Slaughter in Florida

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Slaughter in Florida

Post by Angry Andy on Sun Jun 12, 2016 12:58 pm

First topic message reminder :

http://news.sky.com/story/1710712/orlando-nightclub-terror-attack-leaves-20-dead


Think carefully.
Gun law will relax even more under Trump.
He hates gays and lesbians. He will be helping load the guns.


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Re: Slaughter in Florida

Post by Ben Reilly on Mon Jun 13, 2016 6:58 pm

I think it's helpful to view things like religion, politics, patriotism, nationalism, etc. as media in which people have put ideas. As they're all human inventions, they're no different from a newspaper, magazine or news broadcast.

If a person gravitates toward bigotry, they'll seize upon the media that contain bigotry as self-justification. Get rid of one outlet and they'll go to the next.

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Re: Slaughter in Florida

Post by Guest on Mon Jun 13, 2016 7:20 pm

Paul Ettinger wrote:
Original Quill wrote:You ignorant trash...ISIL is a political and military entity.  They use their religious affiliation as a recruitment tool.
Mateen's reference to ISIL was in reference to a demand that the US stop bombing ISIL.  Not a very religious theme, eh?  Doesn't fit in any hymn that I know of.
They are a religious extremist, adhere to a literal view of the quran and hadiths, that uses islamic doctrine espcially historcal doctrines of Muhammad
Is their hadiths and in his biography of Muhammad giving sex slaves to his warriors?
Yes
Is there accounts of him executing women?
Yes
Executing homosexuals?
Yes
Executing Jews?
Yes
Having and ensdorsing slavery?
Yes
Is there accouns of his berating women for not pleasing their husbands?
yes
It helps if you were not such an ignorant dumb fuck, you might then not be such a twat
Hmmm, and WYWolfie got called right up and threatened with a trip to the 'Basement' earlier today for saying something far - far lamer and much more milder then our Didgey-dooer has been spewing on this very thread; and the silence is amazing! 

And this vulgar post was just the beginning before he really got all hysterically wound up >
I have grown up, so do not patronize me you pathetic little prick
Again you make every excuse under the sun and continue to bury your head in the sand
You simply are an idiot on this topic and will continue to do so until it effects you.
Again you simply cannot respond to myu points so we see the left motto played
Divert, deflect and cover up
Let me know when you open your eyes, because its plain you do not need to grow up, you are just as blind as a bat


 If only 'you'd act 'grown up' and could behave like a 'grown up' and stop attacking members, so the conversations could flow even with dissent and disagreements! Suspect

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Re: Slaughter in Florida

Post by eddie on Mon Jun 13, 2016 7:29 pm

"A former co-worker, Daniel Gilroy, said Mr. Mateen had talked often about killing people and had voiced hatred of gays, blacks, women and Jews..."

Yes. Of course he did. A nice little cherry on top of the pretend pie. Rolling Eyes

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Re: Slaughter in Florida

Post by Original Quill on Mon Jun 13, 2016 7:44 pm

4EVER2 wrote:
Paul Ettinger wrote:
They are a religious extremist, adhere to a literal view of the quran and hadiths, that uses islamic doctrine espcially historcal doctrines of Muhammad
Is their hadiths and in his biography of Muhammad giving sex slaves to his warriors?
Yes
Is there accounts of him executing women?
Yes
Executing homosexuals?
Yes
Executing Jews?
Yes
Having and ensdorsing slavery?
Yes
Is there accouns of his berating women for not pleasing their husbands?
yes
It helps if you were not such an ignorant dumb fuck, you might then not be such a twat
Hmmm, and WYWolfie got called right up and threatened with a trip to the 'Basement' earlier today for saying something far - far lamer and much more milder then our Didgey-dooer has been spewing on this very thread; and the silence is amazing! 

And this vulgar post was just the beginning before he really got all hysterically wound up >
I have grown up, so do not patronize me you pathetic little prick
Again you make every excuse under the sun and continue to bury your head in the sand
You simply are an idiot on this topic and will continue to do so until it effects you.
Again you simply cannot respond to myu points so we see the left motto played
Divert, deflect and cover up
Let me know when you open your eyes, because its plain you do not need to grow up, you are just as blind as a bat


 If only 'you'd act 'grown up' and could behave like a 'grown up' and stop attacking members, so the conversations could flow even with dissent and disagreements! Suspect

Yes, I too was wondering where LF and Eds were.  They only seem to pop up when lefties get riled up, but not when righties like didge go off.

@Ben: We have been edging around this subject for over a year, so I was bringing it up now to see if we could sort out the erroneous thinking for once and all.  All of the categories you mention (and I mentioned before you)--religion, politics, patriotism, nationalism, etc.--are arenas of ideology.  An ideology in an integrated system of ideas, sometimes around a core theme.  Religion is but one.

However, the ideology of religion--particularly Islam--has become an obsession with didge.  And, the issue--whatever argument is at hand--is overlain by the in-house RW'ers, who seize any opportunity to pile onto the anti-Muslims cause anyway, so that we rarely get a chance to have a serious discussion.

Didge, in his haste to condemn Muslims, has elevated his thesis to blame all religions as the sole evil of the world.  To sort this out, I believe that the abrahamic religions are a huge source of violence and conflict.  However, I do not not hold with didge that religion is the only source of problems. Nor do I believe that many non-abrahamic religions are particularly a source of the problem.

Didge's position on religion has led him to conclude that ISIL's problem is solely limited to religion.  I believe ISIL is much broader than that.  And, ironically, more than didge, I believe the problem is much broader than that.

Religion is a vehicle that is being used by relatively conservative political and cultural forces in the middle east, just like the used pick-up trucks that they purchase for their shenanigans.  Their purposes require certain tools, one of which is a steadfast core belief in religion.

This is what is unfair about positing synonymy between terrorism and Islam.  Other people have a right to embrace the religion too--more so, in fact, than ISIL or the Taliban--and these RW'ers condemn perfectly innocent people along with the scallywags.


Last edited by Original Quill on Mon Jun 13, 2016 7:52 pm; edited 1 time in total

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Re: Slaughter in Florida

Post by eddie on Mon Jun 13, 2016 7:51 pm

Oh
Do
Shut
Up  

These are just the kind of snippy, snidey and quite frankly, immature childish remarks that get right on my wick.

IF SOMETHING BOTHERS YOU THEN REPORT IT.

I am currently seeing to a few things whilst posting here and only just saw the remark Didge made because it was highlighted.
Why didn't 4ever or Quill report it?

Cluck cluck little hens.

And quill? You mention Lord foul and Eddie as being here yet you're talking to Ben in this thread you stupid fart.

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Re: Slaughter in Florida

Post by eddie on Mon Jun 13, 2016 7:54 pm

Well how about that!

The very post that you moaned about Quill was made to Ben himself.
Then you moaned that two other mods had done nothing?

I'm going to assume you're drunk.

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Re: Slaughter in Florida

Post by eddie on Mon Jun 13, 2016 7:55 pm

Didge please refrain from being abusive whee you're replying to a post. Name-calling isn't necessary.
Be polite and answer the post and not the poster

Any more posts like that and you may be basemented.
Thank you.

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Re: Slaughter in Florida

Post by Original Quill on Mon Jun 13, 2016 7:56 pm

eddie wrote:Why didn't 4ever or Quill report it?

Because reporting in ineffectual when a LW'er does it. The mods only respond to tommy, didge or stormee.

A secondary reason is, it's not my job. I haven't been appointed a mod, nor have we discussed my fee. The conservatives on the board has accepted the positions, and what we have is like Republicans in the lower ranks of politics presently in the US. Only conservative causes and complaints get listened to.

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Re: Slaughter in Florida

Post by eddie on Mon Jun 13, 2016 7:58 pm

Im not going to attempt to try and engage with that nonsense post so let's assume I'm too thick to understand it.

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Re: Slaughter in Florida

Post by Original Quill on Mon Jun 13, 2016 8:00 pm

eddie wrote:Well how about that!

The very post that you moaned about Quill was made to Ben himself.
Then you moaned that two other mods had done nothing?

I'm going to assume you're drunk.

You often assume a lot of things, but one that one you may not assume: I do not drink. Least of all would I be drinking 9-hours ahead of you. That's in the morning, FCS!

As I said above, I'm not the mod. Little of my post is taken up with such flutter.

I talk with Ben because he is a friend, and a kindred liberal, with like ideas. I don't generally whine to the mods about anyone; but if you ask, there's your answer.

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Re: Slaughter in Florida

Post by Guest on Mon Jun 13, 2016 8:03 pm

eddie wrote:Oh
Do
Shut
Up  

These are just the kind of snippy, snidey and quite frankly, immature childish remarks that get right on my wick.

IF SOMETHING BOTHERS YOU THEN REPORT IT.

I am currently seeing to a few things whilst posting here and only just saw the remark Didge made because it was highlighted.
Why didn't 4ever or Quill report it?

Cluck cluck little hens.

And quill? You mention Lord foul and Eddie as being here yet you're talking to Ben in this thread you stupid fart.

**REPORT** Surely you JEST ~~~  
And this hysterical reaction when it's pointed out - due to some obvious over sight ...this is how you react! 

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Re: Slaughter in Florida

Post by eddie on Mon Jun 13, 2016 8:06 pm

Quill. If you call upon my name I shall come and defend myself and you were wrong for the reasons I stated above.

Now dont start things that call into question your ability to defend yourself properly. I've oftentimes found that you just can't defend it when you act out of your comfort zone.

Keeping the peace and staying on topic are your strong points.

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Re: Slaughter in Florida

Post by Guest on Mon Jun 13, 2016 8:08 pm

Original Quill wrote:
Paul Ettinger wrote:Most experts agree that ISIS is the most literal believers of the Quran ovet that of all other Muslims, which again is based off so called historical accounts. Many Muslims have interepretations of the Quran and on arabic words themselves, showing you have not got a clue what you are talking about
Also to say something is not islamic based off a myth, when thew vast majority of Muslims deify hadiths to an equal level as the quran, showing there is no true one way of what is islam. As nobody is alive today who live then and no way to verify the accounts.
This is why you are not very bright.
The fact is ISIS does practice Islam, in a literal sense and tries to emulate acts by Muhammad.

Again i could not a flying fuck with your attempts to divert this onto racism, get that fucking stupidity out of your head, its not going to buy

I think you are fabricating your ideas as you go along.  You have this one premise--that everything is hues of religion--which we saw germinating in you about a year-and-a-half ago, during the Egyptian military takeover.  Today, you have since expanded your thesis to say, all evil derives from religion---most particularly, Islam.  After all, Islamists are your nemesis in your crusade on behalf of Israel.

Islam is merely an example of a religion.  Anyone can hold an opinion.  But to hold that religion is the only ideology that motivates people is pure ignorance, and reflects a lost attempt at theory.  It's like the simplistic theory of Federalist No. 10, that the only problem in politics is that of 'faction'...even the federalists went to a higher genus of ideology that do you.

Religion is only one ideology that motivates people.  Politics.  Patriotism.  Nationalism.  Many, many other ideologies motivate people.

Stick to what you're good at.  Collect blocks.


I think you are a pathetic twat behind a keyboard who simply has not been able to dispute a single thing I have said
Again is like your idiotic Mormons argument where you decide whether something is religious or not.
Its about as stupid as it gets based on myths, where you are deciding what myth is valid to be a myth.
The point is in the monotheists religions they hold many views as well as political views of which you are being a dumb fuckwit ignoring

I would stick to dot the dot if i was you or your favorite job being the donkey,l that everyone sticks the pin too

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Re: Slaughter in Florida

Post by Original Quill on Mon Jun 13, 2016 8:23 pm

didge wrote:I think you are a pathetic twat behind a keyboard who simply has not been able to dispute a single thing I have said
Again is like your idiotic Mormons argument where you decide whether something is religious or not.
Its about as stupid as it gets based on myths, where you are deciding what myth is valid to be a myth.
The point is in the monotheists religions they hold many views as well as political views of which you are being a dumb fuckwit ignoring

But you focus on the religious aspect, because it aids in your campaign to disparage Islam, which in turn is core to your defense of Israeli aggression. Let's vilify the Palestinians and hide the monstrous activities of Netanyahu's Israel.

I know your thesis on monotheistic religion: it's the greatest evil of all. If you ever read past the first sentence of another's post, you would recognize that I have already answered all of your criticisms. By not reading, much less comprehending, you become repetitive. And one thing you are, didge, is repetitive.

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Re: Slaughter in Florida

Post by Guest on Mon Jun 13, 2016 8:25 pm

Original Quill wrote:
didge wrote:I think you are a pathetic twat behind a keyboard who simply has not been able to dispute a single thing I have said
Again is like your idiotic Mormons argument where you decide whether something is religious or not.
Its about as stupid as it gets based on myths, where you are deciding what myth is valid to be a myth.
The point is in the monotheists religions they hold many views as well as political views of which you are being a dumb fuckwit ignoring

But you focus on the religious aspect, because it aids in your campaign to disparage Islam, which in turn is core to your defense of Israeli aggression.  Let's vilify the Palestinians and hide the monstrous activities of Netanyahu's Israel.

I know your thesis on monotheistic religion: it's the greatest evil of all.  If you ever read past the first sentence of another's post, you would recognize that I have already answered all of your criticisms.  By not reading, much less comprehending, you become repetitive.  And one thing you are, didge, is repetitive.


I could not give a fuck about some insecure prick who has to pass himself off as  Judge to impress people because he is so insecure he has to continually lie on a two bit forum

Now postd again because you are an ignorant regressive twat

I speak of all Monothiest rreligions, which includes Judaism
So your views on Israel are as seen a  crock of shit
You failed to answer a single point and mainly as you are an idiot who knows next to nothing about theology and the psychology behind religious belief.
Next you will be telling mke it has nothing to do with religion those who murdered the jornalists at Charlie Hebdo




I do not think people really understand the concept of religion when it is based on fear.
As without this fear, the Abrahamic religions would be meaningless.

Fear is required as a form of control of the people who follow the religion.
So it plays on the insecurities of people over death and holds out a carrot stick for them. That is called paradise, but it comes with a catch. Either you abide by the rules, or you will suffer the most unimaginable pain for eternity. So you can see how fear is the driving factor and when people are led by fear and are totally controlled by this fear. They will in many cases do anything to avoid suffering, as they truly believe they will in a supposed after life, if they do not do the will of their deity.

Just think about that and how abhorant that is. When we see the very same happen daily by those who look to impose complete control on their victims. Look at those who suffer domestic violence, who are so cowed with fear, through the threat and actual acts of violence. That many sadly are so in fear, they are unable to go to the authorities. You see the same with the abuse of children, the sexual abuse of children, its all a control and a fear is used to control the victims. Yet when it is religion we ignore the same method being used and watch sadly as people become victims to fear, as a religious believer.

In every aspect we are appaled at such methods in our lives, but when it comes to religion we ignore the same hateful fear used to entice. You then have the claims made by the person committing domestic violence that they love their viticm and in some cases the victim truly believes they love their abuser. Again the same with religion, love is claimed to be given , but its conditional as it is within domestic violence. Either you abide by the rules or you will suffer.

Its then of no surpise that we see the 3 Abrahamic religions invented by men as forms of control to control a mass of people, as what better way to do so. Than to play off their fears and insecurities over death. This is why the beliefs are so formed from the time, that they make the notion that anything claiming to be a loving god as so ridiculous based on the belief systems that so actively discriminate against groups of people, within their belief systems.

This is why good people can end up doing bad, because they are so controlled by fear, they activelly believe this is what they are meant to in order to gain entry to Paradise. Within Islam they offer such an appalling concept, that death is valued more so over that of lfe through Martydom. Simply a believer is led to believe that all sins are forgiven, and they will be given a free pass into this make belief heaven. If they forgo their life dying through conflict in the defense of Allah. This is played off a belief to defend the faith from any transgressions and thus people so easily controlled by this fear. Will believe this is the best way to gain entry to heaven. Even more so when it is presented as the most glourious way to get into their heaven.

This is what people fail to grasp, if we viewed the Abrahamic deity based on someone we knew. We would give them such a wide birth or report them to the Police. As love is unconditional and the very fact fear is requrired in order for people to believe. Is what can make good people, do countless bad things. Without this fear, these religions would lose their drawing power. I mean what sort of story would it be if Jesus died on the cross to save mankind from their sins, if you were never going to face any punishements in an afterlife. You would ask why on earth would some go through such sufferig for nothing. As seen the draw to Jesus, is his saving of people, because there is a fear of an eternal punishment in the afterlife.

So when people claim religion is not the cause, they fail to understand how people are controled by fear itself, through the belief system. Its been so successful this system, that for over 2000 years we have seen countless violence committed and because many of those doing this, thought they were doing the will of their deity.

So to Ben's point on feelins and people are either good or bad and its bad that only do bad, is flawed and fails to understand these religions. Because in wars many good people have to do bad and kill others in order to defend themselves and those who they serve with. Countless soldiers suffer such nightmares for what they have seen and do in battle and many of them are good people.
So Ben is on the complete wrong track and its the very aspects of religion and its controls, that people refuse or do not want to talk about.

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Re: Slaughter in Florida

Post by Guest on Mon Jun 13, 2016 8:50 pm

Didgey-dooer spewed > I could not give a fuck about some insecure prick who has to pass himself off as  Judge to impress people because he is so insecure he has to continually lie on a two bit forum

Now postd again because you are an ignorant regressive twat


Well, that didn't take long ...but far be it for me to report anything this vile and derailing - I'd be accused of goading and harassing his royal ass; especially since he's now trashed 2 topics with the same vile methods! 
BUT THAT'S JUST OK'D BECAUSE IT'S DIDGEY-DOOER!   The 'fair-haired' favorite of our Moderator Eddie! Evil or Very Mad

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Re: Slaughter in Florida

Post by Guest on Mon Jun 13, 2016 8:52 pm

4EVER2 wrote:
Didgey-dooer spewed > I could not give a fuck about some insecure prick who has to pass himself off as  Judge to impress people because he is so insecure he has to continually lie on a two bit forum

Now postd again because you are an ignorant regressive twat


Well, that didn't take long ...but far be it for me to report anything this vile and derailing - I'd be accused of goading and harassing his royal ass; especially since he's now trashed 2 topics with the same vile methods! 
BUT THAT'S JUST OK'D BECAUSE IT'S DIDGEY-DOOER!   The 'fair-haired' favorite of our Moderator Eddie! Evil or Very Mad


lol contradiction and double standard alert

It also shows how slective you are on posts, as both Quill and I have been abusive towards each other, showing and proving what a cock you are and the fact you bring up Eddie, is actually goading

Of course this always happens when i reason better than the retards Quill and 4evercluelss

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Re: Slaughter in Florida

Post by Guest on Mon Jun 13, 2016 8:56 pm

Oh and for the record, Eddie, has placed me in the basement twice

Clearly I must be a favorite for her to do that lol

You see its that kind of statement that is goading and claiming a falsified claim, as its not even attacking me, but attacking Eddie.

I hope the admin take note of that

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Re: Slaughter in Florida

Post by eddie on Mon Jun 13, 2016 9:01 pm

Paul Ettinger wrote:Oh and for the record, Eddie, has placed me in the basement twice

Clearly I must be a favorite for her to do that lol

You see its that kind of statement that is goading and claiming a falsified claim, as its not even attacking me, but attacking Eddie.

I hope the admin take note of that


Often nothing is said, but it's always noted.

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Re: Slaughter in Florida

Post by Guest on Mon Jun 13, 2016 9:03 pm

eddie wrote:
Paul Ettinger wrote:Oh and for the record, Eddie, has placed me in the basement twice

Clearly I must be a favorite for her to do that lol

You see its that kind of statement that is goading and claiming a falsified claim, as its not even attacking me, but attacking Eddie.

I hope the admin take note of that


Often nothing is said, but it's always noted.


I hope so, as i am not bothered what is said to me, but that was a deliberate attempt to attack and goad you off things I had said as a deflection.

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Re: Slaughter in Florida

Post by Guest on Mon Jun 13, 2016 9:24 pm

Original Quill wrote:
4EVER2 wrote:
Hmmm, and WYWolfie got called right up and threatened with a trip to the 'Basement' earlier today for saying something far - far lamer and much more milder then our Didgey-dooer has been spewing on this very thread; and the silence is amazing! 

And this vulgar post was just the beginning before he really got all hysterically wound up >



 If only 'you'd act 'grown up' and could behave like a 'grown up' and stop attacking members, so the conversations could flow even with dissent and disagreements! Suspect

Yes, I too was wondering where LF and Eds were.  They only seem to pop up when lefties get riled up, but not when righties like didge go off.

@Ben: We have been edging around this subject for over a year, so I was bringing it up now to see if we could sort out the erroneous thinking for once and all.  All of the categories you mention (and I mentioned before you)--religion, politics, patriotism, nationalism, etc.--are arenas of ideology.  An ideology in an integrated system of ideas, sometimes around a core theme.  Religion is but one.

However, the ideology of religion--particularly Islam--has become an obsession with didge.  And, the issue--whatever argument is at hand--is overlain by the in-house RW'ers, who seize any opportunity to pile onto the anti-Muslims cause anyway, so that we rarely get a chance to have a serious discussion.

Didge, in his haste to condemn Muslims, has elevated his thesis to blame all religions as the sole evil of the world.  To sort this out, I believe that the abrahamic religions are a huge source of violence and conflict.  However, I do not not hold with didge that religion is the only source of problems.  Nor do I believe that many non-abrahamic religions are particularly a source of the problem.

Didge's position on religion has led him to conclude that ISIL's problem is solely limited to religion.  I believe ISIL is much broader than that.  And, ironically, more than didge, I believe the problem is much broader than that.

Religion is a vehicle that is being used by relatively conservative political and cultural forces in the middle east, just like the used pick-up trucks that they purchase for their shenanigans.  Their purposes require certain tools, one of which is a steadfast core belief in religion.

This is what is unfair about positing synonymy between terrorism and Islam.  Other people have a right to embrace the religion too--more so, in fact, than ISIL or the Taliban--and these RW'ers condemn perfectly innocent people along with the scallywags.



I have just read this crock of shit and I have to laugh

Not only is it a crock of shit but its blatantly untrue as i stand firmly behind progressive and secular Muslims.

I want to see islam progress as we have seen Christianity progress for many Christians.

So to say I have a crusade against islam and Muslims is the typical islamphobe argument that seeks to shut down any geuine criticism of bad beliefs which are central in islam. Again what Quill fails to understand is that Islam is a set  of belief that incorporate many political beliefs.

There is no denying within the 3 monotheist religions they hold many Political discriminating views.

That is being critical of these religions and even today people suffer prejudice and discrminations because of these beliefs and yet as seen above the regressive invent lies in order to shut down genuine criticism.

Now I constant am critical of many religions, Islam, happens to see the most vioilence done in its name at the moment and its clear why. As i have said, there is a fear from some Muslims that Islam will lose its control in countries that are Muslim majority. This all happened not because of the Iraq or Afghanistan war, but because of the Arab springs, which happen a few decades too early. In response to these uprisings by progressive Muslims, we saw them crushed by islamists.

It has been sicne the Arab springs starting that we have really seen the esclation in violence done in the name of islam and the fear is based off Western Influence and why now more than ever the west will come under further attack as there certainly is a clash in cultures when the culture is based off literal religious belief.

Who clearly shaken by how many Muslims did rise up. have been looking to consilidate their power ever since. This is why i say it has everything to do with religion and control and we saw the exact same in the west with the 30 years war and of which resulted in the slow demise of religious control in Europe.

So no Didge is not on some crusde against Muslims or Islam, he wants to stand behind progressive Muslims, who the left continually ignore. Didge has a far better historical and theological understanding than you do. Quill fails to understand that the abrahamic faiths in its literal form are conservatives, more so neo conservatives, who he is happy to attack if southern Christian, mormon etc, making him the biggest hypocrite going, but if the word islam is mentioned, he shrinks to the size of a mouse.

So i just wanted to rrubbish the load of bullshit written in some pathetic attempt to deligitimize me, as I keep making him look an inept idiot

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Re: Slaughter in Florida

Post by Cass on Tue Jun 14, 2016 3:45 am

Wow.

49 dead. 53 injured. Hundreds maybe thousands whose lives will never be the same. A 17 year old among the dead. Hundreds of family members' hearts breaking. A void filled with silence and pain that wont ever be fixed.
Sad

Remember what this is about please.

May they rest in peace.

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Re: Slaughter in Florida

Post by WhoseYourWolfie on Tue Jun 14, 2016 4:39 am

eddie wrote:
Raggamuffin wrote:I haven't gone into this very much yet, but one man managed to kill 50 people with a gun? That's surely got to be some kind of record.

That's why I started a new thread - to keep questions in a certain section.
There's a lot about this that doesn't make sense

Idea

IT IS a record by one shooter in one situation/place in the US during peace time;

However,  Anders Breivik (Norway, 2011) still has the world record, with 77 deaths.
Second is Woo Bum-Kon, of S. Korea (1982), w. 57 dead..

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Re: Slaughter in Florida

Post by Raggamuffin on Tue Jun 14, 2016 6:20 am

WhoseYourWolfie wrote:
eddie wrote:

That's why I started a new thread - to keep questions in a certain section.
There's a lot about this that doesn't make sense

Idea

IT IS a record by one shooter in one situation/place in the US during peace time;

However,  Anders Breivik (Norway, 2011) still has the world record, with 77 deaths.
Second is Woo Bum-Kon, of S. Korea (1982), w. 57 dead..

Oh right. I actually didn't realise that Breivik had killed that many. I guess there was nobody there to stop him. I read about these people in the US who go on the rampage, and it amazes me that they didn't manage to kill more people before they're stopped by the police.

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Re: Slaughter in Florida

Post by veya_victaous on Tue Jun 14, 2016 6:25 am

Cass wrote:Wow.

49 dead. 53 injured. Hundreds maybe thousands whose lives will never be the same. A 17 year old among the dead. Hundreds of family members' hearts breaking. A void filled with silence and pain that wont ever be fixed.
Sad

Remember what this is about please.

May they rest in peace.


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Re: Slaughter in Florida

Post by sassy on Tue Jun 14, 2016 9:15 am

That really brings it home Veya.

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Re: Slaughter in Florida

Post by Miffs2 on Tue Jun 14, 2016 9:26 am

Cass wrote:Wow.

49 dead. 53 injured. Hundreds maybe thousands whose lives will never be the same. A 17 year old among the dead. Hundreds of family members' hearts breaking. A void filled with silence and pain that wont ever be fixed.
Sad

Remember what this is about please.

May they rest in peace.
Such a tragedy. I have just watched the footage from the phone of a lady that didn't survive. Heartbreaking.
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Re: Slaughter in Florida

Post by sassy on Tue Jun 14, 2016 9:46 am

I wonder is this is a clue to why he did it, was he really gay and hated the thought?



Orlando shooter, Omar Mateen, 'was a regular at Pulse nightclub'
Customers had seen killer there before and several report getting messages from him on gay dating apps

The gunman who killed 49 people in an attack on a gay nightclub in Orlando is said to have been a regular at the venue and had messaged several people on gay dating apps.
Four regular customers said they had seen killer Omar Mateen drinking at the nightclub on multiple occasions. “Sometimes he would go over in the corner and sit and drink by himself, and other times he would get so drunk he was loud and belligerent,” Ty Smith told the Orlando Sentinel


..................  The manager of the Pulse nightclub also spoke: “I want you to know we are not leaving,” Neema Bahrami said. “We are here to stay. We will be bigger and better than you can ever imagine. We will not be defeated. We are here to stay.”
Obama is due to visit Orlando on Thursday.
The news that Mateen was a regular at Pulse added another dimension to the profile of a man who had in the past been on an FBI watchlist. His former wife said he was mentally unstable and violent.
One Pulse regular, Chris Callen, who performs under the name Kristina McLaughlin and is married to Smith, said he had witnessed violent outbursts by Mateen at the club.
Kevin West, 37, a former Navy serviceman, said he been messaged by Mateen on the gay dating app Jack’d. Though out of touch with him for a few months, West said he had received a message from Mateen saying he was in town and asking to meet for a drink.

West said he was at Pulse on Saturday night and saw Mateen walking in as he was leaving. “I remember details,” he told the Washington Post. “I never forget a face.He walked directly past me. I said, ‘Hey,’ and he turned and said, ‘Hey,’ and nodded his head.”
West told the LA Times he had immediately contacted the FBI after seeing Mateen’s picture on the news, handing over his login to his Jack’d app.
Another man apparently messaged by Mateen on the dating app was 23-year-old Cord Cedeno, who also told the Washington Post he had seen Mateen at the club before. “It was definitely him. He’d come in for years, and people knew him,” Cedeno said. “He was open with his picture on the sites; he was easy to recognise.”
His former classmate Samuel King, who also worked at the same mall as Mateen after high school, said Mateen had known that he and many of his friends were gay but never expressed any disapproval. “He had to know it, but I never got any sense of homophobia or aggression from him,” he told the Washington Post.

http://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2016/jun/14/orlando-shooter-omar-mateen-was-a-regular-at-nightclub

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Re: Slaughter in Florida

Post by Guest on Tue Jun 14, 2016 10:13 am

sassy wrote:I wonder is this is a clue to why he did it, was he really gay and hated the thought?

Orlando shooter, Omar Mateen, 'was a regular at Pulse nightclub'
Customers had seen killer there before and several report getting messages from him on gay dating apps

The gunman who killed 49 people in an attack on a gay nightclub in Orlando is said to have been a regular at the venue and had messaged several people on gay dating apps.
Four regular customers said they had seen killer Omar Mateen drinking at the nightclub on multiple occasions. “Sometimes he would go over in the corner and sit and drink by himself, and other times he would get so drunk he was loud and belligerent,” Ty Smith told the Orlando Sentinel
..................  The manager of the Pulse nightclub also spoke: “I want you to know we are not leaving,” Neema Bahrami said. “We are here to stay. We will be bigger and better than you can ever imagine. We will not be defeated. We are here to stay.”
Obama is due to visit Orlando on Thursday.
The news that Mateen was a regular at Pulse added another dimension to the profile of a man who had in the past been on an FBI watchlist. His former wife said he was mentally unstable and violent.
One Pulse regular, Chris Callen, who performs under the name Kristina McLaughlin and is married to Smith, said he had witnessed violent outbursts by Mateen at the club.
Kevin West, 37, a former Navy serviceman, said he been messaged by Mateen on the gay dating app Jack’d. Though out of touch with him for a few months, West said he had received a message from Mateen saying he was in town and asking to meet for a drink.

West said he was at Pulse on Saturday night and saw Mateen walking in as he was leaving. “I remember details,” he told the Washington Post. “I never forget a face.He walked directly past me. I said, ‘Hey,’ and he turned and said, ‘Hey,’ and nodded his head.”
West told the LA Times he had immediately contacted the FBI after seeing Mateen’s picture on the news, handing over his login to his Jack’d app.
Another man apparently messaged by Mateen on the dating app was 23-year-old Cord Cedeno, who also told the Washington Post he had seen Mateen at the club before. “It was definitely him. He’d come in for years, and people knew him,” Cedeno said. “He was open with his picture on the sites; he was easy to recognise.”
His former classmate Samuel King, who also worked at the same mall as Mateen after high school, said Mateen had known that he and many of his friends were gay but never expressed any disapproval. “He had to know it, but I never got any sense of homophobia or aggression from him,” he told the Washington Post.
http://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2016/jun/14/orlando-shooter-omar-mateen-was-a-regular-at-nightclub

Nothing scarier then a human with a highly confused - quilt ridden - obsessive compulsion to self mutilate because his sexual preferences make him feel so vile ...so he externalizes those loathing feelings and takes out the very people he's been sexually attracted too!  That is some kinda of messed up brain No

I've read about a Catholic based church where the priests feel compelled to bloody their bodies as a method of proving their love for 'GOD' ...that until their body has actually 'BLED' they haven't felt the spiritual release that they crave; whether it be crawling across cobble stone on bare knees and hands to the church & alter or flagellations with a small whip upon their bare backs - they do this to honor their faith. 
Mateen had to have been battling some deeply rooted mental anguish since his early pubescent years - no wonder he turned away from his family's devotion time

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Re: Slaughter in Florida

Post by sassy on Tue Jun 14, 2016 10:18 am

Well, from what his ex wife and former fellow workers said about him on tv last night, he was certainly one screwed up individual.

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Re: Slaughter in Florida

Post by HoratioTarr on Tue Jun 14, 2016 10:30 am

sassy wrote:Well, from what his ex wife and former fellow workers said about him on tv last night, he was certainly one screwed up individual.

According to his wife, he was gay.
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Re: Slaughter in Florida

Post by eddie on Tue Jun 14, 2016 10:59 am

HoratioTarr wrote:
sassy wrote:Well, from what his ex wife and former fellow workers said about him on tv last night, he was certainly one screwed up individual.

According to his wife, he was gay.

All these people who apparently heard him say he was going to kill and no one thought to report him.
And now he's a closet gay.

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Re: Slaughter in Florida

Post by Miffs2 on Tue Jun 14, 2016 11:45 am

eddie wrote:
HoratioTarr wrote:

According to his wife, he was gay.

All these people who apparently heard him say he was going to kill and no one thought to report him.
And now he's a closet gay.
The plot thickens I think
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Re: Slaughter in Florida

Post by Tommy Monk on Tue Jun 14, 2016 11:54 am

He was a Muslim who phoned police announcing his allegiance to isis...

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Re: Slaughter in Florida

Post by eddie on Tue Jun 14, 2016 12:02 pm

Tommy Monk wrote:He was a Muslim who phoned police announcing his allegiance to isis...

Apparently yes. And known to the FBI but they wasn't watching him.. On his gay dating app and his many claims of "I hate gays and I'm going to kill people/them"
They dint see or hear any of that.

Go figure. scratch

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Re: Slaughter in Florida

Post by Original Quill on Tue Jun 14, 2016 6:04 pm

Tommy Monk wrote:He was a Muslim who phoned police announcing his allegiance to isis...

Well, that call was made for suspicious reasons. It was during the negotiations spanning three hours, in which the police queried him about what was bothering him. He mentioned gays, Jews, blacks, etc., and mentioned he didn't like the US bombing ISIS. He also pledged allegiance to the Boston Marathon bombers. Yet, he also pledged allegiance to Hezbollah, a group opposed to ISIS. The FBI revealed that in "inflammatory and contradictory" comments to co-workers in 2013, he claimed to be a member of Hezbollah. So...wazzup boss? That could mean anything.

I think it's pretty clear the source of the problem is that he was nutzoid.

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Re: Slaughter in Florida

Post by Tommy Monk on Tue Jun 14, 2016 6:52 pm



He was a Muslim and a supporter of Islamist terrorists and groups...



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Re: Slaughter in Florida

Post by Original Quill on Tue Jun 14, 2016 7:15 pm

Tommy Monk wrote:

He was a Muslim and a supporter of Islamist terrorists and groups...

He also was gay and had loads of internal conflicts.  He was a wife abuser apparently, and he hated Jews, blacks, women and lesbian...and he was homophobic.  Oh, right...and he also had sanpaku eyes.  

We've been over it all.  Pick whatever phobia you want.

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Re: Slaughter in Florida

Post by Tommy Monk on Tue Jun 14, 2016 7:40 pm



Gay...!?


He was married twice, and was the father of a 3-year-old boy!!!

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Re: Slaughter in Florida

Post by Original Quill on Tue Jun 14, 2016 7:44 pm

Tommy Monk wrote:

Gay...!?

He was married twice, and was the father of a 3-year-old boy!!!

Hahaha... You're surprised that gays have live sperm?  

Will wonders never cease as we wander thru tommy wonkaland?  Evil or Very Mad

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Re: Slaughter in Florida

Post by Tommy Monk on Tue Jun 14, 2016 7:46 pm

The fantasy land is all yours quim...

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Re: Slaughter in Florida

Post by Original Quill on Tue Jun 14, 2016 7:55 pm

Tommy Monk wrote:The fantasy land is all yours quim...

And the rides are free?? Shocked Oh joy!

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Re: Slaughter in Florida

Post by Syl on Tue Jun 14, 2016 7:59 pm

Tommy Monk wrote:

Gay...!?


He was married twice, and was the father of a 3-year-old boy!!!
Closet gay.....causes all sorts of confusion, add to that he was a wife abusing arsehole.

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Re: Slaughter in Florida

Post by Miffs2 on Tue Jun 14, 2016 8:13 pm

Syl wrote:
Tommy Monk wrote:

Gay...!?


He was married twice, and was the father of a 3-year-old boy!!!
Closet gay.....causes all sorts of confusion, add to that he was a wife abusing arsehole.
Mmmm murdering arsehole no doubt. But I can't help think a closet homophobic is oh so much more palatable than this being another example of Islamic extremism.
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Re: Slaughter in Florida

Post by Syl on Tue Jun 14, 2016 8:20 pm

Miffs2 wrote:
Syl wrote:
Closet gay.....causes all sorts of confusion, add to that he was a wife abusing arsehole.
Mmmm murdering arsehole no doubt. But I can't help think a closet homophobic is oh so much more palatable than this being another example of Islamic extremism.

There are lots of theories doing the rounds at the minute regarding his 'reasons'...no doubt the picture will become clearer as more info is disclosed.

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Re: Slaughter in Florida

Post by Tommy Monk on Tue Jun 14, 2016 8:28 pm

The man was a Muslim terrorist supporter... twice married and a father of a 3 year old boy... he proclaimed his allegiance to isis...


He went to Saudi Arabia twice on 'ummrah'...


He used a gay dating app to tell homosexuals of his hatred for them and his intention to kill them.



The media are trying to downplay this as it is likely to boost votes for trump in upcoming election.



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Re: Slaughter in Florida

Post by Original Quill on Tue Jun 14, 2016 8:31 pm

Tommy Monk wrote:The man was a Muslim terrorist supporter... twice married and a father of a 3 year old boy... he proclaimed his allegiance to isis...

He went to Saudi Arabia twice on 'ummrah'...

He used a gay dating app to tell homosexuals of his hatred for them and his intention to kill them.

The media are trying to downplay this as it is likely to boost votes for trump in upcoming election.

And you are cherry-picking the facts to 'up-play' this for the opposite reasons.

We're in the gallery...just enjoying the show.

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Re: Slaughter in Florida

Post by Ben Reilly on Tue Jun 14, 2016 8:36 pm

Tommy Monk wrote:The man was a Muslim terrorist supporter... twice married and a father of a 3 year old boy... he proclaimed his allegiance to isis...


He went to Saudi Arabia twice on 'ummrah'...


He used a gay dating app to tell homosexuals of his hatred for them and his intention to kill them.



The media are trying to downplay this as it is likely to boost votes for trump in upcoming election.



Likely to boost votes for Trump, what are you smoking now?

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Re: Slaughter in Florida

Post by Miffs2 on Tue Jun 14, 2016 8:48 pm

Ben_Reilly wrote:
Tommy Monk wrote:The man was a Muslim terrorist supporter... twice married and a father of a 3 year old boy... he proclaimed his allegiance to isis...


He went to Saudi Arabia twice on 'ummrah'...


He used a gay dating app to tell homosexuals of his hatred for them and his intention to kill them.



The media are trying to downplay this as it is likely to boost votes for trump in upcoming election.



Likely to boost votes for Trump, what are you smoking now?


Radical Islam or homophobia? Win win for Trump either way.
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Re: Slaughter in Florida

Post by Tommy Monk on Tue Jun 14, 2016 8:53 pm




"...The Orlando gunman's wife has told federal agents she tried to talk her husband out of carrying out the attack, NBC News has learned.

Omar Mateen's wife, Noor Zahi Salman, told the FBI she was with him when he bought ammunition and a holster, several officials familiar with the case said.

She told the FBI that she once drove him to the gay nightclub, Pulse, because he wanted to scope it out...

...Mateen opened fire at Pulse early Sunday...

Authorities are considering filing criminal charges against Noor for failing to tell them what she knew before the brutal attack, law enforcement officials say..."

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