Shooting and stabbing at Westminster.

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Shooting and stabbing at Westminster.

Post by Syl on Wed Mar 22, 2017 3:21 pm

First topic message reminder :

Up to 12 people reportedly injured or dead.

News is still breaking.
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2017/03/22/man-shot-police-outside-parliament-officer-reportedly-shoots/

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Re: Shooting and stabbing at Westminster.

Post by Syl on Mon Mar 27, 2017 12:24 pm

Tommy Monk wrote:Yes... but what I'm saying is the news reports have been very low numbers given for injured...


Ahh..I misunderstood what you were saying.
You are right that there haven't been many updates of the people who were very seriously injured,
I believe it was origionally reported that 5 people had been moved to a different hospital with life threatening injuries.....not heard much since, though one elderly man has been reported as dying since of his injuries.

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Re: Shooting and stabbing at Westminster.

Post by Syl on Mon Mar 27, 2017 12:26 pm

veya_victaous wrote:

That's a great image, and why should they not show solidarity with the rest of the country.
They are being killed by Muslim extremists as much as everyone else is when people attack indiscriminately like this.

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Re: Shooting and stabbing at Westminster.

Post by Tommy Monk on Mon Mar 27, 2017 2:00 pm

veya_victaous wrote:


It's only a few though... only the first 11 in fact...



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Re: Shooting and stabbing at Westminster.

Post by Tommy Monk on Mon Mar 27, 2017 2:23 pm



www.bbc.com/news/uk-39408786

6 mins ago - Police believe Khalid Masood was driving up to 76mph on Westminster Bridge where he killed three people, BBC London has learned.

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Re: Shooting and stabbing at Westminster.

Post by Raggamuffin on Mon Mar 27, 2017 6:18 pm

I'm surprised he could go so fast. Where was all the usual traffic?

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Re: Shooting and stabbing at Westminster.

Post by eddie on Mon Mar 27, 2017 6:20 pm

Raggamuffin wrote:I'm surprised he could go so fast. Where was all the usual traffic?

I said that from the very first moment it happened.

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Re: Shooting and stabbing at Westminster.

Post by Tommy Monk on Mon Mar 27, 2017 8:12 pm

I've already said... he was driving up the cycle Lane and the pavement...



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Re: Shooting and stabbing at Westminster.

Post by Raggamuffin on Mon Mar 27, 2017 8:46 pm

Tommy Monk wrote:I've already said... he was driving up the cycle Lane and the pavement...



Even so, other cars must have got in the way. If was driving at that speed on the pavement, I would expect a lot more people to have been killed.

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Re: Shooting and stabbing at Westminster.

Post by Syl on Fri Apr 07, 2017 1:29 pm

The lady who was saved from the Thames that day has now died of her injuries. No

https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/westminster-terror-woman-who-fell-into-thames-dies-dcjttbqsf


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Re: Shooting and stabbing at Westminster.

Post by magica on Fri Apr 07, 2017 1:34 pm

I hope Mahood is suffering in hell, the bastard Twisted Evil

That poor lady, another life lost and for what

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Re: Shooting and stabbing at Westminster.

Post by Syl on Fri Apr 07, 2017 1:44 pm

magica wrote:I hope Mahood is suffering in hell, the bastard Twisted Evil

That poor lady, another life lost and for what

So sad, she had all her life in front of her...taken away in an instant.
Five victims now dead.

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Re: Shooting and stabbing at Westminster.

Post by Lord Foul on Fri Apr 07, 2017 3:01 pm

Well it galls me to have to say this

but all you "poor victims" and "so sad" cryers

TOUGH......

you want multiculturalism, and "tolerance" etc, you promote lack of discipline amongst youngsters (and self discipline most of all) and you enjoin "care and sympathy/ humane treatment of those monsters we DO manage to imprison.........well you got it ...enjoy it.

your society is on its way DOWN


AND this is also related to the "educational achievment thread" its true britsish education is being dumbed down, AND veya is wrong that its NOT the teachers,or at least tose teachers who become "educational theorists

se we in the west have allowed these idiots to get away with "mixed ability teaching" and "free association"
class rooms

the eastern nations ...they are STILL using the sit down shut up face front ...now repeat after me ..."one two is two" "two two are four" approach

coincidence...I think not.

their kids dont go around on first name terms with teachers...their schools are run like a military establishment...

coincidence...i think not.....

etc....


as said...you wanted.....you got....

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Re: Shooting and stabbing at Westminster.

Post by magica on Fri Apr 07, 2017 3:50 pm

Lord Foul wrote:Well it galls me to have to say this

but all you "poor victims" and "so sad" cryers

TOUGH......

you want multiculturalism, and "tolerance" etc, you promote lack of discipline amongst youngsters (and self discipline most of all) and you enjoin "care and sympathy/ humane treatment of those monsters we DO manage to imprison.........well you got it ...enjoy it.

your society is on its way DOWN


AND this is also related to the "educational achievment thread" its true britsish education is being dumbed down, AND veya is wrong that its NOT the teachers,or at least tose teachers who become "educational theorists

se we in the west have allowed these idiots to get away with "mixed ability teaching" and "free association"
class rooms

the eastern nations ...they are STILL using the sit down shut up face front ...now repeat after me ..."one two is two" "two two are four" approach

coincidence...I think not.

their kids dont go around on first name terms with teachers...their schools are run like a military establishment...

coincidence...i think not.....

etc....


as said...you wanted.....you got....

I've not backed lack of discipline at all. I'm all for schools being stricter, teachers being back in charge of their class and not afraid to tell children off when wrong. I never backed multiculturalism, we were never asked when Bliar saw fit to engulf us with immigrants, then Merkel inviting millions into Europe too. None of them asked the people what they wanted.

I don't know where you got this impression from.

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Re: Shooting and stabbing at Westminster.

Post by nicko on Fri Apr 07, 2017 5:09 pm

When my eldest Son came out of the Army he got a job as a teacher.
After a few days he said he could not believe how the pupils behaved.
They messed about in class ,did not listen to the teachers, and in short , behaved how they wanted. On the second day he was there he got the kids to stand when he came in, a few days later they called him "Sir". Every class has it's bully and his class had one,My son asked him if he would like some boxing lessons in the Gym after School,he asked him in front of the class,and not surprisingly he declined. My Son got talking to him after School, he said his Dad hit him and his mom. In a while other pupils came up to ask his advice on various things. Other teachers asked him how he had turned the class around, his answer was he treated them sternly but fairly.
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Re: Shooting and stabbing at Westminster.

Post by magica on Fri Apr 07, 2017 5:38 pm

Good teaching Nicko. Your son was like the teachers in my day.

Teachers have had so much taken from them, it's hard to teach nowadays, there's no respect from some pupils or parents either. Heads are threatened by parents too!

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Re: Shooting and stabbing at Westminster.

Post by nicko on Fri Apr 07, 2017 6:18 pm

When he left after two years the pupils from 3 classes held up banners saying "please don't leave Sir".

He Tought 15 to 17 year olds.
He was a staff Sargent, Drill instructor and Unarmed Combat Instructor, fought in the Falklands and both Gulf wars.
Has two "Mentioned in Dispatches"

Proud of him !
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Re: Shooting and stabbing at Westminster.

Post by Syl on Fri Apr 07, 2017 7:31 pm

Lord Foul wrote:Well it galls me to have to say this

but all you "poor victims" and "so sad" cryers

TOUGH......

you want multiculturalism, and "tolerance" etc, you promote lack of discipline amongst youngsters (and self discipline most of all) and you enjoin "care and sympathy/ humane treatment of those monsters we DO manage to imprison.........well you got it ...enjoy it.

your society is on its way DOWN


AND this is also related to the "educational achievment thread" its true britsish education is being dumbed down, AND veya is wrong that its NOT the teachers,or at least tose teachers who become "educational theorists

se we in the west have allowed these idiots to get away with "mixed ability teaching" and "free association"
class rooms

the eastern nations ...they are STILL using the sit down shut up face front ...now repeat after me ..."one two is two" "two two are four" approach

coincidence...I think not.

their kids dont go around on first name terms with teachers...their schools are run like a military establishment...

coincidence...i think not.....

etc....


as said...you wanted.....you got....

That's a load of bolox if you don't mind me saying so.

Because people welcome others into society, expect fair play, speak out when they see discrimination against anyone, including their own, say forthrightly that though immigration is good is has to be controlled (which usually provokes cries of racism from keyboard idiots) doesn't mean they want to see standards slip, in schools or anywhere else come to that.

I don't see anyone applauding hatred, which has nothing to do with multiculturism anyway, I don't see anyone NOT condemning terrorist attacks or Asian gangs of rapists, or teachers who at best want to be 'bessie mates' with their pupils...or at worst have an agenda to twist young minds..... and if they do they are probably weak minded Corbyn supporters anyway. Rolling Eyes

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Re: Shooting and stabbing at Westminster.

Post by Tommy Monk on Fri Apr 07, 2017 7:48 pm

nicko wrote:When my eldest Son came out of the Army he got a job as a teacher.
After a few days he said he could not believe how the pupils behaved.
They messed about in class ,did not listen to the teachers, and in short , behaved how they wanted.   On the second day he was there he got the kids to stand when he came in, a few days later they called him "Sir".  Every class has it's bully and his class had one,My son asked him if he would like some boxing lessons in the Gym after School,he asked him in front of the class,and not surprisingly he declined.  My Son got talking to him after School, he said his Dad hit him and his mom.  In a while other pupils came up to ask his advice on various things.   Other teachers asked him how he had turned the class around,   his answer was he treated them sternly but fairly.


Brilliant post nicko!!!

Very insightful...!

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Re: Shooting and stabbing at Westminster.

Post by Lord Foul on Fri Apr 07, 2017 7:55 pm

Syl wrote:
Lord Foul wrote:Well it galls me to have to say this

but all you "poor victims" and "so sad" cryers

TOUGH......

you want multiculturalism, and "tolerance" etc, you promote lack of discipline amongst youngsters (and self discipline most of all) and you enjoin "care and sympathy/ humane treatment of those monsters we DO manage to imprison.........well you got it ...enjoy it.

your society is on its way DOWN


AND this is also related to the "educational achievment thread" its true britsish education is being dumbed down, AND veya is wrong that its NOT the teachers,or at least tose teachers who become "educational theorists

se we in the west have allowed these idiots to get away with "mixed ability teaching" and "free association"
class rooms

the eastern nations ...they are STILL using the sit down shut up face front ...now repeat after me ..."one two is two" "two two are four" approach

coincidence...I think not.

their kids dont go around on first name terms with teachers...their schools are run like a military establishment...

coincidence...i think not.....

etc....


as said...you wanted.....you got....

That's a load of bolox if you don't mind me saying so.

Because people welcome others into society, expect fair play, speak out when they see discrimination against anyone, including their own, say forthrightly that though immigration is good is has to be controlled (which usually provokes cries of racism from keyboard idiots) doesn't mean they want to see standards slip, in schools or anywhere else come to that.

I don't see anyone applauding hatred, which has nothing to do with multiculturism anyway, I don't see anyone NOT condemning terrorist attacks or Asian gangs of rapists, or teachers who at best want to be 'bessie mates' with their pupils...or at worst have an agenda to twist young minds..... and if they do they are probably weak minded Corbyn supporters anyway. Rolling Eyes

and ALL the above apologetica is negated by ONE single truth ......you dont want to do and wont accept anything EFFECTIVE being done about it..

and multiculturalism HAS got (almost ) everything to do with hatered in this country....

It provided the basis behind which the perpetrators can hide and the endless supply of victim cards for its supporters to use to hide their agenda
you ONLY have to look at how nick griffiths...vile man though he is, was treated when he ORIGINALLY warned of the goings on in rotherham....he was basically told keep quiet or you will be arrested?????????????

the whole POINT is that even authority is scared witless of the "multiculturalist"

and all the peasants can do is shake their heads and mutter "such a shame"

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Re: Shooting and stabbing at Westminster.

Post by Thorin on Fri Apr 07, 2017 8:01 pm

So you are blaming hate not on the haters, but on those who support Multiculturalism or who are multiculturalists?

Sorry how does that work?

So by your reasoning, Hitler and the Nazi's were not at fault for hating Jews. It was people who were Jews and supported the right of German Jews?

Please explain how you perceive that Far Right or Far left haters have an excuse for their hate? As you are perceiving.

What you are basically saying is that you must agree with the likes of Nick Griffin, to even insinuate his hate is formed by Multiculturalism and not racism itself?
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Re: Shooting and stabbing at Westminster.

Post by Lord Foul on Fri Apr 07, 2017 8:17 pm

Thorin wrote:So you are blaming hate not on the haters, but on those who support Multiculturalism or who are multiculturalists?

Sorry how does that work?

So by your reasoning, Hitler and the Nazi's were not at fault for hating Jews. It was people who were Jews and supported the right of German Jews?

Please explain how you perceive that Far Right or Far left haters have an excuse for their hate? As you are perceiving.

What you are basically saying is that you must agree with the likes of Nick Griffin, to even insinuate his hate is formed by Multiculturalism and not racism itself?

you once again fail to comprehend the point.....

ESPECIALLY about nick griffen.... I made NO comment about agreeing with him in general...like I said an odious little man

HE as such is irrelevant except as an example of multiculturalism gone mad....racist he might be...BUT the time he was DEAD right, about the rotherham grooming gangs, what did the "multiculturalists" do.....they attempted to silence him...even though the evidence was there plain to see. THATS THE POINT.
just ONE example of "multiculturalism", fostering and facilitating the haters.

you again fail to comprehend the point further with your (as usual, incorrect) ASSUMPTION that for some reason I hold hitler exonerated....you know this is becomming a tiresome habit of yours....the typical "shut down the convo...call your opponent a nazi/sympathiser tactic...and it dont work......

the "hate...is the fault of the hater...that is so bloody obvious I didnt think it needed spelling out, HOWEVER, there are those who, for whatever twisted reason, wish to minimise and indeed facilitate these haters......and these facilitators come in all shades, depending on which particular "hater" they love.

lets face it the multiculturalist love any non white non british hater of the native/resident brit, and loves to tell us how "its all our fault and how we deserve it" and begs pleads and influences policy for a lenient hand on those who are a danger to all.

why did those gangs get away for so long with that abuse?...because the multiculturalist in some in authority "didnt want disharmony"

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Re: Shooting and stabbing at Westminster.

Post by Thorin on Fri Apr 07, 2017 8:33 pm

Lets reiterate what you said.

Lord Foul wrote:and multiculturalism HAS got (almost ) everything to do with hatered in this country....


That is claiming hate is formed not by xenophobia or racism, but Multiculturalism.

It was not multiculturalism that made the Police, the Social Services and the council hide the horrific crime of grooming gangs. It was people with illiberal and regressive beliefs. Placing a view of racism to anyone suggesting it could be a problem within the Pakistani community. So how is the wrongs done by some now Multiculturalism fault?

What you are fundamentally saying that. Anyone who identifies with being English and Englishness is a failure, due to crimes committed by English people. Whether that be slavery to anything. Are you claiming Englishness as a culture is a failure based on your reasoning?

So the point on Hitler is very valid when people invoke an excuse for hate to blame Multiculturalism being the cause of hate and not people who are illiberal and regressives for their acts. As if they and only they are the champions of Multiculturalism.

This is why your reasoning is flawed.

You forget that it was Ann Cryer that first spoke out about Grooming gangs and was not listened to. She took on this fight, to help the victims of this, to champion their cause. Nick Griffin used this as a means to promote his hate of Immigrants and Asians in particular.

So why did those gangs get away so long? Because of people irresponsible being in said positions, who took it upon themselves to disbelieve the victims. Something of which is not just found within grooming gangs, but countless victims of child sex abuse. So was the failure to act on English celebrities who were child sex offenders down to the failures of Englishness to you? Or was it down to people again committing in my eyes, a criminal offence by defending and covering for child sex abusers. In each situation, it was a crime that the victims were not listened to, but I don't see a charge from you, that the fault in the case of the celebrities or countless care homes. Was based on Englishness? Why is that?

So how is the conversation been shut down?

Are we still engaging in debate, or as seen are you looking for piss poor excuses for your poor views?

I mean if the failings and criminality of those who cover up crimes is going to be the bases for claiming something is a failure, like Multiculturalism and that its at fault for this hate. Where is the equilibrium view and claims on other crimes covered up?

So again, you are excusing hate not on the haters themselves and blaming not the people who covered up this, but to claim they are Multiculturalism from their criminality and thus its reasonable to hate Multiculturalism and its the cause of the majority of hate, based off your associations off some criminal people.

So maybe you can explain how you think a concept, that is simple the coming together of many cultures, is to blame and cause of most hate, for people abusing children and then other criminals covering this up?
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Re: Shooting and stabbing at Westminster.

Post by Tommy Monk on Fri Apr 07, 2017 8:44 pm

Syl wrote:
Lord Foul wrote:Well it galls me to have to say this

but all you "poor victims" and "so sad" cryers

TOUGH......

you want multiculturalism, and "tolerance" etc, you promote lack of discipline amongst youngsters (and self discipline most of all) and you enjoin "care and sympathy/ humane treatment of those monsters we DO manage to imprison.........well you got it ...enjoy it.

your society is on its way DOWN


AND this is also related to the "educational achievment thread" its true britsish education is being dumbed down, AND veya is wrong that its NOT the teachers,or at least tose teachers who become "educational theorists

se we in the west have allowed these idiots to get away with "mixed ability teaching" and "free association"
class rooms

the eastern nations ...they are STILL using the sit down shut up face front ...now repeat after me ..."one two is two" "two two are four" approach

coincidence...I think not.

their kids dont go around on first name terms with teachers...their schools are run like a military establishment...

coincidence...i think not.....

etc....


as said...you wanted.....you got....

That's a load of bolox if you don't mind me saying so.

Because people welcome others into society, expect fair play, speak out when they see discrimination against anyone, including their own, say forthrightly that though immigration is good is has to be controlled (which usually provokes cries of racism from keyboard idiots) doesn't mean they want to see standards slip, in schools or anywhere else come to that.

I don't see anyone applauding hatred, which has nothing to do with multiculturism anyway, I don't see anyone NOT condemning terrorist attacks or Asian gangs of rapists, or teachers who at best want to be 'bessie mates' with their pupils...or at worst have an agenda to twist young minds
..... and if they do they are probably weak minded Corbyn supporters anyway. Rolling Eyes


You are both right... up until the bit I highlighted in Syl's post...

Of course nobody is applauding hatred... but people have genuine and legitimate reasons to be against mass immigration, and to dislike the way that the law is not applied equally to those of other immigrant backgrounds/cultures here as it would be to white british people (FGM is one clear example where girls of certain ethnic/cultural/religious backgrounds are well known to be getting brutally mutilated by forcibly getting half their fannys chopped off by back Street butcher women, and under the direct say so of their parents... but not one prosecution!!! Even though we know full well about it, and in many cases the nhs has had the job of trying to repair the damaged parts!!! And we know full well that if it was some white british parents inflicting this onto their daughters, the action taken against them by authorities would be instant and they would have the book thrown at them!!!)


And it isn't true that everyone was condemning the Pakistani Muslim gangs of child rapists... many in positions of power in local councils and police forces were actively denying the goings on and actively working against others who were speaking out about it...!!!


Also... although the vast majority of people being normal and right minded... want schools to have an environment of authority and discipline about them and the way the teachers conduct themselves and the lessons etc... we don't want the leftie style claptrap where teachers are trying to be the kids best mates and/or trying to be cool etc... normal people do condemn that behaviour... but unfortunately the schools are full of these leftie twat teachers and they operate in exactly that way in our schools as they are surrounded in their bubbles full of other leftie twat teachers doing exactly the same!!!

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Re: Shooting and stabbing at Westminster.

Post by Tommy Monk on Fri Apr 07, 2017 9:21 pm

Lord Foul wrote:
Syl wrote:

That's a load of bolox if you don't mind me saying so.

Because people welcome others into society, expect fair play, speak out when they see discrimination against anyone, including their own, say forthrightly that though immigration is good is has to be controlled (which usually provokes cries of racism from keyboard idiots) doesn't mean they want to see standards slip, in schools or anywhere else come to that.

I don't see anyone applauding hatred, which has nothing to do with multiculturism anyway, I don't see anyone NOT condemning terrorist attacks or Asian gangs of rapists, or teachers who at best want to be 'bessie mates' with their pupils...or at worst have an agenda to twist young minds..... and if they do they are probably weak minded Corbyn supporters anyway. Rolling Eyes

and ALL the above apologetica is negated by ONE single truth ......you dont want to do and wont accept anything EFFECTIVE being done about it..

and multiculturalism HAS got (almost ) everything to do with hatered in this country....

It provided the basis behind which the perpetrators can hide and the endless supply of victim cards for its supporters to use to hide their agenda
you ONLY have to look at how nick griffiths...vile man though he is, was treated when he ORIGINALLY warned of the goings on in rotherham....he was basically told keep quiet or you will be arrested
?????????????

the whole POINT is that even authority is scared witless of the "multiculturalist"

and all the peasants can do is shake their heads and mutter "such a shame"


I thought he was arrested and prosecuted (twice, for racism?) for speaking out about it...?


And I think he was first speaking out about things back in around 2003... but it took another 10 years of denials and cover ups by lib/lab/con local councils/MPs and govts, and by a multitude of senior officers in a widespread number of local police forces, and from huge numbers of other senior people working in other various parts of the range of different local authorities... before the reluctant acknowledgements of the existence of such gangs, and the even more reluctant admissions that they had been known about for over a decade... and also the shockingly lame attempt to excuse their failures to act and their deliberate attempts to cover it all up, as being down to 'political correctness/cultural sensitivity' and not wanting to show Muslims in a bad light or revealing things that might portray a negative image!!!


Can you fucking believe how twisted these people really are!!!???


These are the types of leftie twats who we have in vast numbers throughout every level of local councils and other local authorities and public services here in uk!!!



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Re: Shooting and stabbing at Westminster.

Post by Thorin on Fri Apr 07, 2017 9:30 pm

Thorin wrote:Lets reiterate what you said.

Lord Foul wrote:and multiculturalism HAS got (almost ) everything to do with hatered in this country....


That is claiming hate is formed not by xenophobia or racism, but Multiculturalism.

It was not multiculturalism that made the Police, the Social Services and the council hide the horrific crime of grooming gangs. It was people with illiberal and regressive beliefs. Placing a view of racism to anyone suggesting it could be a problem within the Pakistani community. So how is the wrongs done by some now Multiculturalism fault?

What you are fundamentally saying that. Anyone who identifies with being English and Englishness is a failure, due to crimes committed by English people. Whether that be slavery to anything. Are you claiming Englishness as a culture is a failure based on your reasoning?

So the point on Hitler is very valid when people invoke an excuse for hate to blame Multiculturalism being the cause of hate and not people who are illiberal and regressives for their acts. As if they and only they are the champions of Multiculturalism.

This is why your reasoning is flawed.

You forget that it was Ann Cryer that first spoke out about Grooming gangs and was not listened to. She took on this fight, to help the victims of this, to champion their cause. Nick Griffin used this as a means to promote his hate of Immigrants and Asians in particular.

So why did those gangs get away so long? Because of people irresponsible being in said positions, who took it upon themselves to disbelieve the victims. Something of which is not just found within grooming gangs, but countless victims of child sex abuse. So was the failure to act on English celebrities who were child sex offenders down to the failures of Englishness to you? Or was it down to people again committing in my eyes, a criminal offence by defending and covering for child sex abusers. In each situation, it was a crime that the victims were not listened to, but I don't see a charge from you, that the fault in the case of the celebrities or countless care homes. Was based on Englishness? Why is that?

So how is the conversation been shut down?

Are we still engaging in debate, or as seen are you looking for piss poor excuses for your poor views?

I mean if the failings and criminality of those who cover up crimes is going to be the bases for claiming something is a failure, like Multiculturalism and that its at fault for this hate. Where is the equilibrium view and claims on other crimes covered up?

So again, you are excusing hate not on the haters themselves and blaming not the people who covered up this, but to claim they are Multiculturalism from their criminality and thus its reasonable to hate Multiculturalism and its the cause of the majority of hate, based off your associations off some criminal people.

So maybe you can explain how you think a concept, that is simple the coming together of many cultures, is to blame and cause of most hate, for people abusing children and then other criminals covering this up?


Seems I have you stumped Lord Foul, my buddy?

And we both know why

My reasoning is sound..

You have every right to be critical of many things, but lets face it. You did badly inadvertently, provide an excuse for racist and xenophobic hate here. Based on your claim, Multiculturalism has got almost everything to do with hatred. When you should have been rightly showing that hate is formed from those who are in perceptual and irrational fear. That they require some form of security, surrounded by other bigots also in fear, to normalize and justify their hate of others.

So when I said you must agree with Nick, you did so inadvertently with him, by providing excuses for his hate.
Nick Griffin never cared one shit for the victims of grooming gangs. He only exploited the cover up as a means to promote his ideological hate. On the other hand everyone forgets Ann Cryer, who did care for the victims
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Re: Shooting and stabbing at Westminster.

Post by magica on Fri Apr 07, 2017 10:49 pm

nicko wrote:When he left after two years the pupils from 3 classes held up banners saying "please don't leave Sir".

He Tought 15 to 17 year olds.
He was a staff Sargent, Drill instructor and Unarmed Combat Instructor,  fought in the Falklands and both Gulf wars.
Has two "Mentioned in Dispatches"

Proud of him !


You have every reason to be proud of your son Nicko. A hero too, bless him cheers

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Re: Shooting and stabbing at Westminster.

Post by Tommy Monk on Fri Apr 07, 2017 11:31 pm

Thorin wrote:
Thorin wrote:Lets reiterate what you said.




That is claiming hate is formed not by xenophobia or racism, but Multiculturalism.

It was not multiculturalism that made the Police, the Social Services and the council hide the horrific crime of grooming gangs. It was people with illiberal and regressive beliefs. Placing a view of racism to anyone suggesting it could be a problem within the Pakistani community. So how is the wrongs done by some now Multiculturalism fault?

What you are fundamentally saying that. Anyone who identifies with being English and Englishness is a failure, due to crimes committed by English people. Whether that be slavery to anything. Are you claiming Englishness as a culture is a failure based on your reasoning?

So the point on Hitler is very valid when people invoke an excuse for hate to blame Multiculturalism being the cause of hate and not people who are illiberal and regressives for their acts. As if they and only they are the champions of Multiculturalism.

This is why your reasoning is flawed.

You forget that it was Ann Cryer that first spoke out about Grooming gangs and was not listened to. She took on this fight, to help the victims of this, to champion their cause. Nick Griffin used this as a means to promote his hate of Immigrants and Asians in particular.

So why did those gangs get away so long? Because of people irresponsible being in said positions, who took it upon themselves to disbelieve the victims. Something of which is not just found within grooming gangs, but countless victims of child sex abuse. So was the failure to act on English celebrities who were child sex offenders down to the failures of Englishness to you? Or was it down to people again committing in my eyes, a criminal offence by defending and covering for child sex abusers. In each situation, it was a crime that the victims were not listened to, but I don't see a charge from you, that the fault in the case of the celebrities or countless care homes. Was based on Englishness? Why is that?

So how is the conversation been shut down?

Are we still engaging in debate, or as seen are you looking for piss poor excuses for your poor views?

I mean if the failings and criminality of those who cover up crimes is going to be the bases for claiming something is a failure, like Multiculturalism and that its at fault for this hate. Where is the equilibrium view and claims on other crimes covered up?

So again, you are excusing hate not on the haters themselves and blaming not the people who covered up this, but to claim they are Multiculturalism from their criminality and thus its reasonable to hate Multiculturalism and its the cause of the majority of hate, based off your associations off some criminal people.

So maybe you can explain how you think a concept, that is simple the coming together of many cultures, is to blame and cause of most hate, for people abusing children and then other criminals covering this up?


Seems I have you stumped Lord Foul, my buddy?

And we both know why

My reasoning is sound..

You have every right to be critical of many things, but lets face it. You did badly inadvertently, provide an excuse for racist and xenophobic hate here. Based on your claim, Multiculturalism has got almost everything to do with hatred. When you should have been rightly showing that hate is formed from those who are in perceptual and irrational fear. That they require some form of security, surrounded by other bigots also in fear, to normalize and justify their hate of others.

So when I said you must agree with Nick, you did so inadvertently with him, by providing excuses for his hate.
Nick Griffin never cared one shit for the victims of grooming gangs. He only exploited the cover up as a means to promote his ideological hate.
On the other hand everyone forgets Ann Cryer, who did care for the victims


Don't talk wet...

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Re: Shooting and stabbing at Westminster.

Post by Thorin on Fri Apr 07, 2017 11:37 pm

Tommy Monk wrote:
Thorin wrote:


Seems I have you stumped Lord Foul, my buddy?

And we both know why

My reasoning is sound..

You have every right to be critical of many things, but lets face it. You did badly inadvertently, provide an excuse for racist and xenophobic hate here. Based on your claim, Multiculturalism has got almost everything to do with hatred. When you should have been rightly showing that hate is formed from those who are in perceptual and irrational fear. That they require some form of security, surrounded by other bigots also in fear, to normalize and justify their hate of others.

So when I said you must agree with Nick, you did so inadvertently with him, by providing excuses for his hate.
Nick Griffin never cared one shit for the victims of grooming gangs. He only exploited the cover up as a means to promote his ideological hate.
On the other hand everyone forgets Ann Cryer, who did care for the victims


Don't talk wet...


What is "talking wet" to Tommy?

If he actually understood the meaning of talking wet?
Maybe he could point out how, he thinks,? I insulted Lord Rags here? Or in reality, Nick Griffin?

Maybe Tommy can show the money Nick Griffin or the BNP donating towards victims families and trials?

No?

Can you do that Tommy?

Can you show why he never protested any child sex abuse case, that had English abusers?

Why is that Tommy?

I mean did you promote the dangers of English people like Jimmy Savile, Tommy?

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Re: Shooting and stabbing at Westminster.

Post by Tommy Monk on Sat Apr 08, 2017 12:07 am

It was the insidious leftie culture in both the BBC and the local authorities that allowed the crimes to continue... and that vilified griffin for speaking out as he did...


Even when griffin was facing trial... for speaking out... the judge told him that although he may be telling the truth about the existence of the Pakistani Muslim gangs of child rapists, that it was no defence for it being racist to say so!!!



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Re: Shooting and stabbing at Westminster.

Post by Thorin on Sat Apr 08, 2017 12:15 am

Tommy Monk wrote:It was the insidious leftie culture in both the BBC and the local authorities that allowed the crimes to continue... and that vilified griffin for speaking out as he did...


Even when griffin was facing trial... for speaking out... the judge told him that although he may be telling the truth about the existence of the Pakistani Muslim gangs of child rapists, that it was no defence for it being racist to say so!!!




Okay, Rolf Harris was an Aussie immigrant, was he not?
Where was the BNP or your idol Nick Griffin at his many trials?

Did he speak out on how this abuser got off for decades?

No?

What does this say about Tommy?

He actually defends Nick and then fails to answer why Nick, never gave a flying fuck about the victims of child sex abuse when covered up, if he classed them white

The only defense I am seeing in from Tommy, is its racist to challenge.
Where is his anger at the injustice of countless child sexual abusive victims never having justice?

The only thing insidious, is scum looking to exploit children who have suffered sexual abuse. To further their racist hate.

Go Figure
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Re: Shooting and stabbing at Westminster.

Post by Syl on Sat Apr 08, 2017 12:25 am

Lord Foul wrote:
Syl wrote:

That's a load of bolox if you don't mind me saying so.

Because people welcome others into society, expect fair play, speak out when they see discrimination against anyone, including their own, say forthrightly that though immigration is good is has to be controlled (which usually provokes cries of racism from keyboard idiots) doesn't mean they want to see standards slip, in schools or anywhere else come to that.

I don't see anyone applauding hatred, which has nothing to do with multiculturism anyway, I don't see anyone NOT condemning terrorist attacks or Asian gangs of rapists, or teachers who at best want to be 'bessie mates' with their pupils...or at worst have an agenda to twist young minds..... and if they do they are probably weak minded Corbyn supporters anyway. Rolling Eyes

and ALL the above apologetica is negated by ONE single truth ......you dont want to do and wont accept anything EFFECTIVE being done about it..

and multiculturalism HAS got (almost ) everything to do with hatered in this country....

It provided the basis behind which the perpetrators can hide and the endless supply of victim cards for its supporters to use to hide their agenda
you ONLY have to look at how nick griffiths...vile man though he is, was treated when he ORIGINALLY warned of the goings on in rotherham....he was basically told keep quiet or you will be arrested?????????????

the whole POINT is that even authority is scared witless of the "multiculturalist"

and all the peasants can do is shake their heads and mutter "such a shame"

This country has embraced multiculturalism, whether you personally like it or not, that's how it is and that's how it will stay.
Hatred comes from both sides, happily by a minority of people.
I think re the gangs of Pakistani Muslims, haters of the highest order, mistakes were definately made, not only in Rotherham, but in towns throughout the North West and beyond. You can't blame anyone for that other than the gangs themselves and their enablers, which did include the police and the authorities, arrests, charges, imprisonment and ongoing investigations prove that now at least it's being taken seriously, better late than never.

Did Nick Griffiths have anything to say about the child abuse that went on for decades at organisations like the BBC, multiculturalism had nothing to do with that.....yet the police and authorities kept quiet about that for decades too.

I believe that the majority of people don't support uncontrolled immigration and do want to know who is coming into the country....probably one of the reasons the majority voted Brexit, peasants ((as you say) don't wish to sit back and let the country disintegrate, they care, and they have the right to cry for the victims without being told they have got the sort of society they deserve.

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Re: Shooting and stabbing at Westminster.

Post by Syl on Sat Apr 08, 2017 12:42 am

Tommy Monk wrote:
Syl wrote:

That's a load of bolox if you don't mind me saying so.

Because people welcome others into society, expect fair play, speak out when they see discrimination against anyone, including their own, say forthrightly that though immigration is good is has to be controlled (which usually provokes cries of racism from keyboard idiots) doesn't mean they want to see standards slip, in schools or anywhere else come to that.

I don't see anyone applauding hatred, which has nothing to do with multiculturism anyway, I don't see anyone NOT condemning terrorist attacks or Asian gangs of rapists, or teachers who at best want to be 'bessie mates' with their pupils...or at worst have an agenda to twist young minds
..... and if they do they are probably weak minded Corbyn supporters anyway. Rolling Eyes


You are both right... up until the bit I highlighted in Syl's post...

Of course nobody is applauding hatred... but people have genuine and legitimate reasons to be against mass immigration, and to dislike the way that the law is not applied equally to those of other immigrant backgrounds/cultures here as it would be to white british people (FGM is one clear example where girls of certain ethnic/cultural/religious backgrounds are well known to be getting brutally mutilated by forcibly getting half their fannys chopped off by back Street butcher women, and under the direct say so of their parents... but not one prosecution!!! Even though we know full well about it, and in many cases the nhs has had the job of trying to repair the damaged parts!!! And we know full well that if it was some white british parents inflicting this onto their daughters, the action taken against them by authorities would be instant and they would have the book thrown at them!!!)


And it isn't true that everyone was condemning the Pakistani Muslim gangs of child rapists... many in positions of power in local councils and police forces were actively denying the goings on and actively working against others who were speaking out about it...!!!


Also... although the vast majority of people being normal and right minded... want schools to have an environment of authority and discipline about them and the way the teachers conduct themselves and the lessons etc... we don't want the leftie style claptrap where teachers are trying to be the kids best mates and/or trying to be cool etc... normal people do condemn that behaviour... !

I think this is a brilliant post......I deleted the last bit because I don't agree with it, but up till then, have a alien  
People in local communities that were not involved were powerless when the gangs were operating round towns throughout the country, they had no idea  of the scale of abuse because it was hidden and denied, when it became known obviously the public condemned it, and fought against it, till eventually it had to be taken seriously by the authorities.
It's a national shame that for decades young kids were ignored by the police....but like has been mentioned it wasn't the first  time paedophiles had been allowed to flourish under the noses and wth full  knowledge of police, politicians and authorities.

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Re: Shooting and stabbing at Westminster.

Post by Tommy Monk on Sat Apr 08, 2017 1:34 am

Tommy Monk wrote:
Lord Foul wrote:

and ALL the above apologetica is negated by ONE single truth ......you dont want to do and wont accept anything EFFECTIVE being done about it..

and multiculturalism HAS got (almost ) everything to do with hatered in this country....

It provided the basis behind which the perpetrators can hide and the endless supply of victim cards for its supporters to use to hide their agenda
you ONLY have to look at how nick griffiths...vile man though he is, was treated when he ORIGINALLY warned of the goings on in rotherham....he was basically told keep quiet or you will be arrested
?????????????

the whole POINT is that even authority is scared witless of the "multiculturalist"

and all the peasants can do is shake their heads and mutter "such a shame"


I thought he was arrested and prosecuted (twice, for racism?) for speaking out about it...?


And I think he was first speaking out about things back in around 2003... but it took another 10 years of denials and cover ups by lib/lab/con local councils/MPs and govts, and by a multitude of senior officers in a widespread number of local police forces, and from huge numbers of other senior people working in other various parts of the range of different local authorities... before the reluctant acknowledgements of the existence of such gangs, and the even more reluctant admissions that they had been known about for over a decade... and also the shockingly lame attempt to excuse their failures to act and their deliberate attempts to cover it all up, as being down to 'political correctness/cultural sensitivity' and not wanting to show Muslims in a bad light or revealing things that might portray a negative image!!!


Can you fucking believe how twisted these people really are!!!???


These are the types of leftie twats who we have in vast numbers throughout every level of local councils and other local authorities and public services here in uk!!!




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Re: Shooting and stabbing at Westminster.

Post by Syl on Sat Apr 08, 2017 1:52 am

Thorin wrote:
Tommy Monk wrote:


Don't talk wet...


What is "talking wet" to Tommy?

If he actually understood the meaning of talking wet?
Maybe he could point out how, he thinks,? I insulted Lord Rags here? Or in reality, Nick Griffin?

Maybe Tommy can show the money Nick Griffin or the BNP donating towards victims families and trials?

No?

Can you do that Tommy?

Can you show why he never protested any child sex abuse case, that had English abusers?

Why is that Tommy?

I mean did you promote the dangers of English people like Jimmy Savile, Tommy?


I missed this post....I agree 100% with the bib....I said the same thing, I wasn't copying, great minds think alike.

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Re: Shooting and stabbing at Westminster.

Post by Tommy Monk on Sat Apr 08, 2017 2:13 am



It was the lefties in the BBC and the lefties in local authorities who covered up for the scumbags...


When was it that griffin knew about saville but chose to say nothing...!?



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Re: Shooting and stabbing at Westminster.

Post by Syl on Sat Apr 08, 2017 2:28 am

Tommy Monk wrote:

It was the lefties in the BBC and the lefties in local authorities who covered up for the scumbags...


When was it that griffin knew about saville but chose to say nothing...!?



Many of the people who were so outraged about the Pakistani Muslim gangs who preyed on young white girls, we're also around when the BBC, the NHS, many so called care facilities were covering up paedophilia and abuse against young and vulnerable people by Saville and plenty others for decades.

Who knows what Grifin knew about that or how long he knew it....the point is he didnt comment on that did he?

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Re: Shooting and stabbing at Westminster.

Post by Tommy Monk on Sat Apr 08, 2017 2:39 am



So griffin is a racist for daring to speak out about the Pakistani Muslim gangs of child rapists that he had found out about... as well as being a racist for not speaking out about savilles crimes, that he didn't know about...!?


I think the real point is that it was lefties in the BBC as well as the lefties In local govt/authorities who covered it all up for so long that you should really have issue with...!?

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Re: Shooting and stabbing at Westminster.

Post by Thorin on Sat Apr 08, 2017 5:54 am

Tommy Monk wrote:

So griffin is a racist for daring to speak out about the Pakistani Muslim gangs of child rapists that he had found out about... as well as being a racist for not speaking out about savilles crimes, that he didn't know about...!?


I think the real point is that it was lefties in the BBC as well as the lefties In local govt/authorities who covered it all up for so long that you should really have issue with...!?


No Griffin is racist, because he is against mixed racial unions and is racist scum.
Griffin is racist because he exploited the situation of grooming gangs to use as a political campaign to attempt to get his racist party elected.

It failed, because the BNP did not give a fuck about the victims of child sex abuse. They instead disgustingly used the victims to promote their racist hate.

Their stupidity, even nearly cost one of the cases being thrown out

Where was Nick Griffin or the BNP at the trial of Rolf Harris?

Was he too white for them to protest?

I think the real point is again you defend racist low life scum.

That is the real issue here.
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Re: Shooting and stabbing at Westminster.

Post by Raggamuffin on Sat Apr 08, 2017 6:49 am

Thorin wrote:
Tommy Monk wrote:


Don't talk wet...


What is "talking wet" to Tommy?

If he actually understood the meaning of talking wet?
Maybe he could point out how, he thinks,? I insulted Lord Rags here? Or in reality, Nick Griffin?

Maybe Tommy can show the money Nick Griffin or the BNP donating towards victims families and trials?

No?

Can you do that Tommy?

Can you show why he never protested any child sex abuse case, that had English abusers?

Why is that Tommy?

I mean did you promote the dangers of English people like Jimmy Savile, Tommy?


Lady Rags if you don't mind. I think you mean Lord Foul. Laughing

The point is that it's a case of "give a dog a bad name". Nick Griffin was right but nobody took it seriously because it was him who said it.

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Re: Shooting and stabbing at Westminster.

Post by Thorin on Sat Apr 08, 2017 6:52 am

Raggamuffin wrote:
Thorin wrote:


What is "talking wet" to Tommy?

If he actually understood the meaning of talking wet?
Maybe he could point out how, he thinks,? I insulted Lord Rags here? Or in reality, Nick Griffin?

Maybe Tommy can show the money Nick Griffin or the BNP donating towards victims families and trials?

No?

Can you do that Tommy?

Can you show why he never protested any child sex abuse case, that had English abusers?

Why is that Tommy?

I mean did you promote the dangers of English people like Jimmy Savile, Tommy?


Lady Rags if you don't mind. I think you mean Lord Foul. Laughing

The point is that it's a case of "give a dog a bad name". Nick Griffin was right but nobody took it seriously because it was him who said it.


My Mistake, I did mean Lord foul and not Tubbymuffins

Nobody took Ann Cryer seriously and she has mountains more credibility than a low life racist like Nick Griffin.

So your point is both meaningless and pointless.

The fact is the man tried to exploit the victims and did so for a racist agenda.

Like I said, where was here and his racist chums at the trials of countless English child sex abusers, who had their crimes covered up for years?
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Re: Shooting and stabbing at Westminster.

Post by Raggamuffin on Sat Apr 08, 2017 6:54 am

Thorin wrote:
Raggamuffin wrote:

Lady Rags if you don't mind. I think you mean Lord Foul. Laughing

The point is that it's a case of "give a dog a bad name". Nick Griffin was right but nobody took it seriously because it was him who said it.


My Mistake, I did mean Lord foul and not Tubbymuffins

Nobody took Ann Cryer seriously and she has mountains more credibility than a low life racist like Nick Griffin.

So your point is both meaningless and pointless.

The fact is the man tried to exploit the victims and did so for a racist agenda.

Like I said, where was here and his racist chums at the trials of countless English child sex abusers, who had their crimes covered up for years?

You must admit though, DaftDigey, that Nick Griffins was always shouted down because of who he was.

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Re: Shooting and stabbing at Westminster.

Post by Thorin on Sat Apr 08, 2017 6:56 am

Raggamuffin wrote:
Thorin wrote:


My Mistake, I did mean Lord foul and not Tubbymuffins

Nobody took Ann Cryer seriously and she has mountains more credibility than a low life racist like Nick Griffin.

So your point is both meaningless and pointless.

The fact is the man tried to exploit the victims and did so for a racist agenda.

Like I said, where was here and his racist chums at the trials of countless English child sex abusers, who had their crimes covered up for years?

You must admit though, DaftDigey, that Nick Griffins was always shouted down because of who he was.


Well tubbymuffins, why was Ann Cryer shouted down?

She is not racist, yet nobody wanted to listen to her.

Like I said your point is meaningless and she had brought this up well before Nick, jumped on this bandwagon to exploit the victims

At least she actually fought for the victims of child sex abuse.

Nick Griffin as see never gave one fuck about the victims of child sex abuse. If he did, he and his party would have been at countless court cases protesting. Yet they never did.
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Re: Shooting and stabbing at Westminster.

Post by Raggamuffin on Sat Apr 08, 2017 7:00 am

Thorin wrote:
Raggamuffin wrote:

You must admit though, DaftDigey, that Nick Griffins was always shouted down because of who he was.


Well tubbymuffins, why was Ann Cryer shouted down?

She is not racist, yet nobody wanted to listen to her.

Like I said your point is meaningless and she had brought this up well before Nick, jumped on this bandwagon to exploit the victims

At least she actually fought for the victims of child sex abuse.

Nick Griffin as see never gave one fuck about the victims of child sex abuse. If he did, he and his party would have been at countless court cases protesting. Yet they never did.

He was expelled from the party in 2014 DaftDidgey.

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Re: Shooting and stabbing at Westminster.

Post by Thorin on Sat Apr 08, 2017 7:01 am

Raggamuffin wrote:
Thorin wrote:


Well tubbymuffins, why was Ann Cryer shouted down?

She is not racist, yet nobody wanted to listen to her.

Like I said your point is meaningless and she had brought this up well before Nick, jumped on this bandwagon to exploit the victims

At least she actually fought for the victims of child sex abuse.

Nick Griffin as see never gave one fuck about the victims of child sex abuse. If he did, he and his party would have been at countless court cases protesting. Yet they never did.

He was expelled from the party in 2014 DaftDidgey.


What has that got to do with anything tubbymuffins?
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Re: Shooting and stabbing at Westminster.

Post by Raggamuffin on Sat Apr 08, 2017 7:04 am

Thorin wrote:
Raggamuffin wrote:

He was expelled from the party in 2014 DaftDidgey.


What has that got to do with anything tubbymuffins?

He couldn't have been at any trials with his party after then. Being at a trial before then would not have necessarily indicated concern for the victims. The presence of the BNP would be seen as disruptive, and perhaps he knew that.

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Re: Shooting and stabbing at Westminster.

Post by Raggamuffin on Sat Apr 08, 2017 7:05 am

You could say the same thing about any political party. Do they really give a stuff about anything, or do they just want votes?

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Re: Shooting and stabbing at Westminster.

Post by Thorin on Sat Apr 08, 2017 7:07 am

Raggamuffin wrote:
Thorin wrote:


What has that got to do with anything tubbymuffins?

He couldn't have been at any trials with his party after then. Being at a trial before then would not have necessarily indicated concern for the victims. The presence of the BNP would be seen as disruptive, and perhaps he knew that.


PMSL, so now your excuse for Nick not attending the trials of English child sex offenders, is that he was not leader after 2014. Even though there has been thousands of trials of child sex abusers, whilst he was leader.

So you then come up with even more apologist BNP drivel by claiming, the BNP would have been seen as disruptive, even though they still turned up when it was Asians with grooming gangs.

So we have a defense of Hitler and Nazism, with now your defense of Nick Griffin and the BNP.

Anyone else see a pattern here?

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Re: Shooting and stabbing at Westminster.

Post by Raggamuffin on Sat Apr 08, 2017 7:09 am

Anyway, the point is that nobody took him seriously because of who he was.

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Re: Shooting and stabbing at Westminster.

Post by Thorin on Sat Apr 08, 2017 7:10 am

Raggamuffin wrote:Anyway, the point is that nobody took him seriously because of who he was.


So why did nobody take Ann Cryer seriously, the point you have avoided throughout?
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Re: Shooting and stabbing at Westminster.

Post by Tommy Monk on Sat Apr 08, 2017 11:41 am

Thorin wrote:
Tommy Monk wrote:

So griffin is a racist for daring to speak out about the Pakistani Muslim gangs of child rapists that he had found out about... as well as being a racist for not speaking out about savilles crimes, that he didn't know about...!?


I think the real point is that it was lefties in the BBC as well as the lefties In local govt/authorities who covered it all up for so long that you should really have issue with...!?


No Griffin is racist, because he is against mixed racial unions and is racist scum.
Griffin is racist because he exploited the situation of grooming gangs to use as a political campaign to attempt to get his racist party elected.

It failed, because the BNP did not give a fuck about the victims of child sex abuse. They instead disgustingly used the victims to promote their racist hate.

Their stupidity, even nearly cost one of the cases being thrown out

Where was Nick Griffin or the BNP at the trial of Rolf Harris?

Was he too white for them to protest?

I think the real point is again you defend racist low life scum.

That is the real issue here.


The racist low life scum are the Pakistani Muslim gangs of child rapists...

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