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Post by Guest on Wed Jan 27, 2016 12:00 pm

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Last edited by korban dallas on Wed Jan 27, 2016 12:02 pm; edited 2 times in total

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Re: AHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH

Post by Raggamuffin on Thu Jan 28, 2016 9:09 pm

veya_victaous wrote:
Raggamuffin wrote:So this is now yet another thread about Israel/Palestine. Smile

Yes but Specifically about Which nerf guns should we drop cheers

What do you think? do we need to drop real nerf guns or will some of the knock-off ones like those on the left of the picture do? scratch


Keep the big ones and drop the small ones. Laughing

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Re: AHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH

Post by Guest on Fri Jan 29, 2016 4:39 am

Ben_Reilly wrote:
Didge wrote:


So naive
Both get aid from the US, in fact Palestine gets huge aid from the world.
The question you only have to ask is if a nation wants peace they will only have to extend their hand and have peace, of which has been achieved by Israel with former enemies
This has always been about a belief religiously on both sides, all of which is wrong but it is fundamentally the Palestinians in who deny the existence of Israel. This is evident that the PLO was formed under occupation not by Israel but by Jordan, but never view Jordan or the West Bank in 1964 as occupied. What people forget is even whilst the Oslo accords were going on we had systematic organised terrorism started by Arafat. What you have to ask yourself is whether you stand for democracy and liberalism. I do not discount wrongs by Israel and condemn them but there is an orchestrated movement which seeks to remove Israel from existence. You hear this in the rhetoric of words like colonialism, apartheid etc. Words and views created to deligitimize a nation, to the extent it becomes Ostracized.

What I would like to ask is what many would do in the position of Israel. It has ceded land for peace and that peace has worked with Egypt and Jordan, but not the Palestinians. They left Gaza and pulled back its settlements and they were still attacked. That is not the sign of a group of people wanting peace with Israel in any shape of form, as they believe the land should be Muslim controlled as a narrative plays off a view it is divinely given, even though the Arabs were colonists themselves to the area once in the past.
People who want peace do not continue to squander the chance to have this which the PLO has had the opportunity to have.

I think in the end it is ISIS that is making Arab nations now look to Israel and this problem may no longer be a problem, when the Palestinians maybe forced into a peace deal when they lose support by the Arab states who now look to Israel for support to who they all see as a bigger enemies

ISIS and Iran

I'm not forgetting anything or taking a side in this -- I thought I was pretty clear about that.

However, the amount of aid the U.S. gives to Israel dwarfs the amount given to Palestine, and being that it's the U.S. doing it, that's not bringing the conflict closer to resolution; it's making it harder. The U.S. needs to cut off all military funding to Israel and apportion the rest of the aid to Israelis and Palestinians equally, per capita.

The UN needs to authorize a large peacekeeping force to fight terrorism and prevent incursions, and to strongly suggest to both sides that it's time to create an accord that works.


Like I said so naive. The Palestinians get more aid per capita than anyone else from the rest of the world and what do they do with it?
Do they look to or have they ever looked to build peace initiatives? No, what is the level of antisemitism?  93% taught for decades to believe Israel has no right to exist. It is this and at every level what has been the problem. As Jews have been attacked and killed way before Israel even was created in 1948. in 1929 the same claims made today about the Mosque were made and over a hundred Jews were murdered. So it would help if you understood the real history, that is all I ask of you that you actually read some neutral sources What defense measures have they built? You see you fail every time to understand Islamic extremism Ben and this has always been your failing on every single topic on the issue. Where you have an Islamist group in hamas that has never accepted the Oslo accord and where Israel withdrew its forces and settlements, Israel was still attacked. The reason why because they will not accept any group of people not Muslim control lands they believe are divinely given by their mickey mouse deity. This is what you fail to grasp and sending in a peace keeping force would be an utter disaster. As within a short time they would be pulling out after numerous casualness from terrorist attacks by Hamas and co

To have peace you have to want to have peace and the only peace the Palestinian authorities recognise, is one where Israel does not exist.


To give you an example of why your points are so naive:



Any internationally forced resolution will of course be accompanied by international guarantees in writing and international troops on the ground. All one needs to do is to look at the betrayal of the Ukrainians by these same Western powers, who promised them that if they gave up their nuclear weapons, their territorial integrity would be guaranteed. How well did that work out for the Ukrainians? As for international troops, just look over the northern border into Hezbollah-controlled Lebanon, where the promise of an international force in the aftermath of the Second Lebanon War to stop the resupply of Hezbollah missiles yielded the clandestine transfer of over 100,000 missiles into Lebanon, and ZERO missiles being intercepted by the international force.


http://www.jpost.com/Opinion/What-would-happen-if-Israel-withdrew-from-the-West-Bank-and-ended-the-siege-of-Gaza-442855



I think his ideas are better and more realistic than yours


Americans relate to Israel on shared values, and the occupation is undermining the long-term American commitment to Israel. They don’t know that the 3 billion per year American investment in Israel returns more vital intelligence and saved more American soldier lives than all of NATO combined.

If I were to council the next American President, I would recommend the following:
• Announce that American stands with the one and only democracy in the region, Israel, which is essential for American national security
• Publicly place the onus for the failure of a two-state solution primarily with the Palestinians who have repeatedly refused to sign an end-of -conflict resolution, or accept a Jewish state, as evidenced by their rejection of the Clinton and Olmert offers
• I would recommend that America stop considering the Palestinians victims, as much of their struggles are self-imposed, choosing ideology over economic independence
• Unless the Palestinians agree in advance to sign an end-of-conflict resolution with a demilitarized state, America will publicly state that it won’t push for anything more than a more sustainable ceasefire and ground-up economic development
• Ask Israel as a gesture and to affirm its rule of law, to uproot all illegal settlement outposts
• Israel as a gesture for the future time when the Palestinians are ready for a final deal, should limit their building over the Green line to the environs of the major settlement blocks
• Make clear that with ISIS just over the Jordan, Israel must for the foreseeable future control the security of the Jordan River Valley
• Demand transparency, an uncorrupt Palestine government ending incitement, and a preparation of Palestinians for their share of painful compromises.

Realistic? Actually yes! One of the reasons the peace process has failed is that almost nothing is ever asked of the Palestinians, and worse, no consequences are imposed for their rejection of every deal that allows Israel to exist. They need to see sticks as well as carrots to prompt them to come to the table and do more than take what they can and then walk out, as they have every single time so far.

Speaking frankly to the Palestinians, working with the Sunni Gulf states, Egypt, and Turkey to accept a reasonable security deal for Israel, and getting rid of UNWRA’s definition of Palestinian refugees, a lethal poison pill for Israel, would be the beginning of the road to a two-state solution.

The author is the director of MEPIN™ (Middle East Political and Information Network™) and a regular contributor to The Jerusalem Post. MEPIN™ is a Middle East research analysis read by members of Congress, their foreign policy advisers, members of the Knesset, journalists and organizational leaders. He regularly briefs members of Congress on issues related to the Middle East.



http://www.jpost.com/Opinion/What-would-happen-if-Israel-withdrew-from-the-West-Bank-and-ended-the-siege-of-Gaza-442855

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Re: AHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH

Post by eddie on Fri Jan 29, 2016 1:20 pm

Just to clarify, there is no limit on how many threads you can post about the same topic.

If you see a news article or thread has been duplicated, please let an admin know and we can merge the two topics.

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Re: AHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH

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