My golliwogs are here to stay, insists pub landlord despite complaints to council and police that keeping them on display behind the bar is a hate crime

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My golliwogs are here to stay, insists pub landlord despite complaints to council and police that keeping them on display behind the bar is a hate crime

Post by HoratioTarr on Tue Feb 13, 2018 10:06 am

Investigation is launched after anonymous complaint about the White Hart pub
Chris Ryley and wife Benice face a nervous wait to see if their licence is revoked
The pub in Grays, Essex, has 15 golliwogs of various sizes in full view behind bar
Mr Ryley said he is proud of his pub's welcoming attitude to people of all races


The pub, just a stone's throw from The River Thames, has 15 golliwogs of various sizes in full view behind the bar.

The issue of whether or not the dolls are racist often sparks fierce debate.

Many people hark back to fond childhood memories of the dolls, whereas younger people traditionally argue that golliwogs are a racist icon of a bygone age.

Mr Ryley, 59, said: 'The head of licensing at the council phoned to tell me a complaint had been made and said the same person had also gone to the police.

'He asked if I would consider taking them down. I was shocked - I told the council I would think about it but I cannot see how I have committed an offence so they are here to stay.

'Since we have had them up behind the bar in the past three years, there has only ever been two complaints.

'I will stand my ground. We will stand our ground. I had a golliwog when I was a child and I wish I had kept it.

'For me the golliwogs are nothing to do with racism and we will dig our heels in and will not be taking them down.'

Following the complaint the pub has put up a printed explanation behind the bar of what it feels are the origins of golliwogs.

A spokesman for Thurrock Council confirmed an investigation had been launched.

The authority - which grants pubs their licences - said it would not be giving any more information until the probe has been completed.

A spokeswoman said: 'Thurrock Council received a complaint last week about items being displayed in a local pub.

'It is currently being investigated and therefore it would be inappropriate to comment further at this time.'

A spokeswoman for Essex Police said it had no record of a complaint against the pub.




http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-5384909/My-golliwogs-say-insists-pub-landlord.html
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Re: My golliwogs are here to stay, insists pub landlord despite complaints to council and police that keeping them on display behind the bar is a hate crime

Post by Syl on Tue Feb 13, 2018 12:19 pm

I think he is an idiot tbh.

If he wants his pub to be welcoming to all he shouldn't be displaying symbols that he must know in this day and age can be offensive to some.

I think some people go out of their way to be arseholes. Rolling Eyes

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Re: My golliwogs are here to stay, insists pub landlord despite complaints to council and police that keeping them on display behind the bar is a hate crime

Post by HoratioTarr on Tue Feb 13, 2018 12:23 pm

Syl wrote:I think he is an idiot tbh.

If he wants his pub to be welcoming to all he shouldn't be displaying symbols that he must know in this day and age can be offensive to some.

I think some people go out of their way to be arseholes. Rolling Eyes

I didn't think you could buy them anymore.
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Re: My golliwogs are here to stay, insists pub landlord despite complaints to council and police that keeping them on display behind the bar is a hate crime

Post by Syl on Tue Feb 13, 2018 12:27 pm

HoratioTarr wrote:
Syl wrote:I think he is an idiot tbh.

If he wants his pub to be welcoming to all he shouldn't be displaying symbols that he must know in this day and age can be offensive to some.

I think some people go out of their way to be arseholes. Rolling Eyes

I didn't think you could buy them anymore.

You can, I know of at least 2 places who stock them, or did last time we were there.


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Re: My golliwogs are here to stay, insists pub landlord despite complaints to council and police that keeping them on display behind the bar is a hate crime

Post by nicko on Tue Feb 13, 2018 12:43 pm

Black Children play with "pink" dolls, White Children play with black dolls. These PC idiots should get a life !
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Re: My golliwogs are here to stay, insists pub landlord despite complaints to council and police that keeping them on display behind the bar is a hate crime

Post by Raggamuffin on Tue Feb 13, 2018 12:43 pm

HoratioTarr wrote:
Syl wrote:I think he is an idiot tbh.

If he wants his pub to be welcoming to all he shouldn't be displaying symbols that he must know in this day and age can be offensive to some.

I think some people go out of their way to be arseholes. Rolling Eyes

I didn't think you could buy them anymore.

Yes you can - they're not illegal. I think Ebay tried to stop people selling them on there, but you can still get them. Shops also still sell them.

I wouldn't think someone would lose their license for displaying them in a pub as they're not illegal.

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Re: My golliwogs are here to stay, insists pub landlord despite complaints to council and police that keeping them on display behind the bar is a hate crime

Post by nicko on Tue Feb 13, 2018 12:50 pm

Notice that it's mainly White's who complain !
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Re: My golliwogs are here to stay, insists pub landlord despite complaints to council and police that keeping them on display behind the bar is a hate crime

Post by HoratioTarr on Tue Feb 13, 2018 12:59 pm

Raggamuffin wrote:
HoratioTarr wrote:

I didn't think you could buy them anymore.

Yes you can - they're not illegal. I think Ebay tried to stop people selling them on there, but you can still get them. Shops also still sell them.

I wouldn't think someone would lose their license for displaying them in a pub as they're not illegal.

Ebay are a joke. They allow the sale of real fur, specifically fox fur. I complained about that endlessly and got ignored. But I digress.

I had a golly when I was a kid. He had luminous trousers and dicky and my mum took him off me when the radium scare took off.
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Re: My golliwogs are here to stay, insists pub landlord despite complaints to council and police that keeping them on display behind the bar is a hate crime

Post by HoratioTarr on Tue Feb 13, 2018 1:01 pm

nicko wrote:Notice that it's mainly White's who complain !

I have black mates, and I asked them about that once. They do see it as not quite pc and a dinosaur from another time but it doesn't bother them much in the scheme of things.
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Re: My golliwogs are here to stay, insists pub landlord despite complaints to council and police that keeping them on display behind the bar is a hate crime

Post by Syl on Tue Feb 13, 2018 1:06 pm

HoratioTarr wrote:
nicko wrote:Notice that it's mainly White's who complain !

I have black mates, and I asked them about that once.   They do see it as not quite pc  and a dinosaur from another time but it doesn't bother them much in the scheme of things.  

I just don't see the point of displaying something that is now considered offensive at worst un pc at best.
A lot of things that we once took for granted are now not really welcome, other things take their place....language, habits, TV shows, customs....times move on.
I just clicked on the pic to see how he is displaying them...they are dangling down from the bar by string, as if they are being hung.
It looks like he is deliberately provoking for a response.



Last edited by Syl on Tue Feb 13, 2018 1:19 pm; edited 1 time in total

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Re: My golliwogs are here to stay, insists pub landlord despite complaints to council and police that keeping them on display behind the bar is a hate crime

Post by HoratioTarr on Tue Feb 13, 2018 1:17 pm

Syl wrote:
HoratioTarr wrote:

I have black mates, and I asked them about that once.   They do see it as not quite pc  and a dinosaur from another time but it doesn't bother them much in the scheme of things.  

I just don't see the point of displaying something that is now considered offensive at worst un pc at best.
A lot of things that we once took for granted are now not really welcome, other things take their place....language, habits, TV shows, customs....times move on.

Indeed. However, I still don't see Benny Hill as offensive, or It Ain't Half Hot Mum. How many times do you see gays getting lampooned? Mother in laws? The Irish? Scousers? Blondes? And how many times do those people take umbrage? Hardly ever. And I'll tell you why, because they're not being championed by pearl clutching banner waving snowflakes. It's getting more and more like an Orwellian nightmare in this country with people terrified of upsetting others.

All hail, Family Guy.
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Re: My golliwogs are here to stay, insists pub landlord despite complaints to council and police that keeping them on display behind the bar is a hate crime

Post by Syl on Tue Feb 13, 2018 1:22 pm

HoratioTarr wrote:
Syl wrote:

I just don't see the point of displaying something that is now considered offensive at worst un pc at best.
A lot of things that we once took for granted are now not really welcome, other things take their place....language, habits, TV shows, customs....times move on.

Indeed.   However, I still don't see Benny Hill as offensive, or It Ain't Half Hot Mum.   How many times do you see gays getting lampooned?   Mother in laws?  The Irish?  Scousers?  Blondes?  And how many times do those people take umbrage?  Hardly ever.   And I'll tell you why, because they're not being championed by pearl clutching banner waving snowflakes.    It's getting more and more like an Orwellian nightmare in this country with people terrified of upsetting others.    

All hail, Family Guy.

I agree that some people will look for something to be offended about just to make a fuss.
In comedy especially, unless you want to be banned from TV every word has to be thought out.

What did you think of programmes like Till death do us part and Love thy neighbour for being offensive?

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Re: My golliwogs are here to stay, insists pub landlord despite complaints to council and police that keeping them on display behind the bar is a hate crime

Post by HoratioTarr on Tue Feb 13, 2018 1:25 pm

Syl wrote:
HoratioTarr wrote:

Indeed.   However, I still don't see Benny Hill as offensive, or It Ain't Half Hot Mum.   How many times do you see gays getting lampooned?   Mother in laws?  The Irish?  Scousers?  Blondes?  And how many times do those people take umbrage?  Hardly ever.   And I'll tell you why, because they're not being championed by pearl clutching banner waving snowflakes.    It's getting more and more like an Orwellian nightmare in this country with people terrified of upsetting others.    

All hail, Family Guy.

I agree that some people will look for something to be offended about just to make a fuss.
In comedy especially, unless you want to be banned from TV every word has to be thought out.

What did you think of programmes like Till death do us part and Love thy neighbour for being offensive?

I never watched Love thy Neighbour so can't comment on that. But I did watch TDDUP, and Alf Garnett was always portrayed as a racist jerk.
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Re: My golliwogs are here to stay, insists pub landlord despite complaints to council and police that keeping them on display behind the bar is a hate crime

Post by Syl on Tue Feb 13, 2018 1:30 pm

He was, and Marigold always had the best lines. Razz

It does show how TV has come on in the last 40 odd years though, and how times have changed regarding what's acceptable or not.
The guy in the pub....do you think the way he has actually displayed the gollies is intentional?

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Re: My golliwogs are here to stay, insists pub landlord despite complaints to council and police that keeping them on display behind the bar is a hate crime

Post by magica on Tue Feb 13, 2018 3:03 pm

I don't see them as anything but a doll. They've never reminded me of black person.

My friend is black and a while ago I asked her about them, I said many think they're racist and looking like black people. She laughed and said I don't look like a gollywog, no black people do.

its sad that people think they do, because I never have.

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Re: My golliwogs are here to stay, insists pub landlord despite complaints to council and police that keeping them on display behind the bar is a hate crime

Post by Vintage on Tue Feb 13, 2018 3:11 pm

I don't see the point of the gollies in the pub, there's no theme they are just there - hanging, they are not even attractively displayed.

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Re: My golliwogs are here to stay, insists pub landlord despite complaints to council and police that keeping them on display behind the bar is a hate crime

Post by HoratioTarr on Tue Feb 13, 2018 3:17 pm

Syl wrote:He was, and Marigold always had the best lines. Razz

It does show how TV has come on in the last 40 odd years though, and how times have changed regarding what's acceptable or not.
The guy in the pub....do you think the way he has actually displayed the gollies is intentional?

I have no idea. I shouldn't think he'd have too many customers if he was racist. I'm not sure why you'd pin any kind of doll up in pub. It seems pointless.
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Re: My golliwogs are here to stay, insists pub landlord despite complaints to council and police that keeping them on display behind the bar is a hate crime

Post by HoratioTarr on Tue Feb 13, 2018 3:18 pm

Syl wrote:He was, and Marigold always had the best lines. Razz

It does show how TV has come on in the last 40 odd years though, and how times have changed regarding what's acceptable or not.
The guy in the pub....do you think the way he has actually displayed the gollies is intentional?

That was the whole point of the programme to take the piss out of racists.
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Re: My golliwogs are here to stay, insists pub landlord despite complaints to council and police that keeping them on display behind the bar is a hate crime

Post by WhoseYourWolfie on Tue Feb 13, 2018 4:58 pm

afro

So then,  Stormee's gone back into the family business has he  !?!


Whoever that prat publican is, probably thinks that "any publicity is good publicity"..

And the Daily Flail as always is all too happy to oblige, with their usual racist/anti-p/c efforts.

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Re: My golliwogs are here to stay, insists pub landlord despite complaints to council and police that keeping them on display behind the bar is a hate crime

Post by Syl on Tue Feb 13, 2018 5:21 pm

HoratioTarr wrote:
Syl wrote:He was, and Marigold always had the best lines. Razz

It does show how TV has come on in the last 40 odd years though, and how times have changed regarding what's acceptable or not.
The guy in the pub....do you think the way he has actually displayed the gollies is intentional?

That was the whole point of the programme to take the piss out of racists.  

I know, I remember both programmes.
The language used certainly wouldn't be allowed now, we have swapped n and q words for f and c words..... wonder what will be en vogue 20 years from now.

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Re: My golliwogs are here to stay, insists pub landlord despite complaints to council and police that keeping them on display behind the bar is a hate crime

Post by Syl on Tue Feb 13, 2018 5:30 pm

magica wrote:I don't see them as anything but a doll. They've never reminded me of black person.

My friend is black and a while ago I asked her about them,  I said many think they're racist and looking like black people.  She laughed and said I don't look like a gollywog, no black people do.

its sad that people think they do, because I never have.

I had one when I was a kid, I never connected him with black people either Mags.
But....its no hardship to respect the feelings of others, I doubt anyone would be mentally scarred by not displaying their gollywogs. Wink

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Re: My golliwogs are here to stay, insists pub landlord despite complaints to council and police that keeping them on display behind the bar is a hate crime

Post by magica on Tue Feb 13, 2018 6:16 pm

Syl wrote:
magica wrote:I don't see them as anything but a doll. They've never reminded me of black person.

My friend is black and a while ago I asked her about them,  I said many think they're racist and looking like black people.  She laughed and said I don't look like a gollywog, no black people do.

its sad that people think they do, because I never have.

I had one when I was a kid, I never connected him with black people either Mags.
But....its no hardship to respect the feelings of others, I doubt anyone would be mentally scarred by not displaying their gollywogs. Wink

Tbh why he wants them in a pub is silly really.

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Re: My golliwogs are here to stay, insists pub landlord despite complaints to council and police that keeping them on display behind the bar is a hate crime

Post by eddie on Tue Feb 13, 2018 6:18 pm

Vintage wrote:I don't see the point of the gollies in the pub, there's no theme they are just there - hanging, they are not even attractively displayed.

I thought that. And they’re probably dust-gatherers too.

Take them down mate and grow up.

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Re: My golliwogs are here to stay, insists pub landlord despite complaints to council and police that keeping them on display behind the bar is a hate crime

Post by Syl on Tue Feb 13, 2018 6:22 pm

magica wrote:
Syl wrote:

I had one when I was a kid, I never connected him with black people either Mags.
But....its no hardship to respect the feelings of others, I doubt anyone would be mentally scarred by not displaying their gollywogs. Wink

Tbh why he wants them in a pub is silly really.

I suspect he is deliberately being provocative.

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Re: My golliwogs are here to stay, insists pub landlord despite complaints to council and police that keeping them on display behind the bar is a hate crime

Post by magica on Tue Feb 13, 2018 7:07 pm

If he is, then he's not a nice person.

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Re: My golliwogs are here to stay, insists pub landlord despite complaints to council and police that keeping them on display behind the bar is a hate crime

Post by Cass on Wed Feb 14, 2018 4:31 am

Syl wrote:
magica wrote:

Tbh why he wants them in a pub is silly really.

I suspect he is deliberately being provocative.

Of course he is. Stupid prat.

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Re: My golliwogs are here to stay, insists pub landlord despite complaints to council and police that keeping them on display behind the bar is a hate crime

Post by Syl on Wed Feb 14, 2018 12:45 pm

Cass wrote:
Syl wrote:

I suspect he is deliberately being provocative.

Of course he is. Stupid prat.

I agree Cass....the way he has hung up the gollywogs is too much of a coincidence...nasty piece of work.


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Re: My golliwogs are here to stay, insists pub landlord despite complaints to council and police that keeping them on display behind the bar is a hate crime

Post by Tommy Monk on Wed Feb 14, 2018 10:31 pm

Syl wrote:
HoratioTarr wrote:

I have black mates, and I asked them about that once.   They do see it as not quite pc  and a dinosaur from another time but it doesn't bother them much in the scheme of things.  

I just don't see the point of displaying something that is now considered offensive at worst un pc at best.
A lot of things that we once took for granted are now not really welcome, other things take their place....language, habits, TV shows, customs....times move on.
I just clicked on the pic to see how he is displaying them...they are dangling down from the bar by string, as if they are being hung.
It looks like he is deliberately provoking for a response.



Yeah... right... cos that picture doesn't look fake in any way...



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Re: My golliwogs are here to stay, insists pub landlord despite complaints to council and police that keeping them on display behind the bar is a hate crime

Post by Syl on Thu Feb 15, 2018 12:10 am

Open the link in the OP Tommy.....there is another pic where he is posing with his gollywogs.
Is that one fake too.?

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Re: My golliwogs are here to stay, insists pub landlord despite complaints to council and police that keeping them on display behind the bar is a hate crime

Post by HoratioTarr on Thu Feb 15, 2018 1:21 am

To be fair, there is a wee white golly there too on the shelf. lol!
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Re: My golliwogs are here to stay, insists pub landlord despite complaints to council and police that keeping them on display behind the bar is a hate crime

Post by Syl on Thu Feb 15, 2018 12:48 pm

Tommy Monk wrote:
Syl wrote:

I just don't see the point of displaying something that is now considered offensive at worst un pc at best.
A lot of things that we once took for granted are now not really welcome, other things take their place....language, habits, TV shows, customs....times move on.
I just clicked on the pic to see how he is displaying them...they are dangling down from the bar by string, as if they are being hung.
It looks like he is deliberately provoking for a response.



Yeah... right... cos that picture doesn't look fake in any way...



What about this one? You can see where he has taken it down from.


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Re: My golliwogs are here to stay, insists pub landlord despite complaints to council and police that keeping them on display behind the bar is a hate crime

Post by Tommy Monk on Thu Feb 15, 2018 7:35 pm

That pic doesn't look as dodgy as first one...


And yes I noticed the white one too...



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