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Post by Andy on Sat Nov 19, 2016 1:48 pm

Are there good and bad religions?
Does it depend on how religious a person is?
Are they all good (in the eyes of their followers) or are some inherently bad, particularly if you are an avid follower of a particular religion.
And this is NOT targeted at any particular poster or religion, and Ben has already approved this type of thread on the Jo Cox thread.
My own instinct , as a non practicing C of E, light and non invasive is ok, deeply held and fanatical  beliefs are bad.

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Post by Guest on Sat Nov 19, 2016 1:56 pm

Much depends on how you define "good" and "bad". Taoism for example, though not really a religion as such, largely avoids the issue by accepting that such concepts are relative. On the other hand, the Abrahamic religions tend to see "good" and "bad" as absolutes since they are derived from supernatural beings. Such religions, and their attendant foolishness, are best avoided imv.

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Post by Syl on Sat Nov 19, 2016 2:10 pm

I don't think religion is bad in itself, it comforts and helps billions of people worldwide.
What makes it dangerous is the way some interpret the words that were written by mere mortals and the insistence that theirs is the only book to follow and anyone who doesn't believe is somehow inferior.

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Post by Guest on Sat Nov 19, 2016 2:12 pm

Syl wrote:I don't think religion is bad in itself, it comforts and helps billions of people worldwide.
What makes it dangerous is the way some interpret the words that were written by mere mortals and the insistence that theirs is the only book to follow and anyone who doesn't believe is somehow inferior.

Yes, another reason to steer clear - or at least be wary.

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Post by nicko on Sat Nov 19, 2016 3:25 pm

Jedi, seems a good alternative!
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Post by eddie on Sat Nov 19, 2016 6:15 pm

Religion isn't bad. The people who misinterpret it and abuse it, are the ones who give it a bad name.
Religion is an idea and an ideal....those are never bad when used for good.

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Post by Victorismyhero on Sat Nov 19, 2016 7:32 pm

I have said repeatedly, as indeed does ziz...

what is good or evil depends firstly on YOUR pov and secondly on your society's mores and values

what is MORE cogent and socially important IMO is order and chaos

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Post by Eilzel on Sat Nov 19, 2016 11:58 pm

In theory they are good. In practice not so much. I don't agree totally with the idea humans make them bad, though that is certainly true of Buddhism as I see in Thailand (and Buddhism is generally the 'nicest' religion).

The problem is often interpretation, but it is also the written word- and I am talking exclusively about the Judeo-Christian trio here.

If a book says outright to kill people for not believing, committing petty crimes, being a disobedient slave, working Sundays, eating pork etc.. then whatever the context of those instructions, that religion IS bad, imo.

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Post by veya_victaous on Sun Nov 20, 2016 12:35 am

I agree with what eilzel said.

I think it is the institutionalization of religion that lends itself inherently to greed/abuse which we generally agree is bad (to satisfy LF and ziz's point)

Plus some religions are just not that good and where written for a specific time and place and are more about imposing a certain societies social order and traditions than 'enlightenment'

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Post by Ben Reilly on Sun Nov 20, 2016 5:34 am

But institutionalizing religion is human nature -- you're never going to fix anything with a solution that goes against human nature. You have to find ways to hack human nature in order to make progress.

For example -- many white people in the U.S. were hacked into accepting the principle of equality through a concerted effort to make them abide by the tenet of Christianity that says all people are equal before God.

For another, a good number of Christians have been hacked into caring about global warming through an effort to present the Earth as a gift created by God.

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Post by Victorismyhero on Sun Nov 20, 2016 1:37 pm

Avenging Bae wrote:But institutionalizing religion is human nature -- you're never going to fix anything with a solution that goes against human nature. You have to find ways to hack human nature in order to make progress.

For example -- many white people in the U.S. were hacked into accepting the principle of equality through a concerted effort to make them abide by the tenet of Christianity that says all people are equal before God.

For another, a good number of Christians have been hacked into caring about global warming through an effort to present the Earth as a gift created by God.

I would argue that Ben

the old ways were not institutionalised except for the priesthood, and even there, there was room for continual re -evaluation

the masses were pretty much free to worship, respect, whatever old gods they wished and the only "general principle was to respect your mates choice of god...

Even the romans (until the poison of christianity entered their system), usually didnt interfere with the "local gods", indeed they tended to absorb them into their pantheon, on the basis of "you can never have too many divine friends"
and the pagan religions today are in general NOT institutionalised (except for the "plastic druids", that you see at every eisteddford)

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Post by scrat on Sun Nov 20, 2016 2:07 pm

The Christian religion has absorbed most pagan celebrations, Samhain was simply commercialised like the rest, even churches were built on pagan sites.

This one is not far from me, beautiful picnic spot off the beaten track.

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Post by Miffs2 on Sun Nov 20, 2016 4:48 pm

What is that and where is it? It doesn't even look like a real picture? :
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Post by Guest on Sun Nov 20, 2016 4:51 pm

I think it's this place...

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Knowlton_Circles

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Post by scrat on Sun Nov 20, 2016 5:02 pm

Ziz wrote:I think it's this place...

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Knowlton_Circles
Bang on the button.

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Post by Jules on Sun Nov 20, 2016 5:02 pm

What is the etymology behind the word religion? Smile

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Post by Guest on Sun Nov 20, 2016 5:04 pm

Jules wrote:What is the etymology behind the word  religion? Smile

Ooh, ooh - I know this, Miss. Laughing

(But I'm bound to a promise not to say).

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Post by eddie on Sun Nov 20, 2016 5:07 pm

Religions Img_5423

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Post by Guest on Sun Nov 20, 2016 5:09 pm

Ha, ha, ha - that's good enough, Eddie.

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Post by eddie on Sun Nov 20, 2016 5:12 pm

Ziz wrote:Ha, ha, ha - that's good enough, Eddie.

I thought so Ziz Laughing

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Post by Jules on Sun Nov 20, 2016 5:25 pm

Ziz wrote:
Jules wrote:What is the etymology behind the word  religion? Smile

Ooh, ooh - I know this, Miss. Laughing

(But I'm bound to a promise not to say).

Really? OK then I'll let ya off. Laughing

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Post by Tommy Monk on Sun Nov 20, 2016 10:42 pm

Eilzel wrote:In theory they are good. In practice not so much. I don't agree totally with the idea humans make them bad, though that is certainly true of Buddhism as I see in Thailand (and Buddhism is generally the 'nicest' religion).

The problem is often interpretation, but it is also the written word- and I am talking exclusively about the Judeo-Christian trio here.

If a book says outright to kill people for not believing, committing petty crimes, being a disobedient slave, working Sundays, eating pork etc.. then whatever the context of those instructions, that religion IS bad, imo.


Yes... Judaism and Christianity... those three are the problem...!!!


lol!



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Post by veya_victaous on Mon Nov 21, 2016 12:09 am

Tommy Monk wrote:
Eilzel wrote:In theory they are good. In practice not so much. I don't agree totally with the idea humans make them bad, though that is certainly true of Buddhism as I see in Thailand (and Buddhism is generally the 'nicest' religion).

The problem is often interpretation, but it is also the written word- and I am talking exclusively about the Judeo-Christian trio here.

If a book says outright to kill people for not believing, committing petty crimes, being a disobedient slave, working Sundays, eating pork etc.. then whatever the context of those instructions, that religion IS bad, imo.


Yes... Judaism and Christianity... those three are the problem...!!!


lol!




are you really so ignorant tommy?

Judeo-Chrisitan means Jewish, Christian and Muslim
All 3 being of the same books, same god, same religon in all but name.

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Post by veya_victaous on Mon Nov 21, 2016 12:18 am

Avenging Bae wrote:But institutionalizing religion is human nature -- you're never going to fix anything with a solution that goes against human nature. You have to find ways to hack human nature in order to make progress.

For example -- many white people in the U.S. were hacked into accepting the principle of equality through a concerted effort to make them abide by the tenet of Christianity that says all people are equal before God.

For another, a good number of Christians have been hacked into caring about global warming through an effort to present the Earth as a gift created by God.

the problem is, it doesn't
it does not say that in the bible
it says you can own blacks and women Rolling Eyes Rolling Eyes Rolling Eyes

the insitution moved past the religion.
and LF would call the new insitution 'leftism'

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