If god is all powerful why does he allow sin?

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Post by Guest on Wed Feb 05, 2014 7:13 pm

First topic message reminder :

Apparently homosexuality is a sin - if you put a certain spin on the bible texts.

Yet it is claimed god is all powerful.

If he is all powerful why did he create homosexuality?

If he is all powerful why does he refuse to help those who believe that interpretation of the bible when they beg him to help them change?

Surely the evidence is that if god does exist he is one sadistic bugger.

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Post by Guest on Tue Feb 25, 2014 2:00 pm

smelly_bandit wrote:you don't raise any points, you raise a single point and then ignore any and all alternative views that you see as challenging to your point which you then declare it is the only correct one

ive read your posts and they are all the same, they focus only on what you want to present and only then form one angle

your understanding of "all knowing" is incorrect since it is limiting and restrictive which essentially negates the idea of all knowing

your understanding of freewill is incorrect because you argue that since god is all knowing it means that each person has a set start middle and end  

ive tried before to explain it to you and you don't listen to anyone but yourself or your fellow gang members all of whom are not arguing the merits of freewill but rather they are arguing from their point of view as to why freewill makes no sense to them

unfortunately your lack of comprehension is not my problem, nor is it my responsibility to remedy


 ://?roflmao?/: 

So basically smelly has just argued the Christian god is not all knowing even though claims to be thus in the bible

 ://?roflmao?/: 


Got to love some Christians they really are as stupid as they come

The Christian God is defined as a personal being who knows everything. According to Christians, personal beings have free will.

In order to have free will, you must have more than one option, each of which is avoidable. This means that before you make a choice, there must be a state of uncertainty during a period of potential: you cannot know the future. Even if you think you can predict your decision, if you claim to have free will, you must admit the potential (if not the desire) to change your mind before the decision is final.

A being who knows everything can have no "state of uncertainty." It knows its choices in advance. This means that it has no potential to avoid its choices, and therefore lacks free will. Since a being that lacks free will is not a personal being, a personal being who knows everything cannot exist.

Therefore, the Christian God does not exist.


Last edited by PhilDidge on Tue Feb 25, 2014 2:01 pm; edited 1 time in total

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Post by Guest on Tue Feb 25, 2014 2:01 pm

smelly_bandit wrote:
heavenly father wrote:

when faced with the obvious fact he is wrong, didge retreats too that not right so its illogical argument. Smile 

i blame myself

didge had to make a very public groveling apology to me on sky when he argued that Islam taught the concept of a pantheon of gods

he has never been the same since then


lol, you created a monster..lol SB is Frankendidge...lol

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Post by Guest on Tue Feb 25, 2014 2:03 pm

heavenly father wrote:
smelly_bandit wrote:

i blame myself

didge had to make a very public groveling apology to me on sky when he argued that Islam taught the concept of a pantheon of gods

he has never been the same since then


lol, you created a monster..lol SB is Frankendidge...lol


Oh dear the poor clouded Christians back to make things up again and avoiding the debate


I love now how smelly tries to redefine what all knowing means that one was priceless.

 ://?roflmao?/: 

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Post by Guest on Tue Feb 25, 2014 2:03 pm

The Christian God is defined as a personal being who knows everything. According to Christians, personal beings have free will.

In order to have free will, you must have more than one option, each of which is avoidable. This means that before you make a choice, there must be a state of uncertainty during a period of potential: you cannot know the future. Even if you think you can predict your decision, if you claim to have free will, you must admit the potential (if not the desire) to change your mind before the decision is final.

A being who knows everything can have no "state of uncertainty." It knows its choices in advance. This means that it has no potential to avoid its choices, and therefore lacks free will. Since a being that lacks free will is not a personal being, a personal being who knows everything cannot exist.

Therefore, the Christian God does not exist.

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Post by Guest on Tue Feb 25, 2014 2:04 pm

PhilDidge wrote:
heavenly father wrote:


lol, you created a monster..lol SB is Frankendidge...lol


Oh dear the poor clouded Christians back to make things up again and avoiding the debate


I love now how smelly tries to redefine what all knowing means that one was priceless.

 ://?roflmao?/: 

avoid what debate, i'm still trying to work out why you think and all powerful God cannot effect the fate of his own creation...lol  :/pwn://: 

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Post by Guest on Tue Feb 25, 2014 2:07 pm

heavenly father wrote:
PhilDidge wrote:


Oh dear the poor clouded Christians back to make things up again and avoiding the debate


I love now how smelly tries to redefine what all knowing means that one was priceless.

 ://?roflmao?/: 

avoid what debate, i'm still trying to work out why you think and all powerful God cannot effect the fate of his own creation...lol  :/pwn://: 


Oh dear back to claiming you are right


So explain to me what all knowing means to you


This will be excellent to see how badly some Christians just make things up

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Post by Guest on Tue Feb 25, 2014 2:09 pm

PhilDidge wrote:The Christian God is defined as a personal being who knows everything. According to Christians, personal beings have free will.

In order to have free will, you must have more than one option, each of which is avoidable. This means that before you make a choice, there must be a state of uncertainty during a period of potential: you cannot know the future. Even if you think you can predict your decision, if you claim to have free will, you must admit the potential (if not the desire) to change your mind before the decision is final.

A being who knows everything can have no "state of uncertainty." It knows its choices in advance. This means that it has no potential to avoid its choices, and therefore lacks free will. Since a being that lacks free will is not a personal being, a personal being who knows everything cannot exist.

Therefore, the Christian God does not exist.

Well done

2000 years of theology destroyed by an unknown internet mong who can't even spell properly

 ://?roflmao?/: 

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Post by Guest on Tue Feb 25, 2014 2:10 pm

smelly_bandit wrote:
PhilDidge wrote:The Christian God is defined as a personal being who knows everything. According to Christians, personal beings have free will.

In order to have free will, you must have more than one option, each of which is avoidable. This means that before you make a choice, there must be a state of uncertainty during a period of potential: you cannot know the future. Even if you think you can predict your decision, if you claim to have free will, you must admit the potential (if not the desire) to change your mind before the decision is final.

A being who knows everything can have no "state of uncertainty." It knows its choices in advance. This means that it has no potential to avoid its choices, and therefore lacks free will. Since a being that lacks free will is not a personal being, a personal being who knows everything cannot exist.

Therefore, the Christian God does not exist.

Well done

2000 years of theology destroyed by an unknown internet mong who can't even spell properly

 ://?roflmao?/: 


Not as bad as you defining a deity that is not all  knowing, when that deity is claimed to be, that was priceless

 ://?roflmao?/: 

Here is the link if you want to read and disprove then ha ha ha, so spelling shows something wrong with a concept now?



http://ffrf.org/legacy/about/bybarker/fang.php

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Post by Guest on Tue Feb 25, 2014 2:13 pm

PhilDidge wrote:
heavenly father wrote:

avoid what debate, i'm still trying to work out why you think and all powerful God cannot effect the fate of his own creation...lol  :/pwn://: 


Oh dear back to claiming you are right


So explain to me what all knowing means to you


This will be excellent to see how badly some Christians just make things up

all knowing is what God is, God does know everything, he knows the result of everything we chose to do but he can do things that will give us an opportunity to chose to believe...

neither stop him knowing everything and all powerful means he can effect everything...

what's the problem with that. Smile 

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Post by Guest on Tue Feb 25, 2014 2:16 pm

heavenly father wrote:
PhilDidge wrote:


Oh dear back to claiming you are right


So explain to me what all knowing means to you


This will be excellent to see how badly some Christians just make things up

all knowing is what God is, God does know everything, he knows the result of everything we chose to do but he can do things that will give us an opportunity to chose to believe...

neither stop him knowing everything and all powerful means he can effect everything...

what's the problem with that. Smile 


If thus god knows everything he will know in advance every choice you make, this stands to reason by the fact he would know everything.

DOH

If he thus knows all your choices in advance then everything is predetermined, thus no free will

Hence why some Christians like you and smelly clearly cannot comprehend what all knowing means.


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Post by Guest on Tue Feb 25, 2014 2:19 pm

Fuzzy Zack wrote:
PhilDidge wrote:


You are still not grasping this Zack, relativity is based upon space and time, he is trying a concept based on this with humans having choices or lack of choices, where is the testable science on this with humans?

He had none, so you are going off the back of his claims using Einsteins theory and not testing the concept proposed from Einsteins theory, do you not see the difference?

You provided no science for this concept you provided the theory of relativity and tried to match to the two, and badly at that

DOH

Again you're basing your views on the simplistic article I provided.

The Now Slice is based on Einsteins equations.  Just as time travel cannot be experimentally proven, doesn't mean the theory is invalid. Time travel is possible and we can observe it at small and very large scales also.

Like I said - the science is out there if you're not so caught up in your denial.

As I said, if you want hard science - there are a multitude of articles when you google Now Slice Time. Or do you prefer to stay in denial until I spoon feed you like a toddler?


Dear me there is many concepts and never knew you could get so upset over something, hey ho, the fact is the now slice is based on Einsteins theory, well done, but you have proven nothing and of yet offer no methodology or testable science to prove your hypothesis from this link you provided, so why should I look up something you claim to be fact, the onus is on you to prove it.

Again there are plenty of views on this

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Philosophy_of_space_and_time

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Post by Guest on Tue Feb 25, 2014 2:19 pm

PhilDidge wrote:
heavenly father wrote:

all knowing is what God is, God does know everything, he knows the result of everything we chose to do but he can do things that will give us an opportunity to chose to believe...

neither stop him knowing everything and all powerful means he can effect everything...

what's the problem with that. Smile 


If thus god knows everything he will know in advance every choice you make, this stands to reason by the fact he would know everything.

DOH

If he thus knows all your choices in advance then everything is predetermined, thus no free will

Hence why some Christians like you and smelly clearly cannot comprehend what all knowing means.


lol how does God knowing the result of your choice lesson your choice and take away free will...

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Post by Guest on Tue Feb 25, 2014 2:23 pm

Sorry Zack how is this fact, which is what you are claiming?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/B-theory_of_time

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Post by Guest on Tue Feb 25, 2014 2:24 pm

heavenly father wrote:
PhilDidge wrote:


If thus god knows everything he will know in advance every choice you make, this stands to reason by the fact he would know everything.

DOH

If he thus knows all your choices in advance then everything is predetermined, thus no free will

Hence why some Christians like you and smelly clearly cannot comprehend what all knowing means.


lol how does God knowing the result of your choice lesson your choice and take away free will...


Hilarious, proving my point that some Christians do not understand what all knowing means.

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Post by nicko on Tue Feb 25, 2014 2:28 pm

didge,you should ignore the prat,he was just as obnoxious on sky
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Post by Guest on Tue Feb 25, 2014 2:33 pm

Fuzzy Zack wrote:
PhilDidge wrote:


Dear me there is many concepts and never knew you could get so upset over something, hey ho, the fact is the now slice is based on Einsteins theory, well done, but you have proven nothing and of yet offer no methodology or testable science to prove your hypothesis from this link you provided, so why should I look up something you claim to be fact, the onus is on you to prove it.

Again there are plenty of views on this

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Philosophy_of_space_and_time

"so why should I look up something you claim to be fact".

If the tables were reversed and I knew I was right, I'd take the opportunity to prove you wrong.

I certainly wouldn't be a coward.

The onus is on me to prove it? You really haven't grown up, have you.

The onus is on you to open your mind. You're too scared to do a simple google search, just in case your illusions are shattered.




I have looked it ip and it is a debate on a theory, nothing more, it is certainly not proven and not once have you even provided any testable science on this, meaning to me you yourself are unsure of the science behind this. So basically you are putting faith again in something you do not understand and asking me to do the same, no thanks, I already have looked up and seen your claim is not a fact what you are claiming.

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Post by Guest on Tue Feb 25, 2014 2:35 pm

where did my reply go...

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Post by Guest on Tue Feb 25, 2014 2:40 pm

heavenly father wrote:where did my reply go...


I would not worry, your replies bring little value, so maybe your God provided a miracle here to save you posting an embarrassing reply and proving again you have no free will if you are a Christian .

 lol! 

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Post by Guest on Tue Feb 25, 2014 2:47 pm

Fuzzy Zack wrote:
PhilDidge wrote:


I have looked it ip and it is a debate on a theory, nothing more, it is certainly not proven and not once have you even provided any testable science on this, meaning to me you yourself are unsure of the science behind this. So basically you are putting faith again in something you do not understand and asking me to do the same, no thanks, I already have looked up and seen your claim is not a fact what you are claiming.

Yeah, sure I believe you. And I'm sure you did so without any bias. *sarcasm.

I'll take another track with you. Can you show me the scientific theory which states there are multiple futures using Einsteins equations?


Oh my, so you really do not know what you are backing her, because you cannot provide simple testable theories, even though I know there are many debates as provided by my links on this?
Seriously you use faith again in something that is not proven, not relativity, but your belief on how we are not able to have free will now based using this science.
Sorry you want me to debate links, or you?
Thus that means you propose methods and tests to prove me wrong, as you made the absurd claim here, not I, thus you have to back up your claim.
If I say God does not exists, then I back it up, so what you are doing is being a complete copout

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Post by Guest on Tue Feb 25, 2014 2:51 pm

Just read all I needed to know from this link Zack and again a concept

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eternalism_(philosophy_of_time)

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Post by Guest on Tue Feb 25, 2014 3:08 pm

don't see how an all powerful

God cannot effect the fate of his creation... Smile 


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Post by Guest on Tue Feb 25, 2014 3:18 pm

how do scientist prove the future is fixed..

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Post by Eilzel on Tue Feb 25, 2014 4:43 pm

heavenly father wrote:how do scientist prove the future is fixed..

Scientists don't believe the future is fixed so why ask that question?

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Post by Guest on Tue Feb 25, 2014 4:46 pm

Eilzel wrote:
heavenly father wrote:how do scientist prove the future is fixed..

Scientists don't believe the future is fixed so why ask that question?

i thought phildidge said scientist have proved that the future is fixed?? perhaps i read it wrong... Smile

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Post by Guest on Tue Feb 25, 2014 5:33 pm

heavenly father wrote:
Eilzel wrote:

Scientists don't believe the future is fixed so why ask that question?

i thought phildidge said scientist have proved that the future is fixed?? perhaps i read it wrong... Smile

Indeed you did get it wrong again, just like you fail to understand many things


Hi again Zack
Sorry but you do not have science to back you up here, what you have is relativity and a concept based off that which does not have any proof and yes I have read further, It is like all the scientific Quranic claims made by many Muslims today making something fit to their belief, nothing more.
You never used once scientific explanations lol, you gave a link to one person of which again I am not convinced you understand this concept being as you cannot and have refused to back it up in your own words

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Post by Guest on Tue Feb 25, 2014 6:58 pm

PhilDidge wrote:
smelly_bandit wrote:

Well done

2000 years of theology destroyed by an unknown internet mong who can't even spell properly

 ://?roflmao?/: 


Not as bad as you defining a deity that is not all  knowing, when that deity is claimed to be, that was priceless

 ://?roflmao?/: 

Here is the link if you want to read and disprove then ha ha ha, so spelling shows something wrong with a concept  now?



http://ffrf.org/legacy/about/bybarker/fang.php

as is said

your lack of understanding is not my responsibility to remedy

ive tried but you are too entrenched to approach things with an open mind

youre entitled to your views of course, as funny as i find them


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Post by Guest on Tue Feb 25, 2014 7:19 pm

smelly_bandit wrote:
PhilDidge wrote:


Not as bad as you defining a deity that is not all  knowing, when that deity is claimed to be, that was priceless

 ://?roflmao?/: 

Here is the link if you want to read and disprove then ha ha ha, so spelling shows something wrong with a concept  now?



http://ffrf.org/legacy/about/bybarker/fang.php

as is said

your lack of understanding is not my responsibility to remedy

ive tried but you are too entrenched to approach things with an open mind

youre entitled to your views of course, as funny as i find them  



Copout, all can see you and HF have not a scooby doo and make it up as you go along to try poorly to make something you think makes sense but is illogical.
The reality is all knowing means all knowing, thus knowing every action everyone does, thus predetermined, thus no free will.
This is what you are unable to grasp, you think you understand this, yet cannot simply grasp what all knowing means

DOH

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Post by Guest on Tue Feb 25, 2014 8:08 pm

PhilDidge wrote:
smelly_bandit wrote:

as is said

your lack of understanding is not my responsibility to remedy

ive tried but you are too entrenched to approach things with an open mind

youre entitled to your views of course, as funny as i find them  



Copout, all can see you and HF have not a scooby doo and make it up as you go along to try poorly to make something you think makes sense but is illogical.
The reality is all knowing means all knowing, thus knowing every action everyone does, thus predetermined, thus no free will.
This is what you are unable to grasp, you think you understand this, yet cannot simply grasp what all knowing means

DOH

"The reality is all knowing means all knowing, thus knowing every action everyone does, thus predetermined, thus no free will"

that's YOUR understanding of freewill and "all knowing", that is YOUR opinion, that is YOUR perspective

it is not the only way to understand it, it is not the only perspective.

i love how you climb up on your soapbox and declare yourself to be the final authority on just about everything going.

you're not god, and you're not an authority on anything

you're the same as everyone else on here, an anonymous internet user trying to shout the loudest about how his views and only his views are right

its a waste of time discussing anything with you, you're so dug in that there is zero chance of you ever conceding anything to anyone you don't agree with

so what is the point??










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Post by Guest on Tue Feb 25, 2014 8:32 pm

smelly_bandit wrote:
PhilDidge wrote:


Copout, all can see you and HF have not a scooby doo and make it up as you go along to try poorly to make something you think makes sense but is illogical.
The reality is all knowing means all knowing, thus knowing every action everyone does, thus predetermined, thus no free will.
This is what you are unable to grasp, you think you understand this, yet cannot simply grasp what all knowing means

DOH

"The reality is all knowing means all knowing, thus knowing every action everyone does, thus predetermined, thus no free will"

that's YOUR understanding of freewill and "all knowing", that is YOUR opinion, that is YOUR perspective

it is not the only way to understand it, it is not the only perspective.

i love how you climb up on your soapbox and declare yourself to be the final authority on just about everything going.

you're not god, and you're not an authority on anything

you're the same as everyone else on here, an anonymous internet user trying to shout the loudest about how his views and only his views are right

its a waste of time discussing anything with you, you're so dug in that there is zero chance of you ever conceding anything to anyone you don't agree with

so what is the point??



Hilarious, no what it is smelly is simple understanding of the reality of what all knowing would constitute, which the reality is you fail to even comprehend the significance of such a thing.
Again if a being you call it god can know absolutely everything, being future past and present, then knowing the future and what everyone does, means that all is impossible to change, otherwise it would prove your faith in a deity being all knowing is wrong.

The reality here is that because you are so clouded by religious dogma, you fail to understand this simple problem, being that all known events what constitute everything being planned in advance, because knowing everything means knowing all outcomes in advance, thus there is no alternative outcome, as again the future is set and fixed. To claim there is alternatives and that you say God allows us to choose one alternative would be illogical to all knowing because all knowing would still know what alternative you would choose, thus negating any choice on the individual in the first place.

That is what you fail to grasp each time, because to have alternatives and God does not know which you will choose would mean he is not all knowing, just very knowing, hence you cannot understand the difference. Thus if he knows what you will do, it cannot be a choice, as it is predetermined.

Maybe tomorrow you might impress me with actually trying to even understanding what you are claiming

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Post by Guest on Tue Feb 25, 2014 8:56 pm

PhilDidge wrote:
smelly_bandit wrote:

"The reality is all knowing means all knowing, thus knowing every action everyone does, thus predetermined, thus no free will"

that's YOUR understanding of freewill and "all knowing", that is YOUR opinion, that is YOUR perspective

it is not the only way to understand it, it is not the only perspective.

i love how you climb up on your soapbox and declare yourself to be the final authority on just about everything going.

you're not god, and you're not an authority on anything

you're the same as everyone else on here, an anonymous internet user trying to shout the loudest about how his views and only his views are right

its a waste of time discussing anything with you, you're so dug in that there is zero chance of you ever conceding anything to anyone you don't agree with

so what is the point??



Hilarious, no what it is smelly is simple understanding of the reality of what all knowing would constitute, which the reality is you fail to even comprehend the significance of such a thing.
Again if a being you call it god can know absolutely everything, being future past and present, then knowing the future and what everyone does, means that all is impossible to change, otherwise it would prove your faith in a deity being all knowing is wrong.

The reality here is that because you are so clouded by religious dogma, you fail to understand this simple problem, being that all known events what constitute everything being planned in advance, because knowing everything means knowing all outcomes in advance, thus there is no alternative outcome, as again the future is set and fixed. To claim there is alternatives and that you say God allows us to choose one alternative would be illogical to all knowing because all knowing would still know what alternative you would choose, thus negating any choice on the individual in the first place.

That is what you fail to grasp each time, because to have alternatives and God does not know which you will choose would mean he is not all knowing, just very knowing, hence you cannot understand the difference. Thus if he knows what you will do, it cannot be a choice, as it is predetermined.

Maybe tomorrow you might impress me with actually trying to even understanding what you are claiming

im not here to impress you didge

ive listened to your views and i disagree with them since they are very limited and focused only on a single point - since god is all knowing there can be no free will

you are of course getting confused with predestination

ive given you an alternative explanation for free will and all knowing and how they work - you didn't like it so you dismissed it

i cannot force you to accept anything you don't want to

you however need to be aware that you are not the authority on all things and your opinions and views are no more right or wrong than anyone else's, that are simply that - YOUR personal views which you are trying to shout over the top of everyone else

crack on fella








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Post by Guest on Tue Feb 25, 2014 10:07 pm

Thank you for proving my point you just make things up as you go along smelly, showing clearly how you have no concept of anything logical, how now you wish to bend the rules ignoring the fact not only do you not understand but cannot provide one verse from your faith that refutes God knowing everything and even worse stating that the future has alternatives.

That is the reality of the stigma you are faced with, your claim is based off your own perception of you yourself trying to understand a figment of your imagination. What I am proposing is a simple reality to you, that if there was such a thing as a thing that could see and know all, would mean the future is set, meaning none could have any responsibility over their actions, because the future in thus set.

So on one factor you cannot comprehend all knowing and on the other, you provide no passage or word from your figment of imagination to back your view, which  declares alternative futures.
You thus are talking balderdash

You then claim for me to understand that your point has no evidence to back it, because you are relying on me to have faith in what you say is correct.


Hilarious

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Post by Guest on Tue Feb 25, 2014 10:47 pm

PhilDidge wrote:Thank you for proving my point you just make things up as you go along smelly, showing clearly how you have no concept of anything logical, how now you wish to bend the rules ignoring the fact not only do you not understand but cannot provide one verse from your faith that refutes God knowing everything and even worse stating that the future has alternatives.

That is the reality of the stigma you are faced with, your claim is based off your own perception of you yourself trying to understand a figment of your imagination. What I am proposing is a simple reality to you, that if there was such a thing as a thing that could see and know all, would mean the future is set, meaning none could have any responsibility over their actions, because the future in thus set.

So on one factor you cannot comprehend all knowing and on the other, you provide no passage or word from your figment of imagination to back your view, which  declares alternative futures.
You thus are talking balderdash

You then claim for me to understand that your point has no evidence to back it, because you are relying on me to have faith in what you say is correct.


Hilarious

you're wrong

i couldn't care if you think what i say is correct or not

YOU are not god and YOU are not an authority on the christian religion, YOU are not an authority on anything.

 ://?roflmao?/: 

it is only in YOUR mind where free will cannot be possible, because YOU cannot understand the concept of freewill and how it works

you're adopting a position in this conversation that you have manufactured

i don't deny that god knows all in fact its works perfectly with free will but your idea of "all knowing" limits gods ability to actually know all

your argument is "if god knows all then our future is set and we have no free will"

that argument limits gods ability to know all down to knowing a single path for each person and effectively binds and restricts him to the future he has set for each of us, if our future is set by god then god cannot know what would have happened to us if we had of chosen other paths since according to you he hasn't given us other paths to take, thus according to your argument he is not all knowing

so in one step you've removed gods imagination (because apparently he can only think of one life path for each of us to live), his all knowing quality (since he would not know what other lives we may have lived), and his omnipotence (since you have placed your own restrictive set of laws on him)

this is not free will this is predestination

you are getting confused with predestination

if you don't agree then please feel free to enlighten us as to what your understanding is of "freewill" and then contrast it with your understanding of "predestination"

"freewill is..................."

"predestination is.........................."

lets see if anyone can spot the difference  ::smthg:: ::smthg:: 

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Post by Guest on Tue Feb 25, 2014 11:24 pm

The most illogical but funniest load of made up bullshit I have ever been witness to, seriously you win the star award for utter stupidity smelly again proving my point you just make things up and ignore all logic,

Again you back the notion that you are utterly stupid, thinking you now understand your own figment of imagination, your deity, which would thus by doing so negate his existence. The more you open your mouth the more the look utterly idiotic.

I am confused over nothing and again predestination is a Christian conception in itself, one which you cannot it seems understand and wish now to deflect over the difference of the concepts, to deflect over your own stupidity. What matters is you are able to back up your claim, on alternative futures, let alone you have no case for an all knowing deity. As seen an all knowing deity negates free will, you just being an imbecile cannot accept logic, its above your pay grade.

So its a simple case of accepting facts, do you think you can decide what you do tomorrow, if already the make belief fantasy you believe in knows already what you will do?
If he knows, then you have no choice dummy

 Smile 

Either way you are fucked and also very stupid

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Post by veya_victaous on Wed Feb 26, 2014 1:28 am

heavenly father wrote:and by my logic God is all knowing and all powerful..

I dont undersatand your point, and you did not address a single one of mine.

it is inefficent which is inperfection. God should be a LOT smarter than You and Should be smarter than me to So why doesn't he do it more efficently. he is doing a bad job far from perfect, taking years to do somethign he could have done in an instant.. is it laziness that means even with all knowledge and all power he doesn't bother? it shoudl be really easy for him to fix this.

If you cant respond to any of the points I will assume you admit you are wrong, if you say you rely on faith I will assume that also is an admission of you complete acceptance that you are following nothing but a very incorrect Fairytale.

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Post by Guest on Wed Feb 26, 2014 12:29 pm

veya_victaous wrote:
heavenly father wrote:and by my logic God is all knowing and all powerful..

I dont undersatand your point, and you did not address a single one of mine.

it is inefficent which is inperfection. God should be a LOT smarter than You and Should be smarter than me to So why doesn't he do it more efficently. he is doing a bad job far from perfect, taking years to do somethign he could have done in an instant.. is it laziness that means even with all knowledge and all power he doesn't bother? it shoudl be really easy for him to fix this.

If you cant respond to any of the points I will assume you admit you are wrong, if you say you rely on faith I will assume that also is an admission of you complete acceptance that you are following nothing but a very incorrect Fairytale.

efficient by your standards, your standards are bound by your knowledge of things, would it be more efficient to just build a house, yes, until it collapses through lack of foundations, when you have eternity efficiency seems to diminish in my mind, if you have forever to achieve something why do you need to be efficient, besides God knows what his ultimate goal is and his plan is likely to be a lot better than anything you can come up with... Smile 

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Post by Guest on Wed Feb 26, 2014 3:45 pm

PhilDidge wrote:The  most illogical but funniest load of made up bullshit I have ever been witness to, seriously you win the star award for utter stupidity smelly again proving my point you just make things up and ignore all logic,

Again you back the notion that you are utterly stupid, thinking you now understand your own figment of imagination, your deity, which would thus by doing so negate his existence. The more you open your mouth the more the look utterly idiotic.

I am confused over nothing and again predestination is a Christian conception in itself, one which you cannot it seems understand and wish now to deflect over the difference of the concepts, to deflect over your own stupidity. What matters is you are able to back up your claim, on alternative futures, let alone you have no case for an all knowing deity. As seen an all knowing deity negates free will, you just being an imbecile cannot accept logic, its above your pay grade.

So its a simple case of accepting facts, do you think you can decide what you do tomorrow, if already the make belief fantasy you believe in knows already what you will do?
If he knows, then you have no choice dummy

 Smile 

Either way you are fucked and also very stupid

predestination is..................

freewill is..................

when you grow a spine let me know




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Post by Guest on Wed Feb 26, 2014 4:55 pm

smelly_bandit wrote:
PhilDidge wrote:The  most illogical but funniest load of made up bullshit I have ever been witness to, seriously you win the star award for utter stupidity smelly again proving my point you just make things up and ignore all logic,

Again you back the notion that you are utterly stupid, thinking you now understand your own figment of imagination, your deity, which would thus by doing so negate his existence. The more you open your mouth the more the look utterly idiotic.

I am confused over nothing and again predestination is a Christian conception in itself, one which you cannot it seems understand and wish now to deflect over the difference of the concepts, to deflect over your own stupidity. What matters is you are able to back up your claim, on alternative futures, let alone you have no case for an all knowing deity. As seen an all knowing deity negates free will, you just being an imbecile cannot accept logic, its above your pay grade.

So its a simple case of accepting facts, do you think you can decide what you do tomorrow, if already the make belief fantasy you believe in knows already what you will do?
If he knows, then you have no choice dummy

 Smile 

Either way you are fucked and also very stupid

predestination is..................

freewill is..................

when you grow a spine let me know





 ://?roflmao?/: 

(in Christian theology) the doctrine that God has ordained all that will happen, especially with regard to the salvation of some and not others. It has been particularly associated with the teachings of St Augustine of Hippo and of Calvin.

Dear me, see even many Christians can grasp it but you cannot it seems.

Again I have free will because I am not like you led by a figment of imagination.

The fact is you cannot understand one simple thing, am all knowing deity would see all, thus every move you make in advance, thus it is then predetermined and you would have no free will.
Funny how we have gone back to predestination, simply because you lack any common sense

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Post by Guest on Wed Feb 26, 2014 4:58 pm

i don't think didge will ever realise an all powerful, all knowing God can do what ever he pleases... Smile 

trying to question the logic of an eternal being is like an amoeba trying to understand our logic...

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Post by Guest on Wed Feb 26, 2014 5:04 pm

heavenly father wrote:i don't think didge will ever realise an all powerful, all knowing God can do what ever he pleases... Smile 

trying to question the logic of an eternal being is like an amoeba trying to understand our logic...


Oh my, I doubt anybody could understand many things when they are just a figment of imagination you have, like a belief in a deity.

The reality is simple logic and understanding of "all knowing" something you fail to grasp at every turn just showing how you are of such low intelligence, if something can see all, then they see all of the future and what will pass, if that is the case everything is set in stone and nobody would have any freewill, hence why an all knowing deity is very illogical, sadly though this is what is claimed by the biblical deity.

So if as you claim the future is not set, why the need of the second coming of Christ, surely if the future is not set, people can all change to following Jesus and doing good?
So surely why claim this is going to happen and not say it may happen if people to do follow him?

Whoops

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Post by Guest on Wed Feb 26, 2014 5:09 pm

PhilDidge wrote:
heavenly father wrote:i don't think didge will ever realise an all powerful, all knowing God can do what ever he pleases... Smile 

trying to question the logic of an eternal being is like an amoeba trying to understand our logic...


Oh my, I doubt anybody could understand many things when they are just a figment of imagination you have, like a belief in a deity.

The reality is simple logic and understanding of "all knowing" something you fail to grasp at every turn just showing how you are of such low intelligence, if something can see all, then they see all of the future and what will pass, if that is the case everything is set in stone and nobody would have any freewill, hence why an all knowing deity is very illogical, sadly though this is what is claimed by the biblical deity.

So if as you claim the future is not set, why the need of the second coming of Christ, surely if the future is not set, people can all change to following Jesus and doing good?
So surely why claim this is going to happen and not say it may happen if people to do follow him?

Whoops



actually if you could read Jesus died for us before the world even began, the bible says that..Smile 

why do you think the creator of all things has a problem manipulating time or anything else for that matter... Smile 

out of interest if you know the result of a decision after the decision is made are you still all knowing... Smile 

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Post by Guest on Wed Feb 26, 2014 5:12 pm

heavenly father wrote:
PhilDidge wrote:


Oh my, I doubt anybody could understand many things when they are just a figment of imagination you have, like a belief in a deity.

The reality is simple logic and understanding of "all knowing" something you fail to grasp at every turn just showing how you are of such low intelligence, if something can see all, then they see all of the future and what will pass, if that is the case everything is set in stone and nobody would have any freewill, hence why an all knowing deity is very illogical, sadly though this is what is claimed by the biblical deity.

So if as you claim the future is not set, why the need of the second coming of Christ, surely if the future is not set, people can all change to following Jesus and doing good?
So surely why claim this is going to happen and not say it may happen if people to do follow him?

Whoops



actually if you could read Jesus died for us before the world even began, the bible says that..Smile 

why do you think the creator of all things has a problem manipulating time or anything else for that matter... Smile 

out of interest if you know the result of a decision after the decision is made are you still all knowing... Smile 


 ://?roflmao?/: 


That never answered my questions, all it showed is once again you just make things up as you go along clutching at straws.
Why the second coming of Jesus is set in the future, to then reign another thousand years on earth?
You and smelly claim there is variable futures, yet this clearly shows this is not the case at all does it not.
You fail to comprehend if a future decision is known it cannot change, that means that person who is going to make that decision has no choice in the matter, because it is predetermined

DOH

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Post by Guest on Wed Feb 26, 2014 5:20 pm

PhilDidge wrote:
smelly_bandit wrote:

predestination is..................

freewill is..................

when you grow a spine let me know





 ://?roflmao?/: 

(in Christian theology) the doctrine that God has ordained all that will happen, especially with regard to the salvation of some and not others. It has been particularly associated with the teachings of St Augustine of Hippo and of Calvin.

Dear me, see even many Christians can grasp it but you cannot it seems.

Again I have free will because I am not like you led by a figment of imagination.

The fact is you cannot understand one simple thing, am all knowing deity would see all, thus every move you make in advance, thus it is then predetermined and you would have no free will.
Funny how we have gone back to predestination, simply because you lack any common sense

"The fact is you cannot understand one simple thing, am all knowing deity would see all, thus every move you make in advance, thus it is then predetermined and you would have no free will"

so you have given your understanding of predestination which prevents free will

now perhaps you can give your understanding of free will





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Post by Guest on Wed Feb 26, 2014 5:24 pm

PhilDidge wrote:
heavenly father wrote:



actually if you could read Jesus died for us before the world even began, the bible says that..Smile 

why do you think the creator of all things has a problem manipulating time or anything else for that matter... Smile 

out of interest if you know the result of a decision after the decision is made are you still all knowing... Smile 


 ://?roflmao?/: 


That never answered my questions, all it showed is once again you just make things up as you go along clutching at straws.
Why the second coming of Jesus is set in the future, to then reign another thousand years on earth?
You and smelly claim there is variable futures, yet this clearly shows this is not the case at all does it not.
You fail to comprehend if a future decision is known it cannot change, that means that person who is going to make that decision has no choice in the matter, because it is predetermined

DOH

it did answer your question ...lol if the bible says Jesus died before the earth was formed do you think that my all powerful, all knowing God has to work within the normal constraints of time, think about it... Smile 

on second thoughts don't think about it your head may explode, no actually do think about it... :/pwn://: 

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Post by Guest on Wed Feb 26, 2014 5:26 pm

smelly_bandit wrote:
PhilDidge wrote:


 ://?roflmao?/: 

(in Christian theology) the doctrine that God has ordained all that will happen, especially with regard to the salvation of some and not others. It has been particularly associated with the teachings of St Augustine of Hippo and of Calvin.

Dear me, see even many Christians can grasp it but you cannot it seems.

Again I have free will because I am not like you led by a figment of imagination.

The fact is you cannot understand one simple thing, am all knowing deity would see all, thus every move you make in advance, thus it is then predetermined and you would have no free will.
Funny how we have gone back to predestination, simply because you lack any common sense

"The fact is you cannot understand one simple thing, am all knowing deity would see all, thus every move you make in advance, thus it is then predetermined and you would have no free will"
DOH what on earth do you think everyone has been telling you all along?

DOH


so you have given your understanding of predestination which prevents free will

now perhaps you can give your understanding of free will

So again you never answer any of my points but keep expecting me to answer yours , utterly pathetic, free will to me is the ability to act at my own discretion. Which of course has no bearing on the concept of an all knowing deity
Again if there is a choice, why Revelations?
Surely as you claim people have a choice to avoid this happening, but this is not the case is it according to scriptures?
The biggest fact you ignore is God according to your myths knows already who he is going to save, that means no choice or free will

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Post by Guest on Wed Feb 26, 2014 5:29 pm

heavenly father wrote:
PhilDidge wrote:


 ://?roflmao?/: 


That never answered my questions, all it showed is once again you just make things up as you go along clutching at straws.
Why the second coming of Jesus is set in the future, to then reign another thousand years on earth?
You and smelly claim there is variable futures, yet this clearly shows this is not the case at all does it not.
You fail to comprehend if a future decision is known it cannot change, that means that person who is going to make that decision has no choice in the matter, because it is predetermined

DOH

it did answer your question ...lol if the bible says Jesus died before the earth was formed do you think that my all powerful, all knowing God has to work within the normal constraints of time, think about it... Smile 

on second thoughts don't think about it your head may explode, no actually do think about it... :/pwn://: 

 ://?roflmao?/: 

So Jesus has been around twice now, he died before the earth was formed?
 ://?roflmao?/: 
.
So why is the coming of Jesus twice predetermined?
Again I know you are upset when you start to use the owned sign, ha ha ha, seriously I love it, the reality is revaluations is set, so it is claimed who God will save, that means predetermined, that means nobody has a choice.
Seriously this is what Christianity is the work of men, why it is illogical for this deity to exist

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