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Post by Guest on Thu Nov 01, 2018 7:13 pm

A 10-year-old boy was asked to leave Nando's with his date as they were underage to not be accompanied by an adult. Nilufer Atik and Julia Hartley Brewer debate whether or not primary school children are too young to date.


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Post by Syl on Thu Nov 01, 2018 11:18 pm

Why should parents allow a couple of 10 year olds to go out eating in a restaurant alone? Ten year olds shouldnt be out unsupervised anywhere.
Surely the parent could provide food for the children if they want to eat together.

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Post by 'Wolfie on Thu Nov 01, 2018 11:57 pm

Idea

Even sillier than allowing primary aged children to "date", are those empty-headed urban princess "yummy mummies" pushing their pre-schoolers into "play dates" for those young mums' personal entertainment...

From the same empty-headed self-centred mindset that produced the ludicrous display of kids "graduating" from pre-school, kindergarten and then primary school..

It's like those children are actually missing out on a large chunk of their childhoods, mainly due to the vicarious vanity of their "me too" gen' mums, who appear to be orchestrating their kids' lives to fulfill something that they themselves perhaps imagine that they may have missed out when growing up ?

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Post by Syl on Fri Nov 02, 2018 11:42 am

Thinking about this, why are people so desperately trying to sexualise young kids when they should still be playing make believe?
We see it with all the gender neutral publicity...making many kids confused when they dont need to be.
Dating is for older kids and adults, unless we are taking about 'play dates'….which in my day was simply called play time with mates. Rolling Eyes

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Post by Guest on Fri Nov 02, 2018 11:53 am

Syl wrote:Thinking about this, why are people so desperately trying to sexualise young kids when they should still be playing make believe?
We see it with all the gender neutral publicity...making many kids confused when they dont need to be.
Dating is for older kids and adults, unless we are taking about 'play dates'….which in my day was simply called play time with mates. Rolling Eyes

No, that is the parents sexualizing the kids, when this is genuinely something innocent

Two people attracted to each other

Its because of how and why we have concerns around abuse to children, that its the minds of adults, that make something innocent become sexualized.

The only reason the young couple was turned away from Nando's had nothing to do with them being against the kids eating together.

It was based on the laws, that a place that serves alcohol, can not allow unaccompanied children under 13 to eat there

Its normal for kids to be attracted to each other and to say its some how taboo, is what is really wierd

Most kids that age cannot even afford to eat out, let alone take them on continued dates. I fail to see the harm here, if the parents drop them off and pick them up. They already do this with where there kids are friends with other kids. If its a house with adults supervizing. Then again what on earth is the problem with that?

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Post by Syl on Fri Nov 02, 2018 12:03 pm

Didge wrote:
Syl wrote:Thinking about this, why are people so desperately trying to sexualise young kids when they should still be playing make believe?
We see it with all the gender neutral publicity...making many kids confused when they dont need to be.
Dating is for older kids and adults, unless we are taking about 'play dates'….which in my day was simply called play time with mates. Rolling Eyes

No, that is the parents sexualizing the kids, when this is genuinely something innocent

Two people attracted to each other

Its because of how and why we have concerns around abuse to children, that its the minds of adults, that make something innocent become sexualized.

The only reason the young couple was turned away from Nando's had nothing to do with them being against the kids eating together.

It was based on the laws, that a place that serves alcohol, can not allow unaccompanied children under 13 to eat there

Its normal for kids to be attracted to each other and to say its some how taboo, is what is really wierd

Most kids that age cannot even afford to eat out, let alone take them on continued dates. I fail to see the harm here, if the parents drop them off and pick them up. They already do this with where there kids are friends with other kids. If its a house with adults supervizing. Then  again what on earth is the problem with that?

Of course it's the parents who are sexualising young kids, as it's the parents (or just as often people with no experience of rearing children who set themselves up as experts) who bang on about gender neutrality...this all filters down to the kids obviously.


Nando's was quite correct in not allowing the 10 year olds to dine in, but more concerning was where were the parents?
Were they waiting outside?
Kids do have attractions to each other....of course they do, it's how they pick their friends in the first place...but to send the little lad off to pay for a meal out with his 'date' is ridiculous.
Mum or dad should have gone with them.....or provided the food at home, that way the kids could be supervised. which all 10 year olds should be, no matter who they are playing with.

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Post by Guest on Fri Nov 02, 2018 12:11 pm

Syl wrote:
Didge wrote:

No, that is the parents sexualizing the kids, when this is genuinely something innocent

Two people attracted to each other

Its because of how and why we have concerns around abuse to children, that its the minds of adults, that make something innocent become sexualized.

The only reason the young couple was turned away from Nando's had nothing to do with them being against the kids eating together.

It was based on the laws, that a place that serves alcohol, can not allow unaccompanied children under 13 to eat there

Its normal for kids to be attracted to each other and to say its some how taboo, is what is really wierd

Most kids that age cannot even afford to eat out, let alone take them on continued dates. I fail to see the harm here, if the parents drop them off and pick them up. They already do this with where there kids are friends with other kids. If its a house with adults supervizing. Then  again what on earth is the problem with that?

Of course it's the parents who are sexualising young kids, as it's the parents (or just as often people with no experience of rearing children who set themselves up as experts) who bang on about gender neutrality...this all filters down to the kids obviously.


Nando's was quite correct in not allowing the 10 year olds to dine in, but more concerning was where were the parents?
Were they waiting outside?
Kids do have attractions to each other....of course they do, it's how they pick their friends in the first place...but to send the little lad off to pay for a meal out with his 'date' is ridiculous.
Mum or dad should have gone with them.....or provided the food at home, that way the kids could be supervised. which all 10 year olds should be, no matter who they are playing with.

I have no issue with what Nando's did

That is the law, based on alcohol being served and not children aged 8 or 10 being allowed to date

Nobody sent him off to pay for a meal, he wanted to pay for the meal with his friend. Which you would not object if this was not a friendship

I mean seriously, what are you teaching here, that its wrong for someone to pay for their friend?

The parents do not need to go with them, in a public place where there is already adults in place, serving them

They were dropped off and picked up, and we cannot strangulate children in to a box of cotton wool whilst growing up

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Post by Syl on Fri Nov 02, 2018 1:56 pm

Where does it mention they were dropped off and picked up?
Even if they were, the parents obviously dont know the rules about children in licensed premises.
They put the restaurant in an awkward position.

Were the staff  supposed to look after the kids till the parents came back to pick them up?
Phone the parents and tell them the kids were not allowed in without an accompanying adult?
Just turf them out leaving the kids at a loose end till the parents came back?

Blimey, I didnt allow my 10 year old son or grandson to go into a public toilet in premises without an adult hovering nearby....anything can happen to young kids if they are not supervised.

Sorry, but I think the parents were idiots to allow this

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Post by Guest on Fri Nov 02, 2018 2:03 pm

Syl wrote:Where does it mention they were dropped off and picked up?
Even if they were, the parents  obviously dont know the rules about children in licensed premises.
They put the restaurant in an awkward position.

Were the staff  supposed to look after the kids till the parents came back to pick them up?
Phone the parents and tell them the kids were not allowed in without an accompanying adult?
Just turf them out leaving the kids at a loose end till the parents came back?

Blimey, I didnt allow my 10 year old son or grandson to go into a public toilet in premises without an adult hovering nearby....anything can happen to young kids if they are not supervised.

Sorry, but I think the parents were idiots to allow this


You need to listen to the link

Then the parents were simple not aware, which I guess many people are alsonot aware. Not that this makes any difference to the point at hand.
Actually the restaurant were very nice to them, again listen to the link

Well that is your view, but they were in a public place with adults

May I suggest you watch the video through as Philip explains what actually happened.

At the end of the day this debate is actually about whether its okay for kids to go on a date, is it not? And thus not your views on the shortcomings of the parents

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Post by Vintage on Fri Nov 02, 2018 2:34 pm

I think I'd have to agree with Syl. I don't think this is an idea to be encouraged, let children just be children - dating is not what childhood should be about however innocent and cute. If they were allowed to go out for a meal then an adult should have been with them, its not the job of the staff to supervise young children, nothing untoward happened there wasn't a fire or a terrorist attack but anything is possible, neither child got upset for any reason and ran off but I reckon its too young for thinking of dinner out like this.

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Post by Guest on Fri Nov 02, 2018 3:36 pm

Vintage wrote:I think I'd have to agree with Syl. I don't think this is an idea to be encouraged, let children just be children - dating is not what childhood should be about however innocent and cute. If they were allowed to go out for a meal then an adult should have been with them, its not the job of the staff to supervise young children, nothing untoward happened there wasn't a fire or a terrorist attack but anything is possible, neither child got upset for any reason and ran off but I reckon its too young for thinking of dinner out like this.  

Well psychologically, that is poor to say the least. To say children should not be children.
Dating is simple a form of friendship, so how is then that form of friendship wrong?
You have heard that childhood sweethearts have gone on to then be married?
Is then when two friends claim they are brothers and not biologically then wrong?

Its simple a bond and innocent at that age Vintage

Where contrary to your beliefs, it is there responsibility to look after all customers within their premises. No matter where adult or children.

The point is, whether its wrong that they should have a date.

The view here centers on this being in public, so thus, none here would object in the company of close relatives.

Hence you all thus must agree, its not wrong for children to innocently date?

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Post by Syl on Fri Nov 02, 2018 7:26 pm

Didge wrote:
Vintage wrote:I think I'd have to agree with Syl. I don't think this is an idea to be encouraged, let children just be children - dating is not what childhood should be about however innocent and cute. If they were allowed to go out for a meal then an adult should have been with them, its not the job of the staff to supervise young children, nothing untoward happened there wasn't a fire or a terrorist attack but anything is possible, neither child got upset for any reason and ran off but I reckon its too young for thinking of dinner out like this.  

Well psychologically, that is poor to say the least. To say children should not be children.
Dating is simple a form of friendship, so how is then that form of friendship wrong?
You have heard that childhood sweethearts have gone on to then be married?
Is then when two friends claim they are brothers and not biologically then wrong?

Its simple a bond and innocent at that age Vintage

Where contrary to your beliefs, it is there responsibility to look after all customers within their premises. No matter where adult or children.

The point is, whether its wrong that they should have a date.

The view here centers on this being in public, so thus, none here would object in the company of close relatives.

Hence you all thus must agree, its not wrong for children to innocently date?

I did listen to the link, all the way through.

The point I think is the most important is not that the 10 year olds called it a date....though I imagine the grown ups put that idea in their heads, the kids liked each others company and wanted to be together....absolutely nothing wrong with that.

What is wrong is the parents somehow thought it was OK for two 10 year olds to be out unsupervised, and not only that they didnt even check the kids would be OK...as obviously they were not as they had to leave Nando's, being as it's unlawful for minors to be unaccompanied in a place that serves alcohol. Rolling Eyes

The parents are stupid...end of.
Probably too wrapped up in themselves to provide a meal for the lad and his friend, or take them out for the meal...like normal parents would surely do. Rolling Eyes

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Post by Guest on Fri Nov 02, 2018 7:34 pm

Syl wrote:
Didge wrote:

Well psychologically, that is poor to say the least. To say children should not be children.
Dating is simple a form of friendship, so how is then that form of friendship wrong?
You have heard that childhood sweethearts have gone on to then be married?
Is then when two friends claim they are brothers and not biologically then wrong?

Its simple a bond and innocent at that age Vintage

Where contrary to your beliefs, it is there responsibility to look after all customers within their premises. No matter where adult or children.

The point is, whether its wrong that they should have a date.

The view here centers on this being in public, so thus, none here would object in the company of close relatives.

Hence you all thus must agree, its not wrong for children to innocently date?

I did listen to the link, all the way through.

The point I think is the most important is not that the 10 year olds called it a date....though I imagine the grown ups put that idea in their heads, the kids liked each others company and wanted to be together....absolutely nothing wrong with that.

What is wrong is the parents somehow thought it was OK for two 10 year olds to be out unsupervised, and not only that they didnt even check the kids would be OK...as obviously they were not as they had to leave Nando's, being as it's unlawful for minors to be unaccompanied in a place that serves alcohol. Rolling Eyes

The parents are stupid...end of.
Probably too wrapped up in themselves to provide a meal for the lad and his friend, or take them out for the meal...like normal parents would surely do. Rolling Eyes

Liar, liar, pants on fire

If you did, you would have not have made incorrect views

1) Why the parents? I think kids watch enough disney fims to see relationships, let alone family relationships. Hence the view you propose is absurd to say that is the reason

2) Not even the point here, its about whether kids should be able to take their girlfriend or boyfriend on a date. Not about the parents in this situation

3) So you have strayed again from the main point of the debate and made this about the parents on this one situation

Boring

4) You are not the central queen to decide what is morally right for parents Syl, sorry. I have no idea why you are taking this out on them

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Post by Syl on Fri Nov 02, 2018 8:08 pm

Didge wrote:
Syl wrote:

I did listen to the link, all the way through.

The point I think is the most important is not that the 10 year olds called it a date....though I imagine the grown ups put that idea in their heads, the kids liked each others company and wanted to be together....absolutely nothing wrong with that.

What is wrong is the parents somehow thought it was OK for two 10 year olds to be out unsupervised, and not only that they didnt even check the kids would be OK...as obviously they were not as they had to leave Nando's, being as it's unlawful for minors to be unaccompanied in a place that serves alcohol. Rolling Eyes

The parents are stupid...end of.
Probably too wrapped up in themselves to provide a meal for the lad and his friend, or take them out for the meal...like normal parents would surely do. Rolling Eyes

Liar, liar, pants on fire

If you did, you would have not have made incorrect views

1) Why the parents? I think kids watch enough disney fims to see relationships, let alone family relationships. Hence the view you propose is absurd to say that is the reason

2) Not even the point here, its about whether kids should be able to take their girlfriend or boyfriend on a date. Not about the parents in this situation

3) So you have strayed again from the main point of the debate and made this about the parents on this one situation

Boring

4) You are not the central queen to decide what is morally right for parents Syl, sorry. I have no idea why you are taking this out on them

Dont call me a liar.

I watched the tape, no one said the parents dropped the kids off and was going to pick them up....that was just an "even if" scenario, a generalisation...it may not have applied to the case they were talking about.

I am not the morality queen and never pretend I am ….unlike yourself.
I gave my view and I think it's the sensible one....thats it really, nothing to add.
We will agree to disagree.

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Post by Guest on Fri Nov 02, 2018 8:12 pm

Syl wrote:
Didge wrote:

Liar, liar, pants on fire

If you did, you would have not have made incorrect views

1) Why the parents? I think kids watch enough disney fims to see relationships, let alone family relationships. Hence the view you propose is absurd to say that is the reason

2) Not even the point here, its about whether kids should be able to take their girlfriend or boyfriend on a date. Not about the parents in this situation

3) So you have strayed again from the main point of the debate and made this about the parents on this one situation

Boring

4) You are not the central queen to decide what is morally right for parents Syl, sorry. I have no idea why you are taking this out on them

Dont call me a liar.

I watched the tape, no one said the parents dropped the kids off and was going to pick them up....that was just an "even if" scenario, a generalisation...it may not have  applied to the case they were talking about.

I am not the morality queen and never pretend I am ….unlike yourself.
I gave my view and I think it's the sensible one....thats it really, nothing to add.
We will agree to disagree.

1) Yes they did say they dropped them off

2) No, that is you speculating and has no relavance again to the point here, which to you, is about berating the parents. Which is what the moral brigade do, when they think they are "mary Poppins"

3) I dont think I am morally right, as i do get things wrong and why I am humble at times and admit when wrong. You think this is about me and change it so, because you are losing the debate. Hence why you have got antsy

4) The point was never even about the parents here. All make poor or good decisions.

This was only about one thing

Is it okay or bad for children to date and being that all your arguments are centered on the parents. I would have to deduced from that. You have no real objection Syl. As the majority of your views is on the parents

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Post by Syl on Fri Nov 02, 2018 8:22 pm

I have no objection at all in a 10 year old boy wanting to be in the company of a 10 year old girl....I have raised a son and had loads of dealings with my grandsons....kids love other kids and want to be with them, be they boys or girls.

Would I personally encourage them to call it a date? Nope....dating is for older couples.
Would it unduly bother me...Nope, it's just a word at the end of the day.

Are the parents of the kids in the OP idiots...Yes...they certainly are.
Hope I have cleared up your confusion...over and out.

Have a good evening. x

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Post by Guest on Fri Nov 02, 2018 8:25 pm

Syl wrote:I have no objection at all in a 10 year old boy wanting to be in the company of a 10 year old girl....I have raised a son and had loads of dealings with my grandsons....kids love other kids and want to be with them, be they boys or girls.

Would I personally encourage them to call it a date? Nope....dating is for older couples.
Would it unduly bother me...Nope, it's just a word at the end of the day.

Are the parents of the kids in the OP idiots...Yes...they certainly are.
Hope I have cleared up your confusion...over and out.

Have a good evening. x

So at the end of the day, your issue here was never about the date

It was your holy, than holy views on the parents

Glad we cleared that up

x

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Post by Syl on Fri Nov 02, 2018 8:33 pm

Didge wrote:
Syl wrote:I have no objection at all in a 10 year old boy wanting to be in the company of a 10 year old girl....I have raised a son and had loads of dealings with my grandsons....kids love other kids and want to be with them, be they boys or girls.

Would I personally encourage them to call it a date? Nope....dating is for older couples.
Would it unduly bother me...Nope, it's just a word at the end of the day.

Are the parents of the kids in the OP idiots...Yes...they certainly are.
Hope I have cleared up your confusion...over and out.

Have a good evening. x

So at the end of the day, your issue here was never about the date

It was your holy, than holy views on the parents

Glad we cleared that up

x

Which was my viewpoint right from the start. Rolling Eyes

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Post by Guest on Fri Nov 02, 2018 8:37 pm

Syl wrote:
Didge wrote:

So at the end of the day, your issue here was never about the date

It was your holy, than holy views on the parents

Glad we cleared that up

x

Which was my viewpoint right from the start. Rolling Eyes

Okay, in your opinion, but what was the point of the debate?

Are Primary School Children Too Young to Date?

To me, there is no age limit. As at that age, they do not understand what an adult relationship is. So to make this taboo to them, is really stupid. This is the perfect age for boys and girls to learn to respect each other.

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Post by nicko on Fri Nov 02, 2018 9:32 pm

I had a "Girl Friend" when I was 11, she was 12.
coming home on a bus one day she picked her nose and wiped it on the back of a seat, end of romance !
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Post by Andy on Fri Nov 02, 2018 10:28 pm

Spent the summer of 69 in Norfolk, staying at a family friends guest house. I was 12 and fell in lust with a beautiful 12 year old girl staying with her parents.
We got quite intimate without ever going the whole way. But we learned about human biology!

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Post by Syl on Sat Nov 03, 2018 2:40 pm

nicko wrote:I had a "Girl Friend"   when I was 11,   she was 12.
coming home on a bus one day she picked her nose and wiped it on the back of a seat,     end of romance !

We had a boy in class who used to pick his nose and eat whatever came out.
It put me off lads till I was around 13.....had a huge crush on a boy a couple of years older than me, he broke my heart when he asked my best friend out. Crying or Very sad
I didnt have a proper kiss till I was 17.

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Post by Jules on Sat Nov 03, 2018 3:22 pm

'Dating' is a term with romantic connotations. 
Maybe a more innocent term should be used here?

Even then I'd never entertain the notion of a 10yo boy & girl going out together, to a restaurant [or anywhere else].
Nonstarter !  No
Forget it!!!!

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Post by Original Quill on Sat Nov 03, 2018 4:18 pm

Syl wrote:
nicko wrote:I had a "Girl Friend"   when I was 11,   she was 12.
coming home on a bus one day she picked her nose and wiped it on the back of a seat,     end of romance !

We had a boy in class who used to pick his nose and eat whatever came out.
It put me off lads till I was around 13.....had a huge crush on a boy a couple of years older than me, he broke my heart when he asked my best friend out. Crying or Very sad
I didnt have a proper kiss till I was 17.

Lots of disappointments, before you finally get there. Sad

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Post by Syl on Sat Nov 03, 2018 5:45 pm

Original Quill wrote:
Syl wrote:

We had a boy in class who used to pick his nose and eat whatever came out.
It put me off lads till I was around 13.....had a huge crush on a boy a couple of years older than me, he broke my heart when he asked my best friend out. Crying or Very sad
I didnt have a proper kiss till I was 17.

Lots of disappointments, before you finally get there. Sad
Yep, and they do say the first cut is the deepest. Childhood and early teen unrequited love can stay with us for life.  Are Primary School Children Too Young to Date? | This Morning 988787160

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Not everyone likes me, but not everyone matters.

Syl

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