn hopefully cutting down on the gas heating costs but that's what its there for after all.
 

We have a wood burning stove. The damn thing is so hot it heats up the whole house. Our bills have gone from high to low.
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Post by Vintage on Wed Nov 14, 2018 2:55 pm

My MIL had an old aga in the kitchen and it was in the right kind of area of the house that you felt the benefit everywhere. I wish we had
brought it here it would have been great in the basement

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