the state of incestophobia in the world!!!

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Post by Guest on Mon Jun 29, 2015 4:40 pm

First topic message reminder :

Where are the equal right people, why can't brother marry sisters, mothers marry sons or daughters, fathers marry daughters or sons....

they just love each other it could be consensual and it just isn't fair that they can't marry..

could this be another blatant denial of the right of a minority group...

vote for incestual marriage...

vote for gay incestual marriage...

it's the only right and fair way....




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Post by Guest on Wed Jul 01, 2015 4:17 pm

lol in your dreams why was part of the punishment for being sent out the garden that she shall have increased pain in child birth..lol

try and figure that out... but I doubt you will.....

"game , set and match" I believe.......





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Post by Guest on Wed Jul 01, 2015 4:40 pm

bull shit HF...that has no relevance to the timing ...nor, does it really have anything to say about the pain of child birth....I think the victorians finally put that one to bed Laughing
the sorrow mentioned are the cares and worries of parenthood and the sorrow of knowing you will die and leave them to fend for themselves....

nut as I said it beasr NO relevance to the timing...

and there is nothing and NO_ONE else mentioned as being cast out at that time...

you are building a boat out of grass...


surely if there were others i.e adam and eve had children before being cast out this would have been mentioned...since your god is so fond of multigenerational curses, despite his admonishment not to visit the sins of the father upon the sons....

you are proven wrong....

its all your opinion and your interpretation........and we know what thats worth...

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Post by Guest on Wed Jul 01, 2015 4:43 pm

mentor wrote:bull shit HF...that has no relevance to the timing ...nor, does it really have anything to say about the pain of child birth....I think the victorians finally put that one to bed Laughing
the sorrow mentioned are the cares and worries of parenthood and the sorrow of knowing you will die and leave them to fend for themselves....

nut as I said it beasr NO relevance to the timing...

and there is nothing and NO_ONE else mentioned as being cast out at that time...

you are building a boat out of grass...


surely if there were others i.e adam and eve had children before being cast out this would have been mentioned...since your god is so fond of multigenerational curses, despite his admonishment not to visit the sins of the father upon the sons....

you are proven wrong....

its all your opinion and your interpretation........and we know what thats worth...



i didn't think you would work it out, read it slowly and try to think, I know it is asking a lot but try.....

let me help an "increase" in pain in child birth............... Smile


perhaps you can get it now....

"new balls please" vic has just had his removed..... don't you just love wimbledon.... Smile




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Post by Guest on Wed Jul 01, 2015 4:55 pm

heavenlyfatheragain wrote:
mentor wrote:bull shit HF...that has no relevance to the timing ...nor, does it really have anything to say about the pain of child birth....I think the victorians finally put that one to bed Laughing
the sorrow mentioned are the cares and worries of parenthood and the sorrow of knowing you will die and leave them to fend for themselves....

nut as I said it beasr NO relevance to the timing...

and there is nothing and NO_ONE else mentioned as being cast out at that time...

you are building a boat out of grass...


surely if there were others i.e adam and eve had children before being cast out this would have been mentioned...since your god is so fond of multigenerational curses, despite his admonishment not to visit the sins of the father upon the sons....

you are proven wrong....

its all your opinion and your interpretation........and we know what thats worth...



i didn't think you would work it out, read it slowly and try to think, I know it is asking a lot but try.....

let me help an "increase" in pain in child birth............... Smile


perhaps you can get it now....

"new balls please" vic has just had his removed..... don't you just love wimbledon.... Smile




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erm...I will greatly multiply thy sorrow and thy conception
In sorrow thou shalt bring forth children
and thy desire shall be to thy husband
and he shall rule over thee...


erm...sorrow.....

and in any case ...where are the rest of them that get thrown out then??


you really are a prat...you even misinterpret what you use as your source...


AND even IF and i do say IF Eve was capable of pain in child birth BEFORE they were cast out it DOES not and cannot be held to show that she in fact DID have any children whilst IN the garden of eden...

indeed were such to be the case it must surely have been recorded as such??

(of course we know that genesis is an iron age thinkers attempt to explain the inexplicable, based on past and older myths but hey ho)

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Post by Guest on Wed Jul 01, 2015 5:17 pm

mentor wrote:
heavenlyfatheragain wrote:



i didn't think you would work it out, read it slowly and try to think, I know it is asking a lot but try.....

let me help an "increase" in pain in child birth............... Smile


perhaps you can get it now....

"new balls please" vic has just had his removed..... don't you just love wimbledon.... Smile




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erm...I will greatly multiply thy sorrow and thy conception
In sorrow thou shalt bring forth children
and thy desire shall be to thy husband
and he shall rule over thee...


erm...sorrow.....

and in any case ...where are the rest of them that get thrown out then??


you really are a prat...you even misinterpret what you use as your source...


AND even IF and i do say IF Eve was capable of pain in child birth BEFORE they were cast out it DOES not and cannot be held to show that she in fact DID have any children whilst IN the garden of eden...

indeed were such to be the case it must surely have been recorded as such??

(of course we know that genesis is an iron age thinkers attempt to explain the inexplicable, based on past and older myths but hey ho)


you almost worked it but but your bias said no it must mean something else.... Smile


like they say, you can take a kid to school but he still might come home stupid.... Smile








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Post by nicko on Wed Jul 01, 2015 5:35 pm

I'v got a record by GENESIS, it's a bit worn but plays ok. Why all this arguing about Adam/Eve and who believes what? If you believe in god and all his works what harm does it do to those who don't believe?,and if you don't believe what harm does it do you?. Lets have a bit of give and take on here, if you don't believe in the words of the bible why take the piss out of those who do? Personly I think the Bible and the Koran are bollocks and all religions are bollocks too. BUT IF YOU WANT TO BELIEVE no one should take the piss. [hope you can understand all that]
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Post by Guest on Wed Jul 01, 2015 5:54 pm

nicko wrote:I'v got a record by GENESIS,  it's a bit worn but plays ok.        Why all this arguing about Adam/Eve and who believes what?     If you believe in god and all his works what harm does it do to those who don't believe?,and if you don't believe what harm does it do you?.    Lets have a bit of give and take on here,  if you don't believe in the words of the bible why take the piss out of those who do?  Personly I think the Bible and the Koran are bollocks and all religions are bollocks too.   BUT IF YOU WANT TO BELIEVE no one should take the piss.   [hope you can understand all that]

thats fine Nicko, and in general I could hold with that view....UP TO THE POINT where those who follow this kind of thing decide that they can tell other people that they cant/should not have the SAME absolute rights that others in society have and do so in such vile terms...

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Post by Guest on Wed Jul 01, 2015 6:02 pm

mentor wrote:
nicko wrote:I'v got a record by GENESIS,  it's a bit worn but plays ok.        Why all this arguing about Adam/Eve and who believes what?     If you believe in god and all his works what harm does it do to those who don't believe?,and if you don't believe what harm does it do you?.    Lets have a bit of give and take on here,  if you don't believe in the words of the bible why take the piss out of those who do?  Personly I think the Bible and the Koran are bollocks and all religions are bollocks too.   BUT IF YOU WANT TO BELIEVE no one should take the piss.   [hope you can understand all that]

thats fine Nicko, and in general I could hold with that view....UP TO THE POINT where those who follow this kind of thing decide that they can tell other people that they cant/should not have the SAME absolute rights that others in society have and do so in such vile terms...

exactly, who do these gays think they are telling normal folk we must accept them as normal and natural.... Smile





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Post by Guest on Wed Jul 01, 2015 6:09 pm

heavenlyfatheragain wrote:
mentor wrote:

erm...I will greatly multiply thy sorrow and thy conception
In sorrow thou shalt bring forth children
and thy desire shall be to thy husband
and he shall rule over thee...


erm...sorrow.....

and in any case ...where are the rest of them that get thrown out then??


you really are a prat...you even misinterpret what you use as your source...


AND even IF and i do say IF Eve was capable of pain in child birth BEFORE they were cast out it DOES not and cannot be held to show that she in fact DID have any children whilst IN the garden of eden...

indeed were such to be the case it must surely have been recorded as such??

(of course we know that genesis is an iron age thinkers attempt to explain the inexplicable, based on past and older myths but hey ho)


you almost worked it but but your bias said no it must mean something else.... Smile


like they say, you can take a kid to school but he still might come home stupid.... Smile









]

I love it when someone "pretends" to know some "secret"

Its called pissing in the wind.....

there were NO others bar adam and eve BEFORE the expulsion

otherwise this would have been noted ...and it isnt...there are not even "hidden clues" to it

Lets look...

Gen ch3 v 22

and the lord god said, behold the man is become one of us........

now...one of us???

he also said THE man...singular ...as opposed to man (the collective)
nor does it say "men have become....."

besides

"one of US" ?????????????????????

US being ...what exactly?

so HF

NO others except adam and eve BEFORE the expulsion....

and no evidence written in the bible......

more particularly, there is no mention in the bible of the inevitable interpaly that there would have been, had there been another line present outside of the garden of eden when adam and eve were ejected....



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Post by Guest on Wed Jul 01, 2015 6:10 pm

heavenlyfatheragain wrote:
mentor wrote:

thats fine Nicko, and in general I could hold with that view....UP TO THE POINT where those who follow this kind of thing decide that they can tell other people that they cant/should not have the SAME absolute rights that others in society have and do so in such vile terms...

exactly, who do these gays think they are telling normal folk we must accept them as normal and natural.... Smile








you get my point Nicko... Rolling Eyes

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Post by Guest on Wed Jul 01, 2015 6:12 pm

mentor wrote:
heavenlyfatheragain wrote:


you almost worked it but but your bias said no it must mean something else.... Smile


like they say, you can take a kid to school but he still might come home stupid.... Smile









]

I love it when someone "pretends" to know some "secret"

Its called pissing in the wind.....

there were NO others bar adam and eve BEFORE the expulsion

otherwise this would have been noted ...and it isnt...there are not even "hidden clues" to it

Lets look...

Gen ch3 v 22

and the lord god said, behold the man is become one of us........

now...one of us???

he also said THE man...singular ...as opposed to man (the collective)
nor does it say "men have become....."

besides

"one of US" ?????????????????????

US being ...what exactly?

so HF

NO others except adam and eve BEFORE the expulsion....

and no evidence written in the bible......

more particularly, there is no mention in the bible of the inevitable interpaly that there would have been, had there been another line present outside of the garden of eden when adam and eve were ejected....



I'm sure you know more about pissing in to the wind than most vic... Smile

so how would eve know that the pain of birth would increase....??/

bit of a quandary eh.... Smile Smile







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Post by Guest on Wed Jul 01, 2015 6:47 pm

not at all HF

firstly its "sorrow" not "pain"

that aside, given that they had just eaten from the tree of knowlege (whether "general or more specifically "of good and ill)

she would have known that child birth is painful

HOWEVER

there is NO certainty that increase in this instance means from some definite level to a greater OR from nothing to something

the translation you know is NOT always perfect...

now...where is the evidence that more than 2 were expelled, after all that would make a huge difference to subsequent passages


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Post by Guest on Wed Jul 01, 2015 7:18 pm

mentor wrote:not at all HF

firstly its "sorrow" not "pain"

that aside, given that they had just eaten from the tree of knowlege (whether "general or more specifically "of good and ill)

she would have known that child birth is painful

HOWEVER

there is NO certainty that increase in this instance means from some definite level to a greater OR from nothing to something

the translation you know is NOT always perfect...

now...where is the evidence that more than 2 were expelled, after all that would make a huge difference to subsequent passages


hmmm so ask a woman what does she most remember about giving birth, do you think she will say she felt really sad.... i doubt it, the sorrow means pain.....

if she would know an increase she must have known he pain... so she had had children...

as i said clearly their were people already outside as cain found a wife and feared everyone who met him would kill him...

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Post by Guest on Wed Jul 01, 2015 7:20 pm

So does everyone agree that those in an incestuous relationship should be able to marry and potentially those in a peado relationship if they consent should be able to marry??/

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Post by Guest on Wed Jul 01, 2015 7:27 pm

heavenlyfatheragain wrote:
mentor wrote:not at all HF

firstly its "sorrow" not "pain"

that aside, given that they had just eaten from the tree of knowlege (whether "general or more specifically "of good and ill)

she would have known that child birth is painful

HOWEVER

there is NO certainty that increase in this instance means from some definite level to a greater OR from nothing to something

the translation you know is NOT always perfect...

now...where is the evidence that more than 2 were expelled, after all that would make a huge difference to subsequent passages


hmmm so ask a woman what does she most remember about giving birth, do you think she will say she felt really sad.... i doubt it, the sorrow means pain.....

if she would know an increase she must have known he pain... so she had had children...

as i said clearly their were people already outside as cain found a wife and feared everyone who met him would kill him...

which points clearly to ONLY one thing...

the guy/s who wrote the OT in particular were terrible story tellers...the bible is NOT internally consistant...

in one place it is quite specific that only 2 (adam and eve) were expelled and that these were the progenitors of ALL...
then in another the authour quite forgets this and makes the claims based round cain...

OR he moulds togather 2 stories and forgets to adjust them both to fit...

Once again IF there were more than 2 expelled this would ...must have been noted...

AND idf there were "people" outside eden then where did they come from, since THEIR creation is NOT recorded anywhere?

finally just how many kids did the poor woman have

I mean if cain was afraid that "people" would kill him, that implies that there were a significant number, not merely an extended family....

from this we can deduce that cain was included in the stroy at the wrong place in time

OR (more likely) this is just a creation myth, repackaged to suit its audience......with the attendant errors and omissions that you would expect in such a situation over 4+000 years ago


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Post by Guest on Wed Jul 01, 2015 7:39 pm

heavenlyfatheragain wrote:So does everyone agree that those in an incestuous relationship should be able to marry and potentially those in a peado relationship if they consent should be able to marry??/
given that any genetic considerations can be dealt with, personally I see no reasonable bar to incestuous relationships at some point in the future.

paedo relationships as you call them MUST by any limit of imagination be damaging and potentially seriously harmful to the younger "partner" and therfore absolutely abusive.

the issue is "consent"

in this context "consent" requires full mental maturity, which HAS as its lower limit for age , an age set by law, after consideration by those who are skilled and trained in these matters.

therfore Consent NEVER can be given by those below the age of "majority" in most states and those below the age of 16 (subject to some restrictions) in britain

thyus your question on this is pointless...

the age of consent is NOT something that is negotiable on any terms and the individuals ability to give such consent under such age is not allowed.
this is why sex say with a 15yo is "statutory rape". THE LAW says that person cis not able to give mature informed consent therfore like certain other laws he/she cannot give away that statutory protection.

Whilst you could well argue that some 14 and 15 yo are "well wise beyond their years" and from a purely psychological POV perhaps could give informed consent, the law is there to protect those who could not (the greater majority)
The law cannot (time wise and I suspect from a sound governance POV) make individual exceptions....

so No paedo relationships will NOT at least in the forseeable future ever be acceptable......

nor, for the above reasons do i think that it should.

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