SWATTING

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SWATTING

Post by Maddog on Fri Dec 29, 2017 11:18 pm

First topic message reminder :

Thursday night, Wichita, Kansas, Police sent out a SWAT team to respond to a 911 call that a man shot his father and was holding his family hostage in their home.

The telephone call was a lie. There was no hostage situation—but nevertheless a man at the home ended up dead, shot and killed by a police officer at his own front door.

Police right now are being tight-lipped about what actually happened at the home of the dead man, identified by relatives as Andrew Finch, 28, as the circumstances are still under investigation. Police did say they don't believe Finch fired on police officers before they shot him, according to the Wichita Eagle. His family says he was not armed.

It seems likely that this was the outcome of a "swatting" prank that has finally reached its inevitable awful conclusion. "Swatting" is a nasty prank where somebody calls 911 and tells police a violent crime or hostage situation is happening at somebody else's home. Police then show up with weapons to bear and end up terrifying an innocent party who is not doing anything at all. Often times the swatters use tech tools to conceal or change their number so that it appears to be local and credible.

Swatting pranks often have ties to the video gaming community, and that may well be the case here. Though, again, it's still too soon to say for sure, the Eagle reports that the prank may have originated as part of a dispute between Call of Duty gamers. Based on a Twitter fight, it appears one gamer may have given another gamer a false address, that of Finch's family, and that's where the police were sent. Finch's relatives told the Eagle that he didn't play video games, so if these facts are true, he wasn't even a party to this dispute.

http://reason.com/blog/2017/12/29/prank-swat-call-may-have-led-to-wichita

Again, it's not a racial problem, but a problem of poor government.

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Re: SWATTING

Post by Original Quill on Tue Jan 02, 2018 4:05 am

Maddog wrote:
Original Quill wrote:

The article is a product of a shill for the Koch Bros.  We don't need any rewriting of the language.  If you had attended school in the first place, you would already know the meaning of the terms.

Ok, then just say the article doesn't matter and what you have to say does.  Wink

I think it's wise to avoid propaganda, and opt for truth.

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Re: SWATTING

Post by Maddog on Tue Jan 02, 2018 4:17 pm

Original Quill wrote:
Maddog wrote:

Ok, then just say the article doesn't matter and what you have to say does.  Wink

I think it's wise to avoid propaganda, and opt for truth.

Propaganda? It's an article explaining how classic liberalism has morphed into a form of libertarianism.

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Re: SWATTING

Post by Original Quill on Tue Jan 02, 2018 5:29 pm

Maddog wrote:
Original Quill wrote:

I think it's wise to avoid propaganda, and opt for truth.

Propaganda? It's an article explaining how classic liberalism has morphed into a form of libertarianism.

The article begins by stating the oft-repeated argument of libertarians:

Daniel Kline wrote:Libertarians think that many extant interventions do not, in fact, meet the burden of proof for overcoming the presumption. Many interventions should be rolled back, repealed, abolished.

Look at the approach...look at the adjectives.  He is framing the discussion, which eventually confirms one side or another.  Indeed, it's a sales pitch for libertarian ideas:

Daniel Kline wrote:But, again, the term libertarian functions as signification both for the more formulaic thinking of Murray Rothbard and for the less formulaic thinking of Hayek, Friedman, Richard Epstein, Deirdre McCloskey, and organizations such as the Foundation for Economic Education, Cato Institute, Reason, and several units at George Mason University.

Hayek?  Friedman?  He's raising these well-known names, and associating them with the Cato Institute and even George Mason University.  It's propaganda.  The entire article, while purporting only to define a term, is in fact promoting a whole philosophy.

This is typical when academics are twisted into messaging.  George Mason University is to Charles Koch, what Oral Roberts University is to Christian evangelism.  You really do need to read Nancy MacLean's book, Democracy in Chains: The Deep History of the Radical Right's Stealth Plan for America.  One reviewer says:

Genevieve Valentine--NPR wrote:This sixty-year campaign to make libertarianism mainstream and eventually take the government itself is at the heart of Democracy in Chains. It's grim going; this isn't the first time Nancy MacLean has investigated the dark side of the American conservative movement (she also wrote Behind the Mask of Chivalry: The Making of the Second Ku Klux Klan), but it's the one that feels like it was written with a clock ticking down.
https://www.npr.org/2017/06/18/531929217/democracy-in-chains-traces-the-rise-of-american-libertarianism

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"I don't stand by anything."  ― Donald Trump, interview with John Dickerson, 5.1.17...

“That's libertarians for you — anarchists who want police protection from their slaves.” ― Kim Stanley Robinson, Green Mars
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Re: SWATTING

Post by Maddog on Tue Jan 02, 2018 6:23 pm

Original Quill wrote:
Maddog wrote:

Propaganda? It's an article explaining how classic liberalism has morphed into a form of libertarianism.

The article begins by stating the oft-repeated argument of libertarians:

Daniel Kline wrote:Libertarians think that many extant interventions do not, in fact, meet the burden of proof for overcoming the presumption. Many interventions should be rolled back, repealed, abolished.

Look at the approach...look at the adjectives.  He is framing the discussion, which eventually confirms one side or another.  Indeed, it's a sales pitch for libertarian ideas:

Daniel Kline wrote:But, again, the term libertarian functions as signification both for the more formulaic thinking of Murray Rothbard and for the less formulaic thinking of Hayek, Friedman, Richard Epstein, Deirdre McCloskey, and organizations such as the Foundation for Economic Education, Cato Institute, Reason, and several units at George Mason University.

Hayek?  Friedman?  He's raising these well-known names, and associating them with the Cato Institute and even George Mason University.  It's propaganda.  The entire article, while purporting only to define a term, is in fact promoting a whole philosophy.

This is typical when academics are twisted into messaging.  George Mason University is to Charles Koch, what Oral Roberts University is to Christian evangelism.  You really do need to read Nancy MacLean's book, Democracy in Chains: The Deep History of the Radical Right's Stealth Plan for America.  One reviewer says:

Genevieve Valentine--NPR wrote:This sixty-year campaign to make libertarianism mainstream and eventually take the government itself is at the heart of Democracy in Chains. It's grim going; this isn't the first time Nancy MacLean has investigated the dark side of the American conservative movement (she also wrote Behind the Mask of Chivalry: The Making of the Second Ku Klux Klan), but it's the one that feels like it was written with a clock ticking down.
https://www.npr.org/2017/06/18/531929217/democracy-in-chains-traces-the-rise-of-american-libertarianism

He's explaining what libertarians believe. That's not propaganda. That's what politicians do. Wink

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Re: SWATTING

Post by Original Quill on Tue Jan 02, 2018 8:34 pm

Maddog wrote:He's explaining what libertarians believe. That's not propaganda. That's what politicians do.

He is not a politician. He's a professor of economics at George Mason University.

I admit he's acting like a politician, putting out RW propaganda. He should be doing serious academic work--sound hypotheses and objective findings--but that's not what GMU does. That's why I question anything to do with GMU.

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"I don't stand by anything."  ― Donald Trump, interview with John Dickerson, 5.1.17...

“That's libertarians for you — anarchists who want police protection from their slaves.” ― Kim Stanley Robinson, Green Mars
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Re: SWATTING

Post by Maddog on Tue Jan 02, 2018 11:48 pm

Original Quill wrote:
Maddog wrote:He's explaining what libertarians believe. That's not propaganda. That's what politicians do.

He is not a politician.  He's a professor of economics at George Mason University.

I admit he's acting like a politician, putting out RW propaganda.  He should be doing serious academic work--sound hypotheses and objective findings--but that's not what GMU does.  That's why I question anything to do with GMU.

He's a professor of Economics.

Sounds like a dummy. Shocked

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Re: SWATTING

Post by Original Quill on Wed Jan 03, 2018 2:43 am

Maddog wrote:
Original Quill wrote:

He is not a politician.  He's a professor of economics at George Mason University.

I admit he's acting like a politician, putting out RW propaganda.  He should be doing serious academic work--sound hypotheses and objective findings--but that's not what GMU does.  That's why I question anything to do with GMU.

He's a professor of Economics.

Sounds like a dummy. Shocked

It's your article. You answer for him.

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"I don't stand by anything."  ― Donald Trump, interview with John Dickerson, 5.1.17...

“That's libertarians for you — anarchists who want police protection from their slaves.” ― Kim Stanley Robinson, Green Mars
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Re: SWATTING

Post by Maddog on Wed Jan 03, 2018 3:24 pm

Original Quill wrote:
Maddog wrote:

He's a professor of Economics.

Sounds like a dummy. Shocked

It's your article.  You answer for him.

Do you reckon he knows the difference between the debt and deficit? Wink

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Re: SWATTING

Post by WhoseYourWolfie on Wed Jan 03, 2018 3:33 pm

Maddog wrote:
Original Quill wrote:

He is not a politician.  He's a professor of economics at George Mason University.

I admit he's acting like a politician, putting out RW propaganda.  He should be doing serious academic work--sound hypotheses and objective findings--but that's not what GMU does.  That's why I question anything to do with GMU.

He's a professor of Economics.

Sounds like a dummy. Shocked



He holds that professorship at a third-rate backwoods private university thinktank...

Bought and paid for by the Koch bros. 'Big Oli' interests..

"Follow the money trail  !"

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Re: SWATTING

Post by Maddog on Wed Jan 03, 2018 4:06 pm

WhoseYourWolfie wrote:
Maddog wrote:

He's a professor of Economics.

Sounds like a dummy. Shocked



He holds that professorship at a third-rate backwoods private university thinktank...

Bought and paid for by the Koch bros. 'Big Oli' interests..

"Follow the money trail  !"

Third rate eh? Wink

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Re: SWATTING

Post by Original Quill on Wed Jan 03, 2018 5:08 pm

Maddog wrote:
Original Quill wrote:

It's your article.  You answer for him.

Do you reckon he knows the difference between the debt and deficit?  Wink

It's a good question. George Mason University was started by James Buchanan, who with Koch money broke off from the University of Virginia. He fancied himself a "big idea" man, who eschewed econometrics, or, indeed, any kind of rigorous research. The university has grown up under Buchanan's philosophy, umm...with Koch money.

Although conservatives put up a good show about budgets and debt, they are the ones who go astray most often. Wasn't it VP Dick Cheney who responded to a reporter with the famous "deficits don't matter"...at a time when his administration was administering a tax cut for the wealthy, a war in Iraq and promoting a new prescription drug program?



Of course, that administration was the same one that went broke in October, 2008, putting us closer to disaster than we had been since the Great Depression. In fact, Dr. Obama (again, a Democrat) had to clean up that mess. The Republicans (Bush and Cheney) had left the country in an ugly, purposeless war, on the brink of the next depression, with double-digit unemployment, a $17-trillion deficit and bin Ladin still alive and running around.

Obama got the country out of Iraq, saved America from the next Depression, brought unemployment down from 10.5% to 4.5%, oversaw the creation of 4.5-million jobs, oversaw the American stock market soar to over $17,000 average in the Dow Jones (in the same surge, it is now over $22,000), finally created a highly successful and popular medical care system...and he got bin Laden when the Republican administration was completely inept at finding him.

I don't think the Koch Bros. and George Mason University are doing anything for the good of the nation. They are just engines for wealth-shifting, from poorer, browner elements of society, to the richer, more privileged, white class in America. They promote institutional selfishness. Charlottesville was the real picture of what is happening in America.

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“Little thieves are hanged, but great thieves are praised.” — Old Russian proverb, offered by Vladimir Putin to Donald J. Trump.

"I don't stand by anything."  ― Donald Trump, interview with John Dickerson, 5.1.17...

“That's libertarians for you — anarchists who want police protection from their slaves.” ― Kim Stanley Robinson, Green Mars
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Re: SWATTING

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