Tube passenger sparks outrage after painting his face black for Halloween costume - then tells model 'why not?' when she brands it racist

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Tube passenger sparks outrage after painting his face black for Halloween costume - then tells model 'why not?' when she brands it racist

Post by HoratioTarr on Mon Oct 29, 2018 2:28 pm

Man appeared to have dressed up as Samuel L Jackson's in the film Pulp Fiction
But he was confronted by a fellow Tube traveller and accused of being 'racist'
Saturday's incident caught on camera by make-up artist Petra-Isabella Joli, 22
Woman tells man in video: 'Don't you think it's racist to put black on your face?'

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-6328241/Tube-passenger-sparks-outrage-painting-face-black-Halloween-costume.html

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Re: Tube passenger sparks outrage after painting his face black for Halloween costume - then tells model 'why not?' when she brands it racist

Post by HoratioTarr on Mon Oct 29, 2018 2:34 pm

Nobody got offended at this though.   Make your minds up!

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Re: Tube passenger sparks outrage after painting his face black for Halloween costume - then tells model 'why not?' when she brands it racist

Post by Guest on Mon Oct 29, 2018 2:38 pm

I guess its the PC peddalling again horatio

You can see from the dumb article

https://www.independent.co.uk/life-style/halloween-costume-how-not-offensive-idiot-fancy-dress-racism-a8005291.html

I mean religious people rightly are allowed to dress how they like

Transgenders are allowed to dress as they like

Women rightly are allowed to dress as they like, but only through the dumb prisom of identity politics.

Which means, if they are white, they have restrictions based on some dumb made up views around cultural appropiation

Well if you are a white male. Then you cannot even go out and celebrate Haloween, as you will be too life like to actual horror. As did you not know that white men are pure evil? According to the loony PC leftist brigade?

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Re: Tube passenger sparks outrage after painting his face black for Halloween costume - then tells model 'why not?' when she brands it racist

Post by HoratioTarr on Mon Oct 29, 2018 2:48 pm

Didge wrote:I guess its the PC peddalling again horatio

You can see from the dumb article

https://www.independent.co.uk/life-style/halloween-costume-how-not-offensive-idiot-fancy-dress-racism-a8005291.html

I mean religious people rightly are allowed to dress how they like

Transgenders are allowed to dress as they like

Women rightly are allowed to dress as they like, but only through the dumb prisom of identity politics.

Which means, if they are white, they have restrictions based on some dumb made up views around cultural appropiation

Well if you are a white male. Then you cannot even go out and celebrate Haloween, as you will be too life like to actual horror. As did you not know that white men are pure evil? According to the loony PC leftist brigade?

This guy is Bulgerian, by the way, not British. I think too that people are getting a bit cheesed off with being called racist for every slight. The insult is wearing a bit thin. If you fart in the key of A flat minor, you might insult Count Basie's trumpet solo of 1956.
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Re: Tube passenger sparks outrage after painting his face black for Halloween costume - then tells model 'why not?' when she brands it racist

Post by Guest on Mon Oct 29, 2018 2:51 pm

HoratioTarr wrote:
Didge wrote:I guess its the PC peddalling again horatio

You can see from the dumb article

https://www.independent.co.uk/life-style/halloween-costume-how-not-offensive-idiot-fancy-dress-racism-a8005291.html

I mean religious people rightly are allowed to dress how they like

Transgenders are allowed to dress as they like

Women rightly are allowed to dress as they like, but only through the dumb prisom of identity politics.

Which means, if they are white, they have restrictions based on some dumb made up views around cultural appropiation

Well if you are a white male. Then you cannot even go out and celebrate Haloween, as you will be too life like to actual horror. As did you not know that white men are pure evil? According to the loony PC leftist brigade?

This guy is Bulgerian, by the way, not British.   I think too that people are getting a bit cheesed off with being called racist for every slight.  The insult is wearing a bit thin.   If you fart in the key of A flat minor, you might insult Count Basie's trumpet solo of 1956.

Not aware he was not British, though, really makes no difference to the point

I mean he has dressed up in fancy dress as an actual character from a film, so I dont see how that is in anyway being offensive

So why is it then not offensive for men to dress up as women with makeup? Or vice versa

I mean if someone Black  wanted to dress up as Elvis Presely, I would not have a problem

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Re: Tube passenger sparks outrage after painting his face black for Halloween costume - then tells model 'why not?' when she brands it racist

Post by Original Quill on Mon Oct 29, 2018 4:03 pm

What would the analogy be? If someone tattooed a number on his wrist, strung a gas mask around his neck, wore a fake long, crooked nose, and had loads of fake money stuffed in/falling out his pockets...and he introduced himself as 'Cohen' or 'Stein'. Would that be offensive?

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Re: Tube passenger sparks outrage after painting his face black for Halloween costume - then tells model 'why not?' when she brands it racist

Post by Guest on Mon Oct 29, 2018 4:48 pm

Original Quill wrote:What would the analogy be?  If someone tattooed a number on his wrist, strung a gas mask around his neck, wore a fake long, crooked nose, and had loads of fake money stuffed in/falling out his pockets...and he introduced himself as 'Cohen' or 'Stein'.  Would that be offensive?

How is that comparrison to a film actor/actress?

What you posted was an antisemtic sterotype/trope

How is looking like Samuel L Jackson in fancy dress, a racist sterotype?

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Re: Tube passenger sparks outrage after painting his face black for Halloween costume - then tells model 'why not?' when she brands it racist

Post by Original Quill on Mon Oct 29, 2018 5:07 pm

Didge wrote:
Original Quill wrote:What would the analogy be?  If someone tattooed a number on his wrist, strung a gas mask around his neck, wore a fake long, crooked nose, and had loads of fake money stuffed in/falling out his pockets...and he introduced himself as 'Cohen' or 'Stein'.  Would that be offensive?

How is that comparrison to a film actor/actress?

What you posted was an antisemtic sterotype/trope

How is looking like Samuel L Jackson in fancy dress, a racist sterotype?

Insulting Jews by symbolism. Insulting blacks by symbolism. You need to ask?

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Re: Tube passenger sparks outrage after painting his face black for Halloween costume - then tells model 'why not?' when she brands it racist

Post by Guest on Mon Oct 29, 2018 5:10 pm

Original Quill wrote:
Didge wrote:

How is that comparrison to a film actor/actress?

What you posted was an antisemtic sterotype/trope

How is looking like Samuel L Jackson in fancy dress, a racist sterotype?

Insulting Jews by symbolism.  Insulting blacks by symbolism.  You need to ask?

What symbolism?

I mean looking at the character Samual L Jackson played in Pulp fiction

What are the racist sterotype tropes here?

Perm?

Nope originated in Germany

Goatee

Nope, originated in Ancient Greece?

Sideburns

Nope, originated in American by white people

I see none of the typical stereotype/tropes associated with racism, that people have worn to mock black people

So again, you dodged the question

How is looking like Samuel L Jackson in fancy dress from the film Pulp Fiction, a racist sterotype?

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Re: Tube passenger sparks outrage after painting his face black for Halloween costume - then tells model 'why not?' when she brands it racist

Post by Lord Foul on Mon Oct 29, 2018 5:30 pm

quills second favourite tactic.....reductio ad absurdum....a fairly standard lefty debating method I'm afraid....reduce the argument you are losing to the most absurd form possible them claim righteous victory when your opponent decides you are just too daft to laugh at.....

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Re: Tube passenger sparks outrage after painting his face black for Halloween costume - then tells model 'why not?' when she brands it racist

Post by Original Quill on Mon Oct 29, 2018 5:33 pm

Didge wrote:What symbolism?

I mean looking at the character Samual L Jackson played in Pulp fiction

What are the racist sterotype tropes here?

Samual L. Jackson is a brilliant actor, who happened to play a black gangster/murderer. It’s about portraying the role he played, Jules Winnfield. If someone dressed as James Baskett and went to the party as Uncle Remus, wouldn’t you be offended?

Blackface is symbolic of a character played by Lincoln Theodore Monroe Andrew Perry, better known by the stage name Stepin Fetchit. The name of the character says it all.


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Re: Tube passenger sparks outrage after painting his face black for Halloween costume - then tells model 'why not?' when she brands it racist

Post by Guest on Mon Oct 29, 2018 5:34 pm

Lord Foul wrote:quills second favourite tactic.....reductio ad absurdum....a fairly standard lefty debating method I'm afraid....reduce the argument you are losing to the most absurd form possible them claim righteous victory when your opponent decides you are just too daft to laugh at.....

Excatly, I have asked him a simple question

How is looking like Samuel L Jackson in fancy dress from the film Pulp Fiction, a racist sterotype?

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Re: Tube passenger sparks outrage after painting his face black for Halloween costume - then tells model 'why not?' when she brands it racist

Post by Fred Moletrousers on Mon Oct 29, 2018 5:37 pm

I once "blacked up" and played a vegetarian cannibal chief in a stage comedy.

That's me condemned to perdition and having an unpleasant little demon shoving a red hot poker up my arse, then.........
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Re: Tube passenger sparks outrage after painting his face black for Halloween costume - then tells model 'why not?' when she brands it racist

Post by Guest on Mon Oct 29, 2018 5:37 pm

Original Quill wrote:
Didge wrote:What symbolism?

I mean looking at the character Samual L Jackson played in Pulp fiction

What are the racist sterotype tropes here?

Samual L. Jackson is a brilliant actor, who happened to play a black gangster/murderer.  It’s about portraying the role he played, Jules Winnfield.  If someone dressed as James Baskett and went to the party as Uncle Remus, wouldn’t you be offended?

Blackface is symbolic of a character played by Lincoln Theodore Monroe Andrew Perry, better known by the stage name Stepin Fetchit.  The name of the character says it all.


So anyone dressing up as Elvis Presley. When they are not part white/part Cherokee Indian, is being racist towards white people and Cherokee Indian then?

This is not blackface, but a person trying to look as much as possible like the Character played by Samuel L jackson in Pulp fiction.

There was no attempt to, as is the case with racist tropes against blacks, by enlarge the lips, or put on a wide flat nose etc

He simple made himself look as much as possible like the character

That is not being racist in the least

Unless of course where white people tan in the sun and where fake tan. Or black people whiten their skin is now racist to you?

Hence you fail to again answer the question and yet again invoke some bullshit

try again

How is looking like Samuel L Jackson in fancy dress from the film Pulp Fiction, a racist sterotype?

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Re: Tube passenger sparks outrage after painting his face black for Halloween costume - then tells model 'why not?' when she brands it racist

Post by Guest on Mon Oct 29, 2018 5:47 pm



This is of course Robert Downey Jr, from the film Tropic thunder

Does Quill think he is a racist now as well?

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Re: Tube passenger sparks outrage after painting his face black for Halloween costume - then tells model 'why not?' when she brands it racist

Post by Original Quill on Mon Oct 29, 2018 5:50 pm

Didge wrote:So anyone dressing up as Elvis Presley.

What role? I've already explained it's the symbolism.

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Re: Tube passenger sparks outrage after painting his face black for Halloween costume - then tells model 'why not?' when she brands it racist

Post by Guest on Mon Oct 29, 2018 5:53 pm

Original Quill wrote:
Didge wrote:So anyone dressing up as Elvis Presley.

What role?  I've already explained it's the symbolism.


What symbolism?

I mean looking at the character Samual L Jackson played in Pulp fiction

What are the racist sterotype tropes here?

Perm?

Nope originated in Germany

Goatee

Nope, originated in Ancient Greece?

Sideburns

Nope, originated in American by white people

I see none of the typical stereotype/tropes associated with racism, that people have worn to mock black people

So again, you dodged the question

How is looking like Samuel L Jackson in fancy dress from the film Pulp Fiction, a racist sterotype?

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Re: Tube passenger sparks outrage after painting his face black for Halloween costume - then tells model 'why not?' when she brands it racist

Post by Original Quill on Mon Oct 29, 2018 6:14 pm

Didge wrote:

This is of course Robert Downey Jr, from the film Tropic thunder

Does Quill think he is a racist now as well?

No, as I've already explained, the symbolic role of blackface is owned by Lincoln Perry, better known by the stage name Stepin Fetchit. He played the first blackface, a role depicting an obsequious black man, who was "slow-witted and lazy, and thereby exploiting whites' sense of superiority." http://black-face.com/Stepin-Fetchit.htm

Roles are art, and certain works of gain a familiarity in the public eye. We call that symbolism. A brown shirt with a black arm band is Nazism. A white man in a black mask riding a white horse is the Lone Ranger, white hero, representing law and order in the old west. A blackface associates a black man with ""slow-witted and lazy". It's neither the actor, nor the dress, but the associations and entailments brought forth in the original public apprehension of the role.

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Re: Tube passenger sparks outrage after painting his face black for Halloween costume - then tells model 'why not?' when she brands it racist

Post by Original Quill on Mon Oct 29, 2018 6:16 pm

Didge wrote:
Original Quill wrote:

What role?  I've already explained it's the symbolism.


What symbolism?

I mean looking at the character Samual L Jackson played in Pulp fiction

What are the racist sterotype tropes here?

Perm?

Nope originated in Germany

Goatee

Nope, originated in Ancient Greece?

Sideburns

Nope, originated in American by white people

I see none of the typical stereotype/tropes associated with racism, that people have worn to mock black people

The script...a black man fallen into crime, presumably by inner-city upbringing.


Last edited by Original Quill on Mon Oct 29, 2018 6:17 pm; edited 1 time in total

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Re: Tube passenger sparks outrage after painting his face black for Halloween costume - then tells model 'why not?' when she brands it racist

Post by Guest on Mon Oct 29, 2018 6:16 pm

Original Quill wrote:
Didge wrote:

This is of course Robert Downey Jr, from the film Tropic thunder

Does Quill think he is a racist now as well?

No, as I've already explained, the symbolic role of blackface is owned by Lincoln Perry, better known by the stage name Stepin Fetchit.  He played the first blackface, a role depicting an obsequious black man, who was "slow-witted and lazy, and thereby exploiting whites' sense of superiority."  http://black-face.com/Stepin-Fetchit.htm

Roles are art, and certain works of gain a familiarity in the public eye.  We call that symbolism.  A brown shirt with a black arm band is Nazism.  A white man in a black mask riding a white horse is the Lone Ranger, white hero, representing law and order in the old west.  A blackface associates a black man with ""slow-witted and lazy".  It's neither the actor, nor the dress, but  the associations and entailments brought forth in the original public apprehension of the role.

So again you have no reason to class this as racist, just something from the past which had racism behind that, where people blackened their face to mock black people. That is not the case here, as easily seen, by trying to look like a character from a movie. As where is the racism in that?

So you think Johnny Depp is also racist?



That again does not answer my question for the fifth time

How is looking like Samuel L Jackson in fancy dress from the film Pulp Fiction, a racist sterotype?

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Re: Tube passenger sparks outrage after painting his face black for Halloween costume - then tells model 'why not?' when she brands it racist

Post by Original Quill on Mon Oct 29, 2018 6:19 pm

The actors are not at fault.  Nor are the script writers.  It's the people who want to idolize the evil entailed in the symbolism.


Last edited by Original Quill on Mon Oct 29, 2018 6:21 pm; edited 1 time in total

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Re: Tube passenger sparks outrage after painting his face black for Halloween costume - then tells model 'why not?' when she brands it racist

Post by Syl on Mon Oct 29, 2018 6:20 pm

I think rather than being racist, it's flattering to want to look like a character from a movie....proves Samuel L Jackson made a lasting impression playing the part.
He (man on tube) would have looked pretty silly dressing up as the character if he hadn't blacked his face after all.  Rolling Eyes


Last edited by Syl on Mon Oct 29, 2018 6:22 pm; edited 1 time in total

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Re: Tube passenger sparks outrage after painting his face black for Halloween costume - then tells model 'why not?' when she brands it racist

Post by Guest on Mon Oct 29, 2018 6:21 pm

Original Quill wrote:The actors are not at fault.  Nor are the script writers.  It's the people who want to idolize the evil entailed in the story.


So you are saying Samuel L jackson is now evil?

wow

How is looking like Samuel L Jackson in fancy dress from the film Pulp Fiction, a racist sterotype?

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Re: Tube passenger sparks outrage after painting his face black for Halloween costume - then tells model 'why not?' when she brands it racist

Post by Original Quill on Mon Oct 29, 2018 6:22 pm

Syl wrote:I think rather than being racist, it's flattering to want to look like a character from a movie....proves Samuel L Jackson made a lasting impression playing the part.
He would have looked pretty silly dressing up as the character if he hadn't blacked his face after all.  Rolling Eyes

The actors are not at fault. Nor are the script writers. It's the people who want to idolize the evil entailed in the symbolism.

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Re: Tube passenger sparks outrage after painting his face black for Halloween costume - then tells model 'why not?' when she brands it racist

Post by Syl on Mon Oct 29, 2018 6:23 pm

Original Quill wrote:
Syl wrote:I think rather than being racist, it's flattering to want to look like a character from a movie....proves Samuel L Jackson made a lasting impression playing the part.
He would have looked pretty silly dressing up as the character if he hadn't blacked his face after all.  Rolling Eyes

The actors are not at fault.  Nor are the script writers.  It's the people who want to idolize the evil entailed in the symbolism.

I dont see any evil....sometimes I think the evil is in the onlooker.

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Re: Tube passenger sparks outrage after painting his face black for Halloween costume - then tells model 'why not?' when she brands it racist

Post by Guest on Mon Oct 29, 2018 6:23 pm

Syl wrote:I think rather than being racist, it's flattering to want to look like a character from a movie....proves Samuel L Jackson made a lasting impression playing the part.
He would have looked pretty silly dressing up as the character if he hadn't blacked his face after all.  Rolling Eyes



Absolutely agree and I am sure Samuel L Jackson would be chuffed to bits and not in the least find it racist

Indeed, if he had not blackened his face, people could have mistaken him for one of the scousers from the hit programmed Harry Enfield. Instead of Pulp Fiction



But that is also demeaning to Liverpudlians according to Quill

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Re: Tube passenger sparks outrage after painting his face black for Halloween costume - then tells model 'why not?' when she brands it racist

Post by Syl on Mon Oct 29, 2018 6:27 pm

Haha....he would have looked a dead ringer for Harry Enfields scouser if he hadn't blacked his face. Razz

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Re: Tube passenger sparks outrage after painting his face black for Halloween costume - then tells model 'why not?' when she brands it racist

Post by Guest on Mon Oct 29, 2018 6:28 pm

Syl wrote:Haha....he would have looked a dead ringer for Harry Enfields scouser if he hadn't blacked his face. Razz


lol!

Exactly and I bet Quill would have never objected. Even though within the show, that is him taking the piss out of scousers how they look, dress, sound and act.

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Re: Tube passenger sparks outrage after painting his face black for Halloween costume - then tells model 'why not?' when she brands it racist

Post by Original Quill on Mon Oct 29, 2018 6:29 pm

Didge wrote:
Original Quill wrote:The actors are not at fault.  Nor are the script writers.  It's the people who want to idolize the evil entailed in the story.


So you are saying Samuel L jackson is now evil?

wow

How is looking like Samuel L Jackson in fancy dress from the film Pulp Fiction, a racist sterotype?

The story wasn't about Samual L. Jackson. He just played a part. The evil is entailed in the plot of the script, which gives up a symbol. Going back to Lincoln Perry, his story yielded a blackface, which was/is symbolic of a "slow-witted and lazy" black man, representing an opinion about blacks.

We are dealing, now, with the many rabbit-holes that you jump down.

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Re: Tube passenger sparks outrage after painting his face black for Halloween costume - then tells model 'why not?' when she brands it racist

Post by Guest on Mon Oct 29, 2018 6:33 pm

Original Quill wrote:
Didge wrote:


So you are saying Samuel L jackson is now evil?

wow

How is looking like Samuel L Jackson in fancy dress from the film Pulp Fiction, a racist sterotype?

The story wasn't about Samual L. Jackson.  He just played a part.  The evil is entailed in the plot of the script, which gives up a symbol.  Going back to Lincoln Perry, his story yielded a blackface, which was/is symbolic of a "slow-witted and lazy" black man, representing an opinion about blacks.

We are dealing, now, with the many rabbit-holes that you jump down.  


What a crock.

You are simple inventing crap to fit your warped narrative

So now where people love the part played by samuel L Jackson, you think that is wrong

wow

We are dealing with your warped PC daft leftist views, as you gone from racism to now evil

Seventh time asking

How is looking like Samuel L Jackson in fancy dress from the film Pulp Fiction, a racist sterotype?


Last edited by Didge on Mon Oct 29, 2018 6:34 pm; edited 1 time in total

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Re: Tube passenger sparks outrage after painting his face black for Halloween costume - then tells model 'why not?' when she brands it racist

Post by Original Quill on Mon Oct 29, 2018 6:34 pm

Syl wrote:
Original Quill wrote:

The actors are not at fault.  Nor are the script writers.  It's the people who want to idolize the evil entailed in the symbolism.

I dont see any evil....sometimes I think the evil is in the onlooker.

That last sentence is the core of the matter. The blackface reminds one of the evil, and wishing to perpetuate the insult of the evil, the onlooker adopts the symbol and intentionally goes on the perpetuate the association.

Good for you, Syl.

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Re: Tube passenger sparks outrage after painting his face black for Halloween costume - then tells model 'why not?' when she brands it racist

Post by Syl on Mon Oct 29, 2018 6:34 pm

Original Quill wrote:
Didge wrote:


So you are saying Samuel L jackson is now evil?

wow

How is looking like Samuel L Jackson in fancy dress from the film Pulp Fiction, a racist sterotype?

The story wasn't about Samual L. Jackson.  He just played a part.  The evil is entailed in the plot of the script, which gives up a symbol.  Going back to Lincoln Perry, his story yielded a blackface, which was/is symbolic of a "slow-witted and lazy" black man, representing an opinion about blacks.

We are dealing, now, with the many rabbit-holes that you jump down.  

So when anyone dresses up as the drug taking simple minded killer John Travolta played in the film, or the character Uma Thurman played, she who temporarily died of a coke overdose....what would that be then Quill?

The two characters in that film are also popular in spite of them both being white.

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Re: Tube passenger sparks outrage after painting his face black for Halloween costume - then tells model 'why not?' when she brands it racist

Post by Guest on Mon Oct 29, 2018 6:35 pm

Original Quill wrote:
Syl wrote:

I dont see any evil....sometimes I think the evil is in the onlooker.

That last sentence is the core of the matter.  The blackface reminds one of the evil, and wishing to perpetuate the insult of the evil, the onlooker adopts the symbol and intentionally goes on the perpetuate the association.

Good for you, Syl.


The only problem here Quill is you

You see offense when there is none

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Re: Tube passenger sparks outrage after painting his face black for Halloween costume - then tells model 'why not?' when she brands it racist

Post by Original Quill on Mon Oct 29, 2018 7:31 pm

Didge wrote:
Original Quill wrote:

That last sentence is the core of the matter.  The blackface reminds one of the evil, and wishing to perpetuate the insult of the evil, the onlooker adopts the symbol and intentionally goes on the perpetuate the association.

Good for you, Syl.


The only problem here Quill is you

You see offense when there is none

Frankly, I have yet to render an opinion about the underlying example. I've been too busy explaining the simple dynamics of political symbolism to you and others.

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Re: Tube passenger sparks outrage after painting his face black for Halloween costume - then tells model 'why not?' when she brands it racist

Post by Guest on Mon Oct 29, 2018 7:35 pm

Original Quill wrote:
Didge wrote:


The only problem here Quill is you

You see offense when there is none

Frankly, I have yet to render an opinion about the underlying example.  I've been too busy explaining the simple dynamics of political symbolism to you and others.

You have explain to Syl, that you believe that its racist to apply a person in a film as black as a killer, doing evil as wrong and racist, but the same does not apply to the white charcters in the film. Who kills an does evil, that is acceptable to you

Hence the absurdity of your argument

I mean there is no blacks who kill in America or gangs is there Quill?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gangs_in_the_United_States

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_gangs_in_the_United_States

The fact that you make the most absurd argument to now portray that the charcter played by Samuel L Jackson is now based on racist sterotypes to portray them in a bad light, is about as desperate as it gets from you

Your explanation has no bases what so ever


Last edited by Didge on Mon Oct 29, 2018 7:42 pm; edited 1 time in total

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Re: Tube passenger sparks outrage after painting his face black for Halloween costume - then tells model 'why not?' when she brands it racist

Post by Guest on Mon Oct 29, 2018 7:38 pm

This is the 8th time I have asked

How is looking like Samuel L Jackson in fancy dress from the film Pulp Fiction, a racist sterotype?

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Re: Tube passenger sparks outrage after painting his face black for Halloween costume - then tells model 'why not?' when she brands it racist

Post by Guest on Mon Oct 29, 2018 7:40 pm

Syl wrote:
Original Quill wrote:

The story wasn't about Samual L. Jackson.  He just played a part.  The evil is entailed in the plot of the script, which gives up a symbol.  Going back to Lincoln Perry, his story yielded a blackface, which was/is symbolic of a "slow-witted and lazy" black man, representing an opinion about blacks.

We are dealing, now, with the many rabbit-holes that you jump down.  

So when  anyone dresses up as the drug taking simple minded killer John Travolta played in the film, or the character Uma Thurman played, she who temporarily died of a coke overdose....what would that be then Quill?

The two characters in that film are also popular in spite of them both being white.  

Love how Quill dodged this

As it made his case, so easily redundement, he tried to move on past this badly ignoring it.

Hence Quill has no case here and just invents nonsense to back his absurd views here and why cannot answer the following

How is looking like Samuel L Jackson in fancy dress from the film Pulp Fiction, a racist sterotype?

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Re: Tube passenger sparks outrage after painting his face black for Halloween costume - then tells model 'why not?' when she brands it racist

Post by Original Quill on Mon Oct 29, 2018 7:58 pm

Didge wrote:You have explain to Syl, that you believe that its racist to apply a person in a film as black as a killer, doing evil as wrong and racist, but the same does not apply to the white charcters in the film.

Your phrasing is as convoluted as your thinking (rabbit-holes and such).  I'll just begin over again.

The symbolic role of blackface is owned by Lincoln Perry, better known by the stage name Stepin Fetchit.  He played the first blackface, a role depicting an obsequious black man, who was "slow-witted and lazy, and thereby exploiting whites' sense of superiority."  http://black-face.com/Stepin-Fetchit.htm

Roles are art, and certain works of art gain a familiarity in the public eye.  We call that symbolism.  A brown shirt with a black arm band is Nazism.  A white man in a black mask riding a white horse is the Lone Ranger, a white hero, representing law and order in the old west.

A blackface associates a black man with "slow-witted and lazy".  It's neither the actor, nor the dress, but  the associations and entailments brought forth in the original public apprehension of the role.  That is symbolism.

The actors are not at fault.  Nor are the script writers.  They are just artists who typify the genre.  It's the people who want to live out, and thus eternalize the evil entailed in the story, who are the true racists.

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Re: Tube passenger sparks outrage after painting his face black for Halloween costume - then tells model 'why not?' when she brands it racist

Post by Guest on Mon Oct 29, 2018 8:01 pm

Original Quill wrote:
Didge wrote:You have explain to Syl, that you believe that its racist to apply a person in a film as black as a killer, doing evil as wrong and racist, but the same does not apply to the white charcters in the film.

Your phrasing is as convoluted as your thinking (rabbit-holes and such).  I'll just begin over again.

The symbolic role of blackface is owned by Lincoln Perry, better known by the stage name Stepin Fetchit.  He played the first blackface, a role depicting an obsequious black man, who was "slow-witted and lazy, and thereby exploiting whites' sense of superiority."  http://black-face.com/Stepin-Fetchit.htm



How is Samuel L Jackson playing something comparable to Lincoln perry?

He is not, hence you are just trying to invent something to make your absurd views fit

Its you jumping out of one rabbit hole, creating new ones, by using mortars and grenades

Samuel La jackson in no way is slow-witted or lazy in the film. In fact he comes acorss as very witty, cool and laid back

Hence the absurd poor claim that now you are making on the character of the fim

In other words, you are watching two entirely different things all together

In other words you are creating racism, when there is none

Its just simple leftist PC babble

Now again

How is looking like Samuel L Jackson in fancy dress from the film Pulp Fiction, a racist sterotype?

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Re: Tube passenger sparks outrage after painting his face black for Halloween costume - then tells model 'why not?' when she brands it racist

Post by Original Quill on Mon Oct 29, 2018 8:24 pm

Didge wrote:How is Samuel L Jackson playing something comparable to Lincoln perry?

You're asking me to be a film critic?  I don't think Jules Winnfield, in Pulp Fiction, is comparable to Stepen Fetchit, exactly.  Pulp Fiction was written by  Quinton Tarantino and Canadian producer/director Roger Avary, to be a modern depiction.  The blackface of Perry's character was probably not foremost in their minds.

I think the character is an amalgam of symbols.  Stepen Fetchit is the obsequious, "slow-witted and lazy" depiction of a black.  Jules Winnfield, in Pulp Fiction, is the black and what he has grown into under the contaminated circumstances in which Stepen Fetchit began.

In other words, the moral of the story is: if you deny a man his dignity and self worth, he will eventually demand it by brutal means.  Of course, that's only my opinion.


Last edited by Original Quill on Mon Oct 29, 2018 8:31 pm; edited 1 time in total

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Re: Tube passenger sparks outrage after painting his face black for Halloween costume - then tells model 'why not?' when she brands it racist

Post by Guest on Mon Oct 29, 2018 8:28 pm

Original Quill wrote:
Didge wrote:How is Samuel L Jackson playing something comparable to Lincoln perry?

You're asking me to be a film critic?  I don't think Jules Winnfield, in Pulp Fiction, is comparable to Stepen Fetchit, exactly.  Pulp Fiction was written by  Quinton Tarantino and Canadian producer/director Roger Avary, to be a modern depiction.  The blackface of Perry's character was ptonsnly not foremost in their minds.

.

Hilarious contradiction

You just claimed previously, that it was the same portrayal, from the character of Stephen Fetchit and now do a back step and claim you are not a film critics.

Hence why even bring up Blackface if you believe they are not comparable?

It has zero baring and its you simple inventing something to try and poorly make your poor ill conceived views make sense. They dont

You cannot make it up how constantly you continually dig yourself an even bigger hole

Stop wasting my time with your bullshit and answer the one question you have avoided throughout

How is looking like Samuel L Jackson in fancy dress from the film Pulp Fiction, a racist sterotype?

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Re: Tube passenger sparks outrage after painting his face black for Halloween costume - then tells model 'why not?' when she brands it racist

Post by Original Quill on Mon Oct 29, 2018 8:42 pm

Didge wrote:You just claimed previously, that it was the same portrayal, from the character of Stephen Fetchit and now do a back step and claim you are not a film critics.

No, once again, you didn't pay attention.  I said both characters are symbols.  I specifically disavowed that they were the same:

Original Quill wrote:I don't think Jules Winnfield, in Pulp Fiction, is comparable to Stepen Fetchit, exactly.

But since you flattered me and asked for my critical opinion of how the two characters might be merged, I accommodated:

Original Quill wrote:In other words, the moral of the story is: if you deny a man his dignity and self worth, he will eventually demand it by brutal means.

Nice of you to ask.   Smile

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Re: Tube passenger sparks outrage after painting his face black for Halloween costume - then tells model 'why not?' when she brands it racist

Post by Guest on Mon Oct 29, 2018 8:49 pm

Original Quill wrote:
Didge wrote:You just claimed previously, that it was the same portrayal, from the character of Stephen Fetchit and now do a back step and claim you are not a film critics.

No, once again, you didn't pay attention.  I said both characters are symbols.  I specifically disavowed that they were the same:

Original Quill wrote:I don't think Jules Winnfield, in Pulp Fiction, is comparable to Stepen Fetchit, exactly.

But since you flattered me and asked for my critical opinion of how the two characters might be merged, I accommodated:

Original Quill wrote:In other words, the moral of the story is: if you deny a man his dignity and self worth, he will eventually demand it by brutal means.

Nice of you to ask.   Smile



How?

You have no ide of the backstory of the charcater that Samuel L jackson plays

Hence the absurdity of your argument and even worse a white supremacist could use that very dumb claim to say based on something very subjective

Dignity and self worth

They also make arguments on self worth and dignity, but does that then make their views right?

Of course not

So its a poorly based opinion, not based on a single shred of evidence, but a view you only hold to one character and not John Travolta, where he is a partner to him

Hence the underlining issue, plays no relevance to the story, as we have both a white and black males, part of a gang that kill for money

It also shows that the same problem was faced also by many white people in poor areas, showing again the absurdity of your claim around racism. As the same can apply to many white ethnic groups living in poverty. Hence race is not the core issue, but relative poverty that often leads to crimes. This has been the case for well over a hundred years with gang crime in America, where you now seem to be excusing criminal gangsters based on self worth and dignity. Even though they spared none for their victims. This is why you have not got a clue, because many black and white Americans, suffered the same and never turned to crime

Their crimes in the film, were never racially motivated, but drug related

Hence we go back the core aspect here, that there is no bases for the character of Samuel L Jackson turning to crime, based on a loss of dignity or self worth, based around race.

This is even more evident, as his partner in crime is white

Dont you look very simple now?

Now back to the question you continually dodged

How is looking like Samuel L Jackson in fancy dress from the film Pulp Fiction, a racist sterotype?

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Re: Tube passenger sparks outrage after painting his face black for Halloween costume - then tells model 'why not?' when she brands it racist

Post by HoratioTarr on Tue Oct 30, 2018 11:35 am

Didge wrote:
Original Quill wrote:

No, as I've already explained, the symbolic role of blackface is owned by Lincoln Perry, better known by the stage name Stepin Fetchit.  He played the first blackface, a role depicting an obsequious black man, who was "slow-witted and lazy, and thereby exploiting whites' sense of superiority."  http://black-face.com/Stepin-Fetchit.htm

Roles are art, and certain works of gain a familiarity in the public eye.  We call that symbolism.  A brown shirt with a black arm band is Nazism.  A white man in a black mask riding a white horse is the Lone Ranger, white hero, representing law and order in the old west.  A blackface associates a black man with ""slow-witted and lazy".  It's neither the actor, nor the dress, but  the associations and entailments brought forth in the original public apprehension of the role.

So again you have no reason to class this as racist, just something from the past which had racism behind that, where people blackened their face to mock black people. That is not the case here, as easily seen, by trying to look like a character from a movie. As where is the racism in that?

So you think Johnny Depp is also racist?



That again does not answer my question for the fifth time

How is looking like Samuel L Jackson in fancy dress from the film Pulp Fiction, a racist sterotype?

Johnny Depp is part Native American.
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Re: Tube passenger sparks outrage after painting his face black for Halloween costume - then tells model 'why not?' when she brands it racist

Post by Original Quill on Tue Oct 30, 2018 3:10 pm

Didge wrote:You have no ide of the backstory of the charcater that Samuel L jackson plays

Brevity is the purpose of symbolism.

For example, words are symbols. If I look at an ocean and say How beautiful is the Pacific Ocean, do I need to know the back story of the salinity or chemistry of the water? No, I'm being brief and only referring to it's beauty.

A film script doesn't purport to give you the back story of the character's life. It would destroy by confusion the whole point. A story is told only by selecting pieces of life, and making a point. The character serves the script.

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Re: Tube passenger sparks outrage after painting his face black for Halloween costume - then tells model 'why not?' when she brands it racist

Post by Original Quill on Tue Oct 30, 2018 3:23 pm

HT wrote:Johnny Depp is part Native American.

So am I...my grandfather was very proud of the fact.

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Re: Tube passenger sparks outrage after painting his face black for Halloween costume - then tells model 'why not?' when she brands it racist

Post by Guest on Tue Oct 30, 2018 3:25 pm

Original Quill wrote:
Didge wrote:You have no ide of the backstory of the charcater that Samuel L jackson plays

Brevity is the purpose of symbolism.

For example, words are symbols.  If I look at an ocean and say How beautiful is the Pacific Ocean, do I need to know the back story of the salinity or chemistry of the water?  No, I'm being brief and only referring to it's beauty.

A film script doesn't purport to give you the back story of the character's life.  It would destroy by confusion the whole point.  A story is told only by selecting pieces of life, and making a point.  The character serves the script.

The only symbol I see here is in regards to yourself



Hence in other words youa re talking tripe

Now back to the question you continually dodged

How is looking like Samuel L Jackson in fancy dress from the film Pulp Fiction, a racist sterotype?

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Re: Tube passenger sparks outrage after painting his face black for Halloween costume - then tells model 'why not?' when she brands it racist

Post by Original Quill on Tue Oct 30, 2018 3:30 pm

Didge wrote:
Original Quill wrote:

Brevity is the purpose of symbolism.

For example, words are symbols.  If I look at an ocean and say How beautiful is the Pacific Ocean, do I need to know the back story of the salinity or chemistry of the water?  No, I'm being brief and only referring to it's beauty.

A film script doesn't purport to give you the back story of the character's life.  It would destroy by confusion the whole point.  A story is told only by selecting pieces of life, and making a point.  The character serves the script.

The only symbol I see here is in regards to yourself



Hence in other words youa re talking tripe

Laughing Or, in other words, you have no answer. You could always go to your room and sulk. Wink

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Re: Tube passenger sparks outrage after painting his face black for Halloween costume - then tells model 'why not?' when she brands it racist

Post by Guest on Tue Oct 30, 2018 3:34 pm

Original Quill wrote:
Didge wrote:

The only symbol I see here is in regards to yourself



Hence in other words youa re talking tripe

Laughing    Or, in other words, you have no answer.  You could always go to your room and sulk.  Wink


Oh I have answered throughout and easily dispelled your poor views. Its why you have continually avoided my points

Like the one yesterday where we left off

Instead of taking them on, you deleted all of them and ignored them

Then going on again with your absurd view on symbolism, that has no foundation, or evidence to the charcater of the film

Now back to the question you continually dodged

How is looking like Samuel L Jackson in fancy dress from the film Pulp Fiction, a racist sterotype?

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