New Party...or new candidate?

Go down

New Party...or new candidate?

Post by Original Quill on Thu Aug 31, 2017 6:00 pm

What now?  The Republicans are permanently crack'd.  Trump will get flushed.  The Dems are permanently boring.  Time for a new party?

Matthew Bai wrote:One way or the other, the post-party presidency is coming

You’d have to think that some part of President Trump was relieved to be in Texas this week — to finally be confronting crisis rather than creating it, to be demonstrating some unity rather than driving people further apart.

Of course, Trump being Trump, he somehow managed to speak at a briefing in the middle of a major disaster zone without once mentioning the victims of the hurricane, which he had already admitted to exploiting for its TV ratings.

“What a crowd!” Trump exclaimed upon leaving his event at a firehouse, where 1,000 Texans had gathered for what he seemed to think was an impromptu rally. “What a turnout!”

Back in Washington, though, there were no tributes — only a growing sense, now openly discussed in both parties, that Trump’s hold on the office is proving increasingly tenuous. Rebuked by congressional leaders for his tolerance of white nationalists and for a controversial pardon, abandoned publicly by some members of his own Cabinet, Trump is fast becoming the Tom Hanks of presidents, stranded on his own little political island, futilely throwing coconuts at the wall.

His approval rating, now stuck at around 35 percent in a series of polls, opens the door wide not just to a tumultuous midterm election season, but also to a long and unpredictable presidential campaign after that.

By this time next year, unless something major changes, every third Democrat in Washington will be lining up to form an exploratory committee. But the more interesting maneuvering may be in the Republican Party, where I’m betting we’ll see more than one serious primary challenger step forward. (I’m looking at you, Marco Rubio.)

And then there’s the unlikely, emerging partnership between two idiosyncratic and popular governors named John — Kasich, the Republican from Ohio, and Hickenlooper, his lesser-known Democratic colleague from Colorado — who have begun acting very much like a possible bipartisan ticket in recent weeks, holding a series of events around health care. They’re set to preview their reform plan in interviews today.

Whether or not John Squared holds any real promise as a presidential campaign tandem (and we’ll get to that in a moment), the whole thing raises a larger question that I find highly relevant in the post-Trump moment.

Is America ready for an independent presidency? And should our two fossilized parties be a lot more worried about it than they are?

Well, all right, that’s two questions. But they get to the same central idea.

In full disclosure, I’m probably not the guy you should turn to first if you want a disinterested answer to all this. I’ve been relentlessly harping on the potential for an independent president pretty much since I started following politicians around the country 20 years ago. When all you’ve got is a hammer, everything starts to look an awful lot like a nail.

I happened onto the political scene as a writer in the moment just after Ross Perot — a demonstrably disturbed person who announced that Republicans had tried to ruin his daughter’s wedding — managed to score 18 percent of the vote as an independent candidate promising to balance the budget.

For several years afterward, I spent a lot of my time in the company of politicians like Jesse “the Body” Ventura, the independent governor of Minnesota who for a time seemed like a formidable presidential contender himself, and John McCain, who back then captivated the country by taking on both party establishments.

(Yes, millennials, that John McCain. Go look it up in Wikipedia, and stop expecting the rest of us to do all the work for you.)

I absolutely thought Colin Powell had a chance to win the presidency as an independent in 1996, before he removed himself from contention. I was less convinced by a potential candidate I met in 1999 — some billionaire with the last name of Trump.

Here’s what I came to believe back then, and what I have written many times since: America has no use for a third party, since most of us aren’t all that enamored of the two we already have. But that’s a different thing from a truly independent bid, undertaken by someone (or a couple of someones) who dispenses with primaries and breaks the party paradigm altogether.

My sense, still, is that we’re a lot closer to seeing that kind of campaign succeed than anyone in Washington really imagines, just as we were a lot closer to the hostile takeover of a national party than anyone thought before 2016.

Over the last 20 years, during a time in which the emerging digital culture has weakened just about every institution in America, the grip of the two parties on our political system has loosened considerably. Our politics may feel more polarized between ideological camps, but that’s mostly because the parties are controlled by an ever-winnowing group of diehard activists who present the rest of us with stark, binary choices.

The country’s openness to more alternatives, as measured by the number of Americans who identify themselves as politically independent, has never been more palpable, or more consistent with the way we live our lives generally.

In a very real sense, Trump’s insurgent campaign represented a kind of independent movement inside the Republican Party, which he effectively occupied and then replaced with his family brand. He obliterated the outdated belief that party loyalty matters anything near as much as personality.

Meanwhile, the two principal and related barriers to entry for an independent candidate — the money needed to run a competitive race and the arcane ballot laws that vary wildly by state — have been made vastly less onerous by the spread of broadband.

Sure, it’s still not easy to organize a state-by-state ballot-access drive, or to raise hundreds of millions of dollars. But it’s way easier than it ever was before, and if anyone still buys the myth that money is the driving force in a national campaign, they should study this last election. It turns out free TV time and social media followings are exponentially more valuable.

Which brings us back to Kasich and Hickenlooper, whose flirtation with a bipartisan ticket was reported last week by Axios’s Mike Allen. That really shouldn’t have surprised anyone, not least because Kasich’s closest political adviser is John Weaver, whom I met when he was openly exploring the same thing for McCain in 2000. Weaver has long been a fellow traveler when it comes to upending the system.

(In an interview last week on “Meet the Press,” Kasich, who came away from the last campaign with something of a national following, tried to brush aside questions about a joint ticket, and finally said it wasn’t happening. Which I’m sure is true — at the moment.)

Personally, I find Kasich and Hickenlooper to be among the more genuine and compelling characters in politics today. Neither man is going to be carried along in the prevailing currents of their parties, which are headed toward ideological stridency and confrontation. That makes running in primaries a dubious option.

The problem for the two Johns, should they get serious about a historic joint venture, is that neither of them commands the kind of celebrity coverage that would follow, say, Kanye West or Mark Cuban. And neither of them is a billionaire like Mike Bloomberg, who briefly considered his own independent bid in 2016 (and probably wakes up every day wishing he had a time machine).

They’d have to build a large, grassroots organization of moderates, which is never easy, and they’d have to hope that the two parties ultimately rally around Trump, on one side, and an ideologue like Bernie Sanders or Elizabeth Warren, on the other.

It’s not a high-percentage bet, to be sure, but neither would I call it crazy. It might also be good for the country.

The larger point here, though, is that even by playing with the possibility, these guys are on the vanguard of something. Whether it’s a couple of governors like Kasich and Hickenlooper, or more likely some TV celebrity we haven’t even thought of yet, the nonaligned presidency is probably inevitable, and it could happen as early as 2020.

Yeah, I’ve been saying that forever. It just happens still to be true.

_________________
“Little thieves are hanged, but great thieves are praised.” — Old Russian proverb, offered by Vladimir Putin to Donald J. Trump, Helsinki, July, 2018.

"I don't stand by anything."  ― Donald Trump, interview with John Dickerson, 5.1.17...

“That's libertarians for you — anarchists who want police protection from their slaves.” ― Kim Stanley Robinson, Green Mars
avatar
Original Quill

Posts : 25121
Join date : 2013-12-19
Age : 53
Location : Northern California

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: New Party...or new candidate?

Post by eddie on Thu Aug 31, 2017 6:29 pm

Do you have a link to this article please Quill?

_________________
INTELLIGENCE - “Not because you think you know everything without questioning, but rather because you question everything you think you know.”

Word. Cool
avatar
eddie
King of Beards. Keeper of the Whip. Top Chef. BEES!!!!!! Mushroom muncher. Spider aficionado!

Posts : 35851
Join date : 2013-07-28
Age : 48
Location : England

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: New Party...or new candidate?

Post by Original Quill on Thu Aug 31, 2017 6:48 pm

Fortunately I still had it up:

https://www.yahoo.com/news/one-way-post-party-presidency-coming-090029546.html?soc_trk=gcm&soc_src=dbb2094c-7d9a-37c0-96b9-7f844af62e78&.tsrc=notification-brknews

_________________
“Little thieves are hanged, but great thieves are praised.” — Old Russian proverb, offered by Vladimir Putin to Donald J. Trump, Helsinki, July, 2018.

"I don't stand by anything."  ― Donald Trump, interview with John Dickerson, 5.1.17...

“That's libertarians for you — anarchists who want police protection from their slaves.” ― Kim Stanley Robinson, Green Mars
avatar
Original Quill

Posts : 25121
Join date : 2013-12-19
Age : 53
Location : Northern California

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: New Party...or new candidate?

Post by eddie on Thu Aug 31, 2017 7:35 pm

Original Quill wrote:Fortunately I still had it up:

https://www.yahoo.com/news/one-way-post-party-presidency-coming-090029546.html?soc_trk=gcm&soc_src=dbb2094c-7d9a-37c0-96b9-7f844af62e78&.tsrc=notification-brknews

Thanks.

“What a crowd!” Trump exclaimed upon leaving his event at a firehouse, where 1,000 Texans had gathered for what he seemed to think was an impromptu rally. “What a turnout!”


What an absolute bloody idiot.

_________________
INTELLIGENCE - “Not because you think you know everything without questioning, but rather because you question everything you think you know.”

Word. Cool
avatar
eddie
King of Beards. Keeper of the Whip. Top Chef. BEES!!!!!! Mushroom muncher. Spider aficionado!

Posts : 35851
Join date : 2013-07-28
Age : 48
Location : England

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: New Party...or new candidate?

Post by Jules on Thu Aug 31, 2017 11:49 pm

Original Quill wrote:


Matthew Bai wrote:
Of course, Trump being Trump, he somehow managed to speak at a briefing in the middle of a major disaster

zone without once mentioning the victims of the hurricane,


which he had already admitted to exploiting for its TV ratings......

   

Incredibly crass and he also used the opportunity to plug a new designer cap. The white cap he was wearing retails at $40.


The fool missed a trick  - he should have designed a hooded one and trebled the price, it would have sold out in no time. jocolor


Last edited by Jules on Fri Sep 01, 2017 1:03 am; edited 1 time in total

_________________
In the depth of winter I finally learned that within me there lay an invincible summer ~ Camus.
avatar
Jules

Posts : 2570
Join date : 2016-07-30
Location : Vantage Point

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: New Party...or new candidate?

Post by Jules on Thu Aug 31, 2017 11:58 pm

I had a soft spot for George W Bush. I LOVED absolutely everything about him - apart from his politics of course. He was very entertaining and seemed free of malice. He told funny stories about protesters who mooned at him. His wife looked sweet too. Homely looking folk, they had the common touch.

I wish it were somehow possible for him to replace Trumpee.

_________________
In the depth of winter I finally learned that within me there lay an invincible summer ~ Camus.
avatar
Jules

Posts : 2570
Join date : 2016-07-30
Location : Vantage Point

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: New Party...or new candidate?

Post by *THE Ben Reilly* on Fri Sep 01, 2017 5:03 am

If I had a choice between Trump visiting Texas and Hurricane Harvey visiting Texas ... I'd have to sit down and have a good long think about it.

_________________
“She's a well thought-out plan and I don't know how it happened.”

Eli Young
avatar
*THE Ben Reilly*
Cowboy King. Dread Pirate of the Guadalupe. Enemy of the American people.

Posts : 24459
Join date : 2013-01-19
Age : 43
Location : Jamás Bese el Culo Del Jefe, Texas

View user profile http://www.newsfixboard.com

Back to top Go down

Re: New Party...or new candidate?

Post by WhoseYourWolfie on Fri Sep 01, 2017 11:00 am


The author of that O/P quoted story started off strongly enough,  but I reckon they lost the plot somewhat when they referred to Bernie Sanders and Elizabeth Warren as "idealogues"...

When most of the world would look on those two as fairly "moderate" (i.e. barely left-of-centre..) by international standards..

The USA may well be ready for a third major political party --  but, with the Repub's now mostly "far" right-wing and the Democrat's largely centre-right, and both being "free market" based --  to produce a genuine centrist party, they really should be looking to also pick up supporters from Bernie Sanders' clique, the American Greens, and the old and struggling Labor party remnants.       Arrow

_________________
It's not what you look at that matters, it's what you see.
Our life is frittered away by details. Simplify, simplify.
The mass of men lead lives of quite desperation.
Henry David Thoreau
avatar
WhoseYourWolfie

Posts : 6174
Join date : 2016-02-24
Age : 60
Location : Lake Macquarie, NSW, Australia

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: New Party...or new candidate?

Post by Original Quill on Fri Sep 01, 2017 6:25 pm

WhoseYourWolfie wrote:
The author of that O/P quoted story started off strongly enough,  but I reckon they lost the plot somewhat when they referred to Bernie Sanders and Elizabeth Warren as "idealogues"...

When most of the world would look on those two as fairly "moderate" (i.e. barely left-of-centre..) by international standards..

The USA may well be ready for a third major political party --  but, with the Repub's now mostly "far" right-wing and the Democrat's largely centre-right, and both being "free market" based --  to produce a genuine centrist party, they really should be looking to also pick up supporters from Bernie Sanders' clique, the American Greens, and the old and struggling Labor party remnants.       Arrow

I disagree somewhat, bee...though you know I agree with your politics on the whole.

The reason why American citizens are mostly to the left of the politicians is, America is not a democracy.  The Constitution was designed for equity between states, not among people.  The president is not responsive to the voters, but to a Board of Directors known as the Electoral College.  The House of Representatives may be manipulated, as in Gerrymandering and voter suppression, an art the Republicans have down, and the Russo-Republicans are rapidly learning.  

The Senate is the most voter-responsive organic body of government, as it looks after it's national constituency over its regional constituency.  And look what we have: the Senate holding back the lunacy of the President, and knee-jerk of the House of Representatives.  Could the results be more indicative of the content?

There are enough shenanigans to hold back the US from becoming a real democracy.  Add to this, that the bi-polarity of politics in America comes down to democracy versus anti-democracy, anyway.  Conservatives don't want democracy; they want 'pockets of politics' in the form of states, where they can quickly reduce democracy to monopoly. That's what states' rights is, beneath it all.  

Why else would they want little states, over the big state?  They can control the little uns.  Lol.

_________________
“Little thieves are hanged, but great thieves are praised.” — Old Russian proverb, offered by Vladimir Putin to Donald J. Trump, Helsinki, July, 2018.

"I don't stand by anything."  ― Donald Trump, interview with John Dickerson, 5.1.17...

“That's libertarians for you — anarchists who want police protection from their slaves.” ― Kim Stanley Robinson, Green Mars
avatar
Original Quill

Posts : 25121
Join date : 2013-12-19
Age : 53
Location : Northern California

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: New Party...or new candidate?

Post by Sponsored content


Sponsored content


Back to top Go down

Back to top

- Similar topics

 
Permissions in this forum:
You cannot reply to topics in this forum